| About Paul's anti-sex attitude, well, he does say in at least one place that he was giving his own point of view, not the Lord's (by this he meant Jesus teaching), so at least he recognised this fact.(I Cor 7, yet he says he has permission.) He was also writing to a Greek thinking audience, and so used their language and philosophy in order to communicate ideas to them. So, Paul understood his limitations. (Yes, I have heard this from many, but the problem is it can not be semantics or language translation, because Paul consistantly has the same anti sex bias. I really don't have a great problem with that because Jesus was not going to correct him, as Jesus had enough problems getting these rather thuick headed apostkles and disciples to see that He was the Messiah. Jesus couldn't turn the whole world upside down from Patriarchy to Equality and to His Messiahship in one feel swoop. Men and women can only hadle so much at one time. For it is only know that the full liberation was meant to come out, so women can teach, preach and love with liberty and equality for ALL. IMO. So I think Jesus knew what He was doing. And did allow Paul to say what he did, and even allow the church system to once again fall into self righteousness and bondage. For freedom is for the few not the many.) But it isn't true to say that he had never met Jesus. Many people say that Paul only had a spiritual vision of Jesus on the Jericho road, but I don't think so because Paul later refers to a period in his life which he spent in Petra, (WHoa...I heard desert, but never Petra, Do tell me where you found this information, because I just posted on Petra, and Ur, and Giza ...the Lord's Prophetic Marker, all being on the Great Original Equator Circle....and besides we return to Petra.... Do tell me this, Gam.) being discipled by the Lord!(Yes in the desert, the Lord through the Holy Spirit did teach him, and the Holy Spirit and Jesus are ONE. But again, Paul didn;t get it all completely reingforced in his heart and mind, and he got prertty shaky on the fundamentals of GRACE over LAW. And actually backslide into law, and compromise in his fall and capture) In other words, Jesus actually spent a few years privately discipling Paul. (Yup, as he had a lot of old indocrination to knock out of Paul.... But Paul was Paul and did have some pride, and did retain his old patriarchy views, and old favour the Jews doctrine, even though he was suppose to see that choice was ULTIMATE and Supreme rather than bloodlines.. .and rather than law obediance, for the new law was love !!) History tells us that Jesus turns up in this way a number of times after his resurrection and ascension. (Yes in person and in disquise, until revelling himself, but afterwards usually just sent the Holy Ghost, and she represented Him thereafter. But as mentioned they are ONE, as she is the teacher...but all students don;t catch all things, otherwise they wouldn;t be men but GOD.) John says that he stood in the presence of Jesus and there is a story that in 70 AD while Jerusalem was under seige by the Romans, Jesus himself turns up and leads the local Messianic community out of the city to safety, again to the city of Petra. (Awesome, as again pray tell where you found out this information. Ha, for the Christians were told way back at His Rise to Heaven, to go into all the world and not stay in Jerusalem... and yet it took persecution afetr persecution to get them to obey. And amazingly He must have had mercy on them even before the Roman prophecy was fulfilled in 70 A.D. But again, Gam Bro, I entreat you, now's that for I nice biblical word, could you forward me these references concerning Petra, because we go to Petra, as the Lord has said in Prophecy. WE flee to the wilderness, the Rock City of Petra, a Chriostos Angle down from Jersulaem, justt like our ancestors... .. but we being the MAJOR FULFILLMENT, because we are the LAST Christians.) Many of the Gnostic and other non-cannonical writers often use euphanisms like "the Lord was with us" or such to refer to times where Jesus actually turns up. (You got it, as He literally is in the miodst of us, when two or three are gathered together, so how much more when 144,000 are GATHERED in Him.) The idea that after Jesus assension that he was just gone doesn't really have credibility in the end. (Amen, as we can see Him in dreams and visions, and in person, and sometimes surely also in disguise, so we better be faithful and true to His LOVE.) But it is still true to say that Paul had serious faults, as did the other apostles themselves, (Yup, but nevertheless, they finnally got the message and everyone that Jesus selected, even the men (not just the twelve women apostles) did go all the way for Him and did give their whole, lives for Him. This is our encouragement we don't have to be perfect, neither do we have to know everything, just give it all for JESUS til the End, even if at the mid point we are a bit more reserved. Its how we END. Onward Christian Soldiers) who continued to have problems with xenophobia (You rascal, now I have to look up that word) and sexism as well especially James, Jesus brother, who was still a leader of the circumcision faction. (Good one as I just read about him the other day, and Yes, unfortunately he was Jewish oriented, and not quite into Salvation by Grace... but very well could have been the lineage of Joseph that was promised to King David of Old...a different but connecting topic) Another factor to consider is the way that redactors and translators, who had stronger Greek prejudices than Paul, would translate his words. The same applies to modern translators, such as those who produced the King James version (1688) who gave us certain English words which have stuck. The word "flesh" is such a word. In the Greek, the word is actually a number of words put together, and rather than refering to the physical body itself, it is refering to the corruption of sin that exists within us and ultimately causes us to be mortal. The fact that translators use the single word "flesh" for a much more complex idea, is that it was the translators, not Paul who had the anti-body bias. (Yes, but that doesn't explain, Pauls other commandments concerning women and widows that were not of the Lord....but of Paul and pro patriarchy. But as mentioned I think the Lord allowed it, because they had enough liberation on their plate at one time, and probably couldn't stomach or diogest much more. ) Of course, there is also the general issue of "Biblidolitry" that many Biblical literalists suffer from. They who worship the legalistic interpretations of the literal scriptures will be acting idolatrously because they are giving something which is not God the attributes of God. (Yup, that is modern language for Amen) The Bible is good, it is the record of people who have in many different ways met with God (Jesus) and God (Jesus)speaks to us in its pages, but we are to listen to God, (Yeshua) worship God alone. (Yahweh) (Amen ) The fact is that even these so-called literalists are no such thing, because even they twist the Bible to fit their preconceived doctrines and biases. (I reckon it is literal when it is literal and symbolic when symbolic, and always trying to get across a precept and principle to be applied for all situations to all generations. As I like literal and specific when the Lord specifies literal and specific places like Petra...and gives us the literal and specific time frames). So, while I'm not excusing Paul from his errors and personal biases, it isn't just his fault that we have a distorted religion called Christianity that I think Jesus wouldn't recognise as his own. (Preach it brother, as just as the Jewish priesthood missed the point and ther laws of the Lord, so has the Christian scribe and pharisidical priesthood missed the point and the Lord's Law of Love. But then again, it is not for the many but for the few, as the great High Priest Ezra noted and stated and was taught. The Lord blerss Paul despite his errors, as he did a fantastic job, and had great courage. Never underestimate little guys with lots of guts and courage. You can NOT keep a good man down. And so they beat him and warned him, and that fiesty bro, just went back IN and blasted'em again and again. This is Pauls greatest legacy, Courage, GRACE and SOULS, in strating the first real churches of believers, for they also had to have great courage and FAITH just to enter IN) Blessings, Gam (And to you Gam, for your tremendous response from the heart and your rersearch} |
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