Interview: THE SONS OF T.C.-LETHBRIDGE

    T.C.-Lethbridge once said, “It is worth throwing a stone into a pool to see what moves in it.” An explorer, psychic researcher, archaeologist, and respected writer, T.C.-Lethbridge moved the intellectuals and scientists during his time. He left a marvelous legacy of work in his books and his studies. 30 years, he was the Director of Excavations for the Cambridge Antiquarian Society and for the University Museum of Archaeology and Ethnology. He was also Keeper of Anglo-Saxon Antiquities at the Archaeological Museum in Cambridge. As a writer and scientist, he was one of the first to honestly and scientifically study the occult, witches, and paranormal activity. He wrote a plethora of books. His work includes Ghost And The Ghoul, A Step In The Dark, The Power Of The Pendulum, Witches, The Monkey’s Tail, and Gogmagog: The Buried Gods. Even though he passed away in 1971, his work has inspired many artists and musicians. In 2004, a group of inspired musicians joined together to form The Sons Of T.C.-Lethbridge. This group was made of Doggen Foster (of Spiritualized), Welbourn Tekh (from Sinking Ships), and Kevlar Bales (of Brain Donor). The “Sons” do not end there. Other “Sons” include Julian Cope, Colin Wilson, Ben Edwards, Stephen Coalwood, Darren Smith, Echoboy, and a myriad of others. The “Sons” were so inspired by T.C.-Lethbridge’s work that they released a double CD set called “A Giant: The Definitive T.C-Lethbridge” on Aegir Recording Company. The first disc (or “Phase One”) is a psychedelic masterpiece of groovy, atmospheric guitars and cinematic synths to create “proto-metal” and “trouble funk”. The second disc (or “Phase Two”) has the writer and philosopher, Colin Wilson, telling us stories and anecdotes of T.C.-Lethbridge’s life and his encounters. Writer of The Outsider and The Occult, Colin Wilson’s soothing accent is accentuated by a backdrop of psychedelic ambient music provided by Doggen, Templar, and Tekh. Besides the audio portion, “A Giant” also contains a 33 page book with essays by Julian Cope, Colin Wilson and Welbourn Tekh. On a warm Autumn evening, I had a chance to interview both Tekh and Doggen. The “Sons” are not just using Lethbridge’s name to be cool or as a gimmick. They are true admirers and students of his work. They have intense knowledge of his rhetoric and subject matter. For those of you with a belief or interest in ghosts, poltergeists, telepathy, second sight, or the occult, explore the music of The Sons Of T.C.-Lethbridge and explore the written works of their father, T.C.-Lethbridge. Like the rock, thrown into the pool, see their work moves inside you. The “Sons” are not just musicians. They are like mystic scientists who are continuing where Lethbridge left off. In their song “'T.C.L.E.T.H.B.R.I.D.G.E'”, they quote Lethbridge’s book The Ghost and Ghoul. Lethbridge wrote, “No spoken or written word can be a substitute for one’s own practical experience. No one too can convince another who does not wish to believe what he is told. Only the doubter loses by his incredulity.” The Sons Of T.C.-Lethbridge are believers and they moving the waters in the pool just like T.C.-Lethbridge did when he was alive.

T.JONES: "What goes on?"
TEKH: “Doggen has just completed his tour supporting Julian Cope, with his band Dogntank and they have plans to record an album in the coming months. Kevlar and his wife, Gill, just had a new baby. They named the baby Leon, so he literally has got his hands full at the moment. I have been recording some new spoken-word numbers over at our ‘Mouse House’ studio in Nottingham. Not sure in what form these tracks will be presented yet, but they are a real family affair and feature all of The Sons of T.C.-Lethbridge and their auxiliaries. There is also a spoken word project on the go that features the words of the writer Stan Gooch. As you may well have noticed, I edit ‘The Sons of T.C.-Lethbridge’ web site and post new, Lethbridge related essays each month. So, busy times.”

T.JONES: “The brand new debut album by The Sons Of T.C. Lethbridge is called ‘A Giant’. Tell us about it.”
TEKH: “Not so brand-new now – on 1st November 2004, it will have been out for a whole year. It was Colin Wilson who first championed Lethbridge in his 1978 publication Mysteries. Both Mysteries and Lethbridge’s approach and methodology made a big impression on both Julian Cope and myself. It was therefore deemed appropriate that at some stage,we would take up Colin’s lead and further the Lethbridgian cause. Doggen and Kevlar were already on a Lethbridgian odyssey when I met them, so it was just a case of taking this trip one step further. Lethbridge would have hated the idea of people patronizing him, but what he would have appreciated, is that his ideas and approach were inspiring others to achieve. By adopting, what I call a Lethbridgian approach, we are continuing the mantle of a Gnostic odyssey with little regard for others who had made up their minds without ‘going there’ for themselves. Lethbridge might not have liked our music, but I’m sure he would have appreciated the context in which we are working. All of the incidental sounds on ‘A Giant’ e.g. ‘The Golden Ball Wood’ and ‘Ladram Bay’ recordings, were made at the actual sites – again exemplifying the act of making the big effort and not settling for compromise. We wanted to create a big impression worthy of Lethbridge, therefore getting Colin on board was crucial. Also, who as ever heard of a new band releasing what is equivalent to a treble album as their first release?”

T.JONES: “Can you explain the difference between Phase One and Phase Two?”
TEKH: “There are three phases really – the two CDs and the essays. The two CDs are intrinsically linked, although very different in approach. We wanted to create a platform for Colin Wilson’s words, so we considered his fan-base and decided that it was important to separate Colin’s contributions from what we considered to be our ‘rock’ disc. The essays in the booklet and both CDs need to be appreciated as a whole. It doesn’t really matter which you absorb first, whichever takes your fancy. It was always our hope that Lethbridge’s enthusiasm, that initially inspired us, would rub off on to the listener.”

T.JONES: “How long did it take to make?”
TEKH: “It took about two years from start to finish, but recording was geared to fit in around Doggen and Kevlar’s Spiritualized commitments.”

T.JONES: “Is there a deeper meaning to the title ‘A Giant’?”
TEKH: “Well, In our eyes, Thomas Charles Lethbridge was a giant of a man and of course there is a direct reference to Gogmagog and the hillside, chalk-cut figures that he discovered on the banks of the Wandlebury hill-fort south of Cambridge.”

T.JONES: “Favorite song?”
TEKH: “In Phase 1, it has got to be ‘Sleeping Giant’. This was the first song we recorded together and the last one to be finished. In Phase 2, it is most definitely ‘Interest in the Sky’. When I assembled this track with Stephen Coalwood, we both realized that we were onto something special. We edited the pauses into Colin’s narration, which kind of adds to the incredible space that exists within the track – magic.
KEVLAR: “‘Halangy Downer’.”
DOGGEN: “‘Sleeping Giant’.”

T.JONES: “What song took the longest to do?”
TEKH: “The song ‘Sleeping Giant’. There must be at least a dozen mixes of this track! It was Doggen’s final mix that was eventually used. It was a challenging task for Greg Marshall who mastered the track. It probably still gives him nightmares! But what a mix! About 30 seconds into the track, before the drums kick in, there is a woman’s scream that leads into the change. Doggen and I were recording a guitar loop on a DAT when this voice, from a previous recording on the tape appeared and by shear coincidence, was in time with the track and corresponded with the change. It was a freaky stroke of luck. It totally blew us away.”

T.JONES: “How did The Sons Of T.C.-Lethbridge come together to form a group?”
TEKH: “It was Julian Cope’s idea really. Previously, Doggen and Kevlar had been part of the group T.C. Lethbridge who had released two albums, ‘Moon Equipped’ and ‘Mina’. Julian was aware of my interest in Lethbridge and with the departure of Gary Mitchell (aka Flinton Chalk) from the group, he suggested to Doggen and Kevlar that I would be a suitable replacement. When we all met up, it kind of just clicked. The story of our meeting can be found in an essay entitled ‘A Strange Day’ Tekh’s Journal on our web-site.”

T.JONES: “When did you first begin to read the writing of Lethbridge?”
TEKH: “Templar Brighton introduced me to the work of Colin Wilson in about 1986 and the first non-fictional book of his that I read was Mysteries. Part one of this epic work focuses on the works of T.C.-Lethbridge and it was from this introduction that I started to search out Lethbridge’s books. This introduction was coincidental with my discovery of Avebury and these two discoveries set me off on a Lethbridgian odyssey around the megalithic sites of Britain.”

T.JONES: “How have his writing inspired you or changed your outlook on things?”
TEKH: “Most definitely. Many in the past have disputed Lethbridge’s findings and discoveries, but no one can dispute his sound methodology and approach. His devotion to primary research is crucial to his philosophy. His un-dogmatic approach has proved to be the inspirational factor in my own work.”

T.JONES: “Do you have a favorite book by Lethbridge?”
TEKH: “This is a difficult one to call. I guess if I had to pick one, it would have to be ESP – Beyond Time and Distance, but I do have a soft spot for Boats and Boatmen just for the shear uniqueness and the attention to detail. Lethbridge’s ability to focus on one aspect of mankind’s evolution enables us to perceive the boatman’s role in our history.”

T.JONES: “Does Lethbridge have any living family members? What do they think of the album?”
TEKH: “Funny you should ask this! At the moment, a good friend of ours, in fact a guy who will soon be inaugurated as a ‘Sons of T.C.-Lethbridge Auxiliary’, Jonathan Rhys Jones, has been undertaking research into this very subject. We hope to publish his findings in the near future.”

T.JONES: “How did you hook up with Julian Cope and what was he like?”
TEKH: “I met Julian outside Stones Café in Avebury in 1996. As I previously mentioned, I had discovered Avebury by chance in 1988 and this had triggered my odyssey of visiting prehistoric sites around Britain. I have always been a fan of Julian Cope and it came as a pleasant surprise when I came across a newspaper article which featured a photo of Julian standing in front of the Devil’s Den on Fairfeild Down, spouting off about megaliths and reading Colin Wilson. I immediately realized that we were both on the same head-trip and we were destined to meet at sometime. In fact, as I traveled around the megalithic sites of Britain, I often met up with people who informed me that Julian had just been there or was due there very soon. We kept missing each other by days! So when I eventually came across him at Avebury, our meeting was such that we had plenty to discuss and much in common.”

T.JONES: “Julian Cope collaborated with you on 2 songs. How were those 2 songs created? What was the creative process like?”
TEKH: “Julian is a quick worker. There’s no hanging around when he’s on a roll. He’s also very decisive and the songs that he was involved with happened very quickly. I learnt a lot on those days!”

T.JONES: “Do you have a favorite kind of Instrument?”
TEKH: “My Yamaha bass.”
DOGGEN: “Les Paul ’57 Gold Top.”
KEVLAR: “Gretsch drums.”

T.JONES: “What is the name of that guitar on the cover?”
TEKH: “The guitar on the cover of ‘A Giant’ is a Yamaha bass. Although there appears to be two guitars, it is just the same one reversed and treated in Adobe Photoshop. I bought it off my mate’s dad a few years back and he told me that it was a proto-type built in the mid 1960s. Apparently, it used to belong to the bass player of The Merseybeats, but I don’t have any proof of this. It has a most amazing sound and at some stage in its history, someone has added a second pick-up. Unfortunately their installation technique was a bit gash, but they obviously knew what they were doing sonically.”

T.JONES: “Will there be another LP? If so, what sound are you going for? What will it be called? Will it be on the same label?”
TEKH: “Yeah, there will definitely be another release in the future. Maybe it will be an extended E.P. We have a few tracks that didn’t make it on to ‘A Giant’. It was not because they weren’t any good, just that they weren’t finished in time. One of these ‘Shudy Camps’, is currently work-in-progress. The Aegir Recording Company Ltd. (ARC Ltd.) is our own label, which we established to release our own and associated material. We chose the name ‘Aegir’ because it is the name of the tidal wave that travels up the river Trent. It is also known as the Trent Bore. As I live in Lincolnshire and Doggen & Kevlar live in Nottinghamshire, we decided that the Aegir was a natural occurrence that both counties shared. It was a kind of union. Aegir was the Norse God of the Sea and he is also known as Hler and Gymir. He has nine daughters, who are also waves.”

T.JONES: “Phase 2 has many interesting spoken word tracks by Colin Wilson. How did you hook up with him and what was that collaboration like?”
TEKH: “Since we discovered his books in the 1980s, Templar Brighton and myself always intended to track him down at some point. In 1998, Templar wrote a letter to him and Colin responded by giving him a call and invited us both down to visit him at his home in Gorran Haven, Cornwall. Since that meeting, we have endeavored to visit Colin and his wife Joy on a regular basis, maybe once or twice a year. Colin is a very generous man and has always been supportive of our efforts on the Lethbridge front. Colin even proof-read my (as yet unpublished book) book Field-Notes From A Western World and provided me with sound advice and criticism, which I am still incorporating and taking onboard.”

T.JONES: “In the next release, will Colin Wilson do more spoken word? If not, what author would take his Colin Wilson’s place?”
TEKH: “Colin has an amazing voice. It is so relaxed and natural, a real contrast to my holler. I would like to think that Colin would be up for working on another Lethbridge project in the future. In fact, I must put it to him.”
 
T.JONES: “What other artists / bands inspired you?
TEKH: “I have been listening to music since I was a kid and still continue to be inspired by bands both past and present. I am still discovering bands that I missed in my youth. For example, Clear Blue Sky, T2, The Guess Who, as well as current bands like Transmissionary Six, Bobby Conn and the Glass Gypsies, and Boredoms. There really is so much good stuff out there still to be discovered. We live in exciting times!”
KEVLAR: “The Meters, The Band, but best band of all time? It’s got to be The Rolling Stones.”
DOGGEN: “Led Zeppelin, Black Sabbath, and The 13th Floor Elevators.”

T.JONES: “Do you believe in ghosts?”
TEKH: “I guess in true Lethbridgian mode, it would be wrong to dismiss anything that hasn’t been disproved. So yes, indeed.”

T.JONES: “What was the last supernatural experience you encountered?”
TEKH: “I guess it was about a year ago. I was driving along the Ermine Street towards Ancaster in Lincolnshire with Katie, my 10 year-old stepdaughter. We were overtaken by a white car. I was surprised when it overtook us, because I’d only just checked my mirrors and the road behind us was clear. The car pulled in front of us and we followed it for a few minutes and then, it just disappeared! We both saw it and I couldn’t provide Katie with a plausible explanation, apart from the fact that the world ain’t so straightforward as it apparently appears! Before this experience, I guess the previous one was the ‘timeslip’ I experienced on Big Moor in Derbyshire, which is re-countered on the track ‘F.U.S.? (Fixed Universal Scale?)’ on Phase One of ‘A Giant’.”

T.JONES: “Do you believe in UFOs or aliens?”
TEKH: “Yes. Like ghosts, UFOs exist in other dimensions or operate in alternative vibrational rates. It is the mind, as distinct from brain, that enables us to reach or connect with them at times. As physical entities, then no. I guess alternative life forms must exist somewhere out there. Mustn’t they?”

T.JONES: “Favorite drugs?”
DOGGEN: “Tea and sympathy!”
KEVLAR: “No!”
TEKH: “Red Bull, Real Ale and, of course - Tea!”

T.JONES: “What has been in your CD player or on your turntable these days?”
TEKH: “Well, this week, I’ve been listening to The Sensational Alex Harvey Band ‘SAHB Stories’, Slade, ‘Slayed?’, Boredoms ‘Vision Creation Newsun’, Main ‘Hydracalm’, Twink ‘Think Pink’, Hair and Skin Trading Co. ‘Lava Surf Kunst’, Antronhy’s re-mix of T.C. Lethbridge’s ‘Mina’ and Andy Penny’s dance mixes of one of our new tracks ‘Duir – The Stout Guardian of The Door’.”
DOGGEN: “Twink ‘Think Pink’ on a mini-disk that Tekh recorded for me. Millie Jackson ‘Caught Up’ and ‘Fair Warning’ by Van Halen.”
KEVLAR: “The Bees ‘Free the Bees’. What a band! We played on the same night as them at Glastonbury this year. They were amazing. I have also been listening to ‘You got my mind messed up’ by James Carr and the Uncle Tupelo ‘Anthology’. Uncle Tuppelo featured Jeff Tweedy from Wilco.”

T.JONES: “Are the lyrics and the vocal melodies written first or is the music written first?”
TEKH: “There is no real formula, but we always entered the studio with a number of ideas, be they words, lyrics or riffs.”

T.JONES: “What do you think of the U.S. involvement in the Middle East?”
TEKH: “Their involvement is purely selfish – business, oil… but they are so blatant about it. They don’t really care if they know that they have been sussed. On the other hand, who the f*ck knows why we (the UK) got involved? It baffles me.”

T.JONES: “Where were you on September 11th, the terrorist attack? How did you deal with it? How do you think it has affected music?”
TEKH: “September 11th 2001 was the day that I first met Doggen and Kevlar. It was also the day I introduced Julian Cope to Colin Wilson. What a f*cking day that was! I suggest that I provide you with the link to me essay ‘A Strange Day’. 
http://www.tc-lethbridge.com/tekhs_journal/?id=3&offset=10 You can read the full low-down there. I can’t say that those events have affected our music, but I guess it has installed in us all, a sense of urgency to achieve. Who knows what sh*t lies around the corner?”

T.JONES: “Abortion. Pro-life or pro-choice?”
TEKH: “This is too complex an issue to deal with in a straight yes and no scenario. It is indeed a difficult one. I can empathize with both viewpoints. Does it sound like I’m sitting on the fence? Well I guess I am. Fortunately, I have never had to make such a decision. My heart goes out to those who have to do so. I would never wish to judge another’s decision on such a personal matter.”

T.JONES: “Death penalty. For or against?”
TEKH: “Sometimes I think the world would be better off without some of the evil bastards that walk the planet, but who decides who should live and who should die? When I was younger, the difference between right and wrong was always seemed so very clear, but now I question everything and sometimes struggle to understand what is the truth? Who supervises the judge and jury? I guess it boils down to who is the man, who pays the man, who pays the ferryman?”

T.JONES: “What is the biggest mistake you have made in your career?”
TEKH: “I guess when you look back at stuff you’ve recorded, you always think, ‘I could do it better now’, but I guess this proves that you are evolving and developing. I guess the thing is to be always proud of your achievements, but never be complacent. ‘A Giant’ was the first time I had approached spoken word. It was a steep learning curve. I really like the declamatory style – you know, shouting from the fucking rooftops approach, as sometimes, this is the only way to be heard in this chaotic world.”

T.JONES: “What is the biggest misconception about you?”
TEKH: “I don’t think we are well known enough to have people develop conceptions about us - let alone misconceptions! People are always asking, ‘when are you going to release an album, do a tour etc?’, but they maybe don’t realize that we do this stuff in our spare time. Both Doggen and Kevlar are full-time members of Spiritualized, which is a big commitment in itself and I work full-time as a graphic designer. We all have young families and sometimes just getting the three of us together in the same room is a major achievement!”

T.JONES: “What is your live show like?”
TEKH: “We’ve only ever done one – ‘Rome Wasn’t Burned In A Day’ on 1st November 2003. From our point of view, it was an achievement.”

T.JONES: “How had your live show evolved?”
TEKH: “It is very difficult for us to perform live, what with our other commitments; Spiritualized, work etc…. The Sons of T.C.-Lethbridge are a transient collective that exists in-between the gaps in the ether!”

T.JONES: “What is your favorite part of your live show?”
TEKH: “I liked the spoken word bit that featured on the trippy bit of the live version of Halangy Downer. The words are about a walk on a stormy night to Bant’s Carn on St. Mary’s (Isles of Scilly). The words unravel and the audience joins me on my walk, not knowing where I’m heading. I really enjoy the idea of taking people with me.”

T.JONES: “Word association. I am going to say the name of a group, artist, or famous person and you say the first word that pops into your head. So, if I said ‘The Beatles’, you may say ‘John Lennon’ or ‘Let It Be’. Ok?”

T.JONES: “Julian Cope.”
TEKH: “Bless his cotton socks.”

T.JONES: “George Clinton.”
TEKH: “Free Yemen and Iraq will follow.”

T.JONES: “Gil-Scott Heron.”
TEKH: “Free Will-he.”

T.JONES: “Jamiroqaui.”
TEKH: “Twat in a hat.”

T.JONES: “Jay-Z.”
TEKH: “Blue Jay Way?”

T.JONES: “Echo & The Bunnymen.”
TEKH: “They once shone so hard.”

T.JONES: “Eminem.”
TEKH: “Der der de du du.”

T.JONES: “The Stone Roses.”
TEKH: “Let them bloom again in spring.”

T.JONES: “Happy Mondays.”
TEKH: “I don’t like Mondays.”

T.JONES: “Public Enemy.”
TEKH: “The music that they constantly play, says nothing about me, or my life.”

T.JONES: “The Beatles.”
TEKH: “Once there was a way.”

T.JONES: “The Rolling Stones.”
TEKH: “Riffy.”

T.JONES: “George Bush.”
TEKH: “Stiffy.”

T.JONES: “Are you a fan of Julian Cope’s music? What is your favorite song? Favorite album?”
TEKH: “Very much so. My favorite track is ‘Torch’, track 3 on the “Planetary Sit-In” CD, I just love the melody. My favorite album is ‘Jehovahkill’.”
KEVLAR: “My favorite Cope track is ‘East Easy Rider’ and my favorite Cope album is ‘Peggy Suicide’.”
DOGGEN: “My favorite Cope track is ‘Crazy Farm Animal’, a b-side of China Doll and my favorite album is ‘Jehovahkill’.”

T.JONES: “What is next for you?”
TEKH: “There is going to be a Dogntank album next year. Also, the tracks we have just recently recorded will be released, but under what name we are not yet sure. Doggen and Kevlar will still be Spiritualizing and I believe Julian is planning an electric tour next year. I am in the process of putting together a ‘Lethbridge companion’, which will feature essays by Colin Wilson and myself. We will be looking to publish this in the near future. I would also like to see the publication of my book Field Notes From A Western World, but you have to appreciate, these things take time, because in between these projects, we have to earn a living!”

T.JONES: “What releases should we look out for? Remixes? New albums?”
TEKH: “There are a few things that we would like to release. After the release of ‘A Giant’, I compiled a double CD ‘Sticks and Stones’ which comprised of out-takes, demos, alternative takes and instrumental, remixed backing tracks from Phase Two. It would be great to release some of these tracks in the future. We also received a mini-disk recording of our ‘Rome Wasn’t Burned In A Day’ performance last year from a guy called Richard Hayward, who recorded the gig from the audience. The quality is excellent and with a bit of tampering, it too would make a suitable release.”

T.JONES: “What do you want on your epitaph (your gravestone)?”
TEKH: “I guess no one can beat Spike Milligan’s ‘I told them I was ill’, but seriously I guess something along the lines that we made a difference or at least inspired others to achieve.”

T.JONES: “Any final words for the people who will be reading this?”
TEKH: “Yeah – Keep checking out the web-site, which is updated on the 15th (or thereabouts) of each month www.tc-lethbridge.com and, oh yes, and if you haven’t got it already, please buy the album!”