1966 Mustang 2+2, 99 Ranger Sport


Registered: April 2001
Location: Blacksburg and Madison Heights, VA

I need pictures ('65-'66 5-speed guys)

This is bothering the absolute hell out of me. It's 1:20 AM and I have math due in the morning, and all I can think about is this dumb transmission. You probably saw one of my many other threads, but just in case you didn't, I put a tremec 3550 in my '66 and it's too tall. It doesn't fit far enough up in the tunnel, and causes everything to lean back way too much. It's causing oil problems, trans fluid problems, and even ground clearance problems because the headers hang lower.

I'm thinking about going to a t-5, but I need to make sure it really will fit better. It looks like it's not as tall as the tremec in the pictures I've seen, and it's definitely not as square on the top. Does anybody have any pics of their transmissions installed? Here's what I've been able to come up with so far. This is a pic of a tremec in a '65-'66; you can see the frame rail for reference:

This is a pic of a t-5 in some mustang, but I can't tell the year or much about the angle.

It looks a little better, but it's hard to tell for sure.

Does anybody else have any good pics of the different transmissions in '65-'66 mustangs? If the t-5 won't fit, I guess I'll have to go to a 4-speed or something. I don't have the resources to be raising the tunnel, and I'm not going to live with my engine being all cockeyed.

__________________
-Jason


1966 Mustang 2+2

302 (Mexican block, bored .030" over)
-reworked crank
-Edelbrock performer RPM cam (224*/234* @ .050")
-Edelbrock performer aluminum heads, 1.900"/1.60" intake/exhaust valves
-Edelbrock performer RPM air-gap intake mmanifold
-Edelbrock performer 600 cfm carb, manuall choke (1406)
-Hedman Elite Hedders, Jet-Hot coated
-Milodan high-volume oil pump/pan
-Complete MSD ignition (Pro-billet distriibutor, 6AL box, Blaster II coil)
-Accel 8mm Super Stock plug wires
-Crane 1.6 roller rockers
-Hays 164-tooth billet flywheel
-ARP everywhere
-Fluidampr Streetdampr
-Carter Street Super fuel pump
-Milodan aluminum water pump
-Speed-pro forged flat-top pistons (9.0:11?) on reworked stock rods
-Cloyes true double roller timing set

Other stuff:
-Tremec 3550 w/ Steeda tri-ax
-Centerforce II 11" clutch and pressure pplate
-Lakewood blowproof scattershield
-JMC Motorsports Hydraulic clutch linkagee
-2.25" exhaust with 50-series delta flowss
-"Street Bandit" suspension kit from NPD (coil springs, sway bars, shocks, rear lowering blocks)


DARKHORSE IS A BUNCH OF MORONS

My car:
http://filebox.vt.edu/users/jpiatt/...1%20(small).jpg

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1966 Ford Mustang


Registered: August 2001
Location: San Lorenzo, CA

VTStang66,

See your original post for my reply...

Erik

__________________
1966 Mustang Fastback - Mine
Muscle Car Project

1966 Mustang Coupe - Dad's
Unrestored in GREAT SHAPE

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1965 Retro-mod Coupe


Registered: July 1999
Location: Carol Stream IL

Well from the angle of your camera its kind of hard to tell how bad the angle was of the trans in the second picture, but in the first, of course it is going to hang like that when you dont have the crossmember holding it up.

Where did you get your crossmember from? To be honest you along with a couple of other people lately are the only people I have ever heard of who have had problems like this.

My crossmember is from Dark Horse Performance (yes everyone says they suck but they were alright to me) and I also did not use a spacer plate I used a shortened input shaft (also DHP) and my original bell housing instead. I should have some pictures down here somewhere, if I can find them I will post them in the next day or so.

__________________
Sit Down!, Shut Up!, and Hold On!

Check out my ride:
http://badboy.stangnet.com

'65 Hardtop, painted w/93 Cobra Teal, Pioneer sounds, 16" Torq-Thrust II's, 245/50 Comp T/A VR4's, 289 engine bored and decked, TRW forged pistons, 9.8:1 compression, Hooker Competition headers, dual 2.25" exhaust w/3-chamber Flowmasters, Edelbrock RPM package: 750cfm carb, Dual-plane manifold, fuel pump, and high flow water pump, MSD Billet distributer and 6A control box, Tremec 3550 transmision w/shortened input shaft, RAM Heavy-duty clutch, 3.55's w/Power-trax, Granada Cross Drilled Disc Brakes, 620 coils w/ 1" drop, Shelby Control Arm drop, 1" front sway bar, Curved Monte Carlo bar, 4.5 mid-eye leafs, 3/4" rear sway bar, KYB shocks, all urethane bushings, and a whole lot more on the way!

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1965 Fastback, 2002 SVT Lightning


Registered: January 2002
Location: Cedar Park, Texas

Coolblue65: I think you are on to something... You stated that you did not use the spacer, you are using a shortened input with your stock bell housing. This would pull the transmission foward about 3/4". This may give you the clearance to install your trans where VT is hitting the cross brace.

Some where I saw a post that someone was claiming that the 3550's fit in some mustangs, but not all. Their comment was that the cross member was located differently on some cars which I find hard to believe seeing how it is not model year dependent.

Your install I believe works because you used the shortened input shaft with the stock bellhousing, where it looks like VT has used a late model scattershield which will also cause problems due to the scattershield's larger size, and the late model input shaft lenght.

Coolblue, what motor mounts are you using? The 65 or 66 style?

John

__________________
Former 2000 Saleen and 1995 Cobra Owner

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1965 Mustang 2+2, 1998 Mustang Coupe


Registered: October 2000
Location: near Oklahoma City, OK

With my FRPP 302 sitting on '66 frame brackets and motor mounts, I use the FRPP T5-Z, '69 351w bell housing, CPC adapter plate and crossmember. These position the T5-Z exactly in the factory transmission cutout hole in my early fastback (Oct 64). The shift plate is at the same height as the transmission tunnel sheet metal and if not for the cutout the shifter would bump the transmission tunnel. I used all California Pony Car parts from NPD.

__________________
GeeGee

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1966 Mustang 2+2, 99 Ranger Sport


Registered: April 2001
Location: Blacksburg and Madison Heights, VA

The trans hangs down like that with the crossmember bolted up too, since it can't go any higher. I looked and my drain plug is level with the output shaft, just like that one. That's with the crossmember underneath it, and it's actually shimmed up about 1/2". I have '69 motor mounts, but I don't think the engine could be any lower either, since it's almost hitting the crossmember and power steering stuff as it is now.

I agree with snakestang, that 3/4" may have moved the middle shifter opening far enough forward for it to clear the brace where mine hits. I don't know, I thought it was hitting by more than 3/4" but that may be the difference. Doesn't matter. I already placed an ad on stangnet trader to get rid of this thing. If anybody has a new or low mileage world class t-5 they want to trade flat-out, let me know.

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65/66 Mustangs-Hardtops


Registered: March 2001
Location: Cookeville, TN

Wow, you sure do give up quick. You might try 65 motor mounts. I went down about 1" when I switched from 66 to 65 mounts.

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1966 Mustang 2+2, 99 Ranger Sport


Registered: April 2001
Location: Blacksburg and Madison Heights, VA

I don't have an inch under the motor. Besides, the c-4 fit just fine with these motor mounts, and didn't lean any at all.

Give up quick, eh? I've been wrestling with this damn thing since December 18. I need to get it done so I can do school work and stop worrying about it all the time and going home every weekend to work on it.

I already have a couple prospects lined up. SN classifieds are surprisingly effective.

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1965 Retro-mod Coupe


Registered: July 1999
Location: Carol Stream IL

SnakeStang65: I use the stock 65 motor mounts

Another thing to take note of, is that 2BAV8 has a Tremec TKO, an aftermarket scattershield, and used the spacer plate. And as far as I know he has reported no problems.

I am sure this is redundant, but your sure your not missing something somewhere? Are your motor mounts broken, that caused my engine to lean bad for awhile.

I just think trying a T-5 is not the answer to this problem you are encountering.

__________________
Sit Down!, Shut Up!, and Hold On!

Check out my ride:
http://badboy.stangnet.com

'65 Hardtop, painted w/93 Cobra Teal, Pioneer sounds, 16" Torq-Thrust II's, 245/50 Comp T/A VR4's, 289 engine bored and decked, TRW forged pistons, 9.8:1 compression, Hooker Competition headers, dual 2.25" exhaust w/3-chamber Flowmasters, Edelbrock RPM package: 750cfm carb, Dual-plane manifold, fuel pump, and high flow water pump, MSD Billet distributer and 6A control box, Tremec 3550 transmision w/shortened input shaft, RAM Heavy-duty clutch, 3.55's w/Power-trax, Granada Cross Drilled Disc Brakes, 620 coils w/ 1" drop, Shelby Control Arm drop, 1" front sway bar, Curved Monte Carlo bar, 4.5 mid-eye leafs, 3/4" rear sway bar, KYB shocks, all urethane bushings, and a whole lot more on the way!

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65/66 Mustangs-Hardtops


Registered: March 2001
Location: Cookeville, TN

quote:

---

Originally posted by coolblue65
SnakeStang65:I just think trying a T-5 is not the answer to this problem you are encountering.

---

__________________
65 Mustang: 5 speed, 3.73's, RAP Ported GT-40 Irons, xe258hr cam, Perf. RPM, 625 cfm Carter AFB, Jacobs ignition
66 Mustang: 289-2V, 3spd, Slipping Clutch, Bashed-up Front End
My current Ebay auctions: http://cgi6.ebay.com/ebaymotors/aw-...ldmustangjunkie

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1966 Mustang 2+2, 99 Ranger Sport


Registered: April 2001
Location: Blacksburg and Madison Heights, VA

quote:

---

Originally posted by oldmustangjunki


Agreed. I have been wrestling with my car for 2.5-3 years now.

---

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65/66 Mustangs-Hardtops


Registered: March 2001
Location: Cookeville, TN

I have a Tremec. I had a T5, but blew it all to hell. I raised the tunnel about 1.5" and the Tremec fit perfectly. I've been wrestling with other problems. The trans was the least of them.

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1966 Mustang 2+2, 99 Ranger Sport


Registered: April 2001
Location: Blacksburg and Madison Heights, VA

quote:

---

Originally posted by oldmustangjunki
I have a Tremec. I had a T5, but blew it all to hell. I raised the tunnel about 1.5" and the Tremec fit perfectly. I've been wrestling with other problems. The trans was the least of them.

---

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65/66 Mustangs-Hardtops


Registered: March 2001
Location: Cookeville, TN

I don't know the exact hp i have but based on MM&FF build ups in the past, i have at least 400hp(if you trust them). I cut and welded a new trans tunnel in. I don't like to stretch metal that far. Sorry I didn't mention that earlier. I figured you knew that until I just read your sig. about Darkhorse Perf. They know less know than I did when I did the swap. About the t-5, it was from a wrecked 93 and didn't last too long. I have a habit of 6000rpm launches on slicks and powershifting.

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1966 Mustang 2+2, 99 Ranger Sport


Registered: April 2001
Location: Blacksburg and Madison Heights, VA

Dude, you're killing me. First I thought you had stock sheetmetal, then I thought you didn't have stock sheetmetal but t-5s were flimsy. Now I find out you're John Force.

Here's what I need: A 5-speed transmission that will more or less fit in the stock tunnel and hold up to a 300 HP engine with 3.55 open rear and street tires. A t-5 is good for this, yes?

When you welded in the new sheetmetal, was that before or after the t-5? I.e., will the t-5 fit beautifully with stock tunnel or not?

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65/66 Mustangs-Hardtops


Registered: March 2001
Location: Cookeville, TN

Quote:
Dude, you're killing me. First I thought you had stock sheetmetal, then I thought you didn't have stock sheetmetal but t-5s were flimsy. Now I find out you're John Force.

Here's what I need: A 5-speed transmission that will more or less fit in the stock tunnel and hold up to a 300 HP engine with 3.55 open rear and street tires. A t-5 is good for this, yes?

When you welded in the new sheetmetal, was that before or after the t-5? I.e., will the t-5 fit beautifully with stock tunnel or not?

I wish I was Force...300mph....mmm. Anyway, I consider my sheetmetal stock. The trans tunnel mod is the only panel replaced with not stock metal. You really can't tell if you don't know anything about Stangs. I made the bends really smooth not just a square platform. The t-5 will fit perfectly. It took me longer to convert to a cable clutch than it did to R&R the 3spd to a t-5. It will hold up well as long as you don't use slicks or powershift, esp. with the open rear. I think you should stick with the Tremec though. It gives you room in the future and you already have money invested in the conversion that you won't get back. I wouldn't pay near full price for a new tranny that has a rear seal leak. Makes me nervous. You know what I mean. Don't give up. You go to college? Does it have an manufac. dept? That's how I did mine, I even got a grade for it. Don't give up bro. You'll love the Tremec when you get it fixed.

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1966 Mustang 2+2, 99 Ranger Sport


Registered: April 2001
Location: Blacksburg and Madison Heights, VA

I'm a couple emails away from trading my tremec for a 50,000 mile t-5 and $650. Since I'm traction limited and I'll go to 3.55 gears before too long, I think it should hold up just fine. I'll re-do the entire car as soon as I get out of school anyway, then I can do all the fancy things that won't fit now.

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1965 Mustang coupe


Registered: October 2001
Location: Matilija Canyon, CA

I recently swapped in a rebuilt T-5 from a '93 into my '65 which puts out about 353 HP (302 modified 351 heads, etc.). The T-5 fit fine with minimal droop even after I swapped the lower engine mounts ('66 vs. '65) which raised the eninge about 3/4" or so.

I did have to do a little fine tuning to the shifter hole geometry as mine didn't quite line up right there. Only took a little snipping here and there to get it in.

As to the likelihood of this tranny holding up over time, I cannot say. I don't romp 'em stomp 'em too much, but certainly enjoy the thrill a few extra ponies gives.

The T-5 replaced a C-4 and I got my cross brace from Modern Drive Line as well as all the other conversion parts except the clutch actuator which is hydraulic from John's Mustangs in San Diego. Had tried the MDL cable kit and had too many interferences.

It wasn't Differential Equations, but mostly elbow grease that made it fit.

Greg

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1965 Mustang 2+2, 1998 Mustang Coupe


Registered: October 2000
Location: near Oklahoma City, OK

I had all this new FRPP stuff laying around my garage after spending some money at the Ford dealer and Summit racing. I musta looked at it for six months before I got around to installing it. All that time I was concerned about the "what ifs" this doesn't fit. I was very happy when it went together as planned. My problems were with z-bar clutch linkage and header fit. I tried several sets of headers before getting a set that fit. I never did find a good fitting set of shorties. In my car, the clearances are all fairly generous so its hard for me to imagine the problems you've got! Like others somethings wrong...have you reversed the motor mounts or something like this? Be sure to do a sanity check on it before tossing in the towel.

__________________
GeeGee

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1966 Mustang 2+2, 99 Ranger Sport


Registered: April 2001
Location: Blacksburg and Madison Heights, VA

Maybe I will keep the tremec. I just realized the t-5 takes a different bellhousing and there are just about as many hassles involved with putting that in as there are with the tremec. The tunnel (if there's anything left of it) will look like total shrapnel, but it'll fit one way or another. I wonder how many dremel cutoff disks it takes to remove a transmission tunnel.

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66 mustang silver blue, 302 and a T5


Registered: January 2001
Location: Medford, OR

VTS sorry you are haveing so much trouble. I have a t5z and love. I had no problems with mine at all. It was just a simple bolt in swap (i had a c4 before). I had to make no mods to my car. (I hate cutting into mustangs) The shifter came up right threw the old hole and everything. I used the 87-93 bellhousing $40 bucks on ebay. I even built my own crossmember for 13 bucks. The t5z is rated at 330 torq. The 90-93 gt's are rated at 300 lbs torq. The 86.5-89 are 265 lb's torq. I got my trans off of ebay in peaces for 150 bucks then put a kit in it. (The guy didnt know it was a frpp t5-z) Here is a pic of my lean. Once again i have had no problems with mine, and recomend it to anybody.

__________________
Tangman.

302 with F4B intake
Ford Motorsport T5z trans,
4.62 gears
mini spool
Weld racing draglite rims
Best ET 15.6

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66 mustang silver blue, 302 and a T5


Registered: January 2001
Location: Medford, OR

Holy cow that pic is big. Anyway, i fogot to mention that Only t-5's with the 7.18" input shaft will work.(86-93 mustangs)

__________________
Tangman.

302 with F4B intake
Ford Motorsport T5z trans,
4.62 gears
mini spool
Weld racing draglite rims
Best ET 15.6

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1965 Fastback, 2002 SVT Lightning


Registered: January 2002
Location: Cedar Park, Texas

From what I learned this weekend, the Tremec 3550 will fit, just be prepared to make some big alterations if you want it to fit right. I said the heck with it and moved the motor back 1/2 inch at the same time...

I will keep you guys posted. Pictures are on my site. Just be warned, it is not for the faint of heart. Here is a link to my swap:

http://users3.ev1.net/~wjb/tremec.htm


John

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1965 Mustang 2+2, 1998 Mustang Coupe


Registered: October 2000
Location: near Oklahoma City, OK

VT, the T5-Z fit in my '65 is very neat and did not require any sheet metal modifications, absolutely none. The shifter fits exactly in the stock cutout and I use a stock Toploader boot and bezel in the interior. The items I use with my Motorsport 5.0L HO are:

a. '69 351w bell housing with California Pony Cars T5 adapter fitted. The crossmember is also CPC. The flywheel, clutch and pressure plate are from Ram Clutches. The starter is '69 351w.

b. The driveshaft is shortened 1" even with T5 conversion yoke. My C4 yoke fit was just the same. However, my C4 yoke was well worn near the seal area and had all sorts of rock dimples in it. Since Mercon ATF is a lot thinner than transmission oil, I figured I'd better pop for the new yoke.

c. Since my Motorsport engine does not have the engine pivot for z-bar clutch, I use the CPC pivot adapter. Since I mount this on the 164 tooth bell housing, it does not fit like it would on a 157 tooth bell housing as the bell housing ears are deeper and hence the 157 tooth CPC pivot adapter falls short of the engine boss area where the pivot fits on earlier engines. There was enough mis-alignment of the pivot adapter, I knew it would cause problems. I had CPC make up a custom version of the pivot adapter for my car. It now works perfectly. Basically, the pivot bracket is 3/8" longer along the side of the block than it is for the 157 tooth.

You might ask why I got into using the 164 tooth instead of using the 157 tooth set up that so many folks use. When I was scrounging parts my first try was a 157 tooth bell housing (early six bolt). It didn't fit my Motorsport engine. Specifically, from the block pins down, the bell housings were different. The 164 fit perfectly, so that's what I started with. I matched parts from there.

If you have an early block, '68 or earlier, I'll venture a guess the early 157 tooth Toploader bell housing would work just fine. I'm not so sure about engines after '68.

Salient features of using the CPC adapters to effect T5 installation are the tranny is canted some small number of degrees to favor the driver. The reason this is done is to provide for offset transmission and CPC adapter plate bolts. Note well if the CPC adapter bolts on where the Toploader would've bolted on, any T5 transmission bolts that happen to occupy the same spot could not be bolted on without conflict with the first set of bolts mounted (adapter plate bolts). The tranny is canted to ensure clearance between the first set and the second set of bolts. The effect of this is nil except for the fact that the crossmember's transmission mount must also be offset the opposite direction.

I can provide you with interior pictures so you can see the end result of the conversion. I can give you some pictures underneath but getting a good angle on the tranny from ground level is difficult. Even on jackstands there's not a good angle for taking a picture. I could take several or from angles you want. If you wish me to take some, reply to my personal e-mail address and I'll do what I can.

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1965 Ford Mustang


Registered: April 2002
Location: California

Dam...I was all prepared to switch my T-10 to some other type. I am really stuck on a 6 speed just because of it having 6 gears but all this makes me hate the idea. I don't like the idea of having a T-5. What about a T-56? any info on that? Please give me so rest asured info that will put my ideas to rest. I live in So Cal and don't know good tranny shops to even take on such a task as a tranny swap like this.

__________________
Black/Black Pony Interior
4 Point Roll Bar with Crossbar
& 4 point seatbelts
289 cid, 165cc AFR heads
Aftermarket Headers with flowmaster exhaust and H-pipe
4 speedT-10 Borg Warner

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