Dip 865 – Standard
I was William Wallace in a Braveheart theme, but we didn’t do much role-playing, probably due to the change of GM at the start.
Click on the hyperlinked names for the EOG
Players
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Name |
Nation |
Duration |
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GM: |
Babak Talebi |
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Players: |
Charles Feaux de la Croix |
Germany |
Spring 1901-Spring 1905 |
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Marco Garfagnoli |
France |
Spring 1901-Spring 1901 |
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Turkey |
Spring 1901-End |
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Eric L |
Austria |
Spring 1901-Spring 1902, Spring 1904-Fall 1906 |
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Ariel Kass |
Russia |
Spring 1901-Winter 1901 |
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Jacob |
Italy |
Spring 1901-Winter 1905 |
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England |
Spring 1901-End |
Charles’ EOG – Spring 1905I am sorry to say that the time I currently have and a long interval of not being connected to the net (vacation) prevents me from coninuing to remain in this game. You will already have noticed for a while that Germany is not diploming very much and rather than leaving letters unanswered and lengthening deadlines beyond acceptability, I choose to leave. I have enjoyed this game very much and would have liked to continue through the darker days that lie ahead for the Reich. I want to however offer you a end of game report, however faulty it may be as it is written from memory. The early stage: Right at the beginning, the question which allz to go for in the future was pretty much decided by the hostile and thereupon untrustworthy course France took. England was simplz the better allz since communication channles were working out very well whereas France was a real questionmark. Some risks were taken and I found myself ending up with three builds in 1901. Further the overall picture was doing great. the Triple alliance of the Centre Powers was working fine and I greatlz encouraged it threatening war to the party that attacked the other. Obviously, I did not wnat Austria to be swallowed by its neighgbors, nor did I want a constant war just on my backdoor. Italz is geneerally a good ally for Germany and matters went on very well for a very long time. Also, I encouraged an AT so that I would have less to worry about in Russia - a otherwise big mid-term threat to German security. I really found that the picture was jsut to my liking and I capriciously saw myself forming a system much alike to the historic Bismarck alliance system. Alas, Bismarck did not last, not did mine. First of all I wanted Russia to be saved and an RAI was very soon on my agenda. The AT had done its purpose in preventing the formation of the feared Russian monster. Somehow despite my VERY hard lobbying (as those concerned will know) Austria and then Russia declined to join such an alliance and thereupon Turkey rose to prominence lastly stabbing Austria and Russia joining in as a de facto Turkish vassal. Matters were getting very bad down there and weren't in my interests. Up North I was expanding and - I admit plazing a double game with Italz and England. Brian was a good ally, but I could not see how I could avoid confrontation down the road. So I avoided commiting myself agaisnt Italy and soon found that Russia did give me some reason to postpone both promised attacks on Italy and England. I had in fact elaborately planned a double back on England by first moving together with her on Russia. Well, as you know, England preempted this by stabbing nice and hard, congratulations! Russia had all the time talked peace but repeated;y been dishonest and finally stood in Berlin. I fail to see why Russia was so set on attacking me and not Austria (which was so hopeless for such a long time due to the tempary replacement). This war was really futile for Russia and only my wild miscalculation gave it Berlin a second time. I must confess that Russia's and Austria's unreadiness to form the RAI I so longed for I in my eyes the major reason for Germany current position. The post-stab times with England were interesting since I now wanted first peace, but also have a chance at getting my lost lands back and dealing Russia a real blow. Once I fell out, then Enlgand, then agian England and finally she was in all out assault agaisnt me. Alas, Italy was no confronted with Turkey and matters were getting worse by the day. Unfortunately, I nowe wnet abroad and could thus not turn the tide due to ever more sparse access to the net. Since ahead of me lie three weeks of complete lack of email, I grudgingly decided to resign. As for Italy, I admit that recently I have once tried to elp out England rather than supporting the invasion of Britain, which in hindsight would have been better. My greatest mistakes were presumably being too gullible of Russia nand too inclined to forgive, since I dearly wanted to work with Russia and being in any measure nice to England after the stab and the subsequent turn. Austrian and Russian play frustrated me often enough since continuing hostility to my plans which I thought also to be advantageous to them, but Isuppose Russia will have had its reasons for attacking me either by the prompting of Constantinople and especially later England. I have deceived just about everyone at some point and was just as much deceived by others. I found you lot an great mix of players. Christian did a great job in keeping me so gullible, if however I regard his inflexiblity in regards to only wanting to attack Germany similar to running at full speed towards a wall and hoping it would decide to jump aside. Success was by no means assured and was limited at that. I have never rejoiced the joining of a player as about Eric's return. WE could have seen a valiant effort save for my absnece doing harm to cooperation and these misinterpretations of rules. As for that debate, I was already abroad when it cropped up, but must say that I never understood Jacob's logicand ointed this out when he was talking about getting chunks of the Balkans back through the then controversial moves. Stephen is a great player and that was also one of the reasons why I longed for the RAI so dearly. A strong Turkey in the hands of such a competent player is my candidate for a solo, if there is one. Also his stab agaisnt Austria was remarkably good and Austria's inadequate defense (to the horror of Italy, Germany and the returning Eric) helped. Further, I wanted Jacob to build up a proper defense, but -well- I suppose Jacob was by then too fixed on England to see how dangerous Turkey was already. Jacob, I thoroughly enjoyed cooperating with you and I considered Italy as my most long term ally. France was easy and if matters iun Britain had worked out differently we would be doing great. Ihowever admit that in order to curry England's favor I didn't entirely help along your invasion. A mistake. Larry wasn't with us for that long and more a Italian vassal than anything else. Iwould have like to see him stay on, but alas in needed Brest at that point. French help has certainly helped Italy tremendously. And Brian, we had long letters and I liked working with you however unseasy matteres were. We could have done great together, but I suppose we both were working at some devious plan most of the while. Pity you didn't see the merit in attacking STP as I suggested. In any case you're a good candidate for a draw. Well, I have bragged a lot about this game and sincerely enjoyed the diverse personalities at work and hope I will cross swords with you at a later event. Lastly, Matt is a great GM and doing a terrific job. I really hate to run away in such a fashion. |
Charles’ EOG - End I was plesantly surprised by the two EOGs I received concerning 865. I had a lot of fun in this game playing Germany (first time) and certainly learnt (so I hope) a few lessons from my demise. I can only vaguely remember my days in this game (for details I refer you to the EOG I wrote when abdicating), but clearly I was trying to be too clever, both in playing off the United Kingdom and Russia, and also England vs. Italy. Germany did have its Seat in the Sun, but the "divide et impera" approach could not be sustained infinitely just as Bismarck's diplomatic system (me being a great admirer of this brilliant politician despite his failings) was doomed with realpolitik gaining ever more influence while dynastic solidarity further decreased. Really nice how Diplomacy games evoke history. But similar to Bismarck I bowed out of politics "Der Lotse geht von Bord." (me the megalomaniac). I am sorry I left an unpleasant job for my successor. Then, to strike a somewhat more current chord, Stephen undoubtedly deserves this solo, having played consistently very well. Surely he's one of the best players I have had (and having) the pleasure to play with. A pity I failed in putting the RAI together despite lobbying hard for it. Sadly the governmental uncertainty in Vienna prevented this ever becoming reality. This would have been a serious threat to Stephen for once and the final results might have been very different (and for long I had great hopes for a PAX GERMANICA). Indeed, this game contributed to my conviction that Germany is the most fun country to play. I enjoyed the privilege of receiving and writing a great deal of mail. Especially Anglo-German relations were littered with many long letters and Brian and I surely had our share of fun. His course suffered some mmisfortunes later on it seems, for otherwise I would have expected serious British expansion. My quibble with the game is that a RT juggernaut came to dominate the board. I personally dislike this steamroller and would prefer some more late game dynamism preventing precisely this and see some RT strife. Stephen's ability to avoid such a scenario and a grand counter-alliance marks his diplomatic talent. I like to see such alliances and am rather saddened when they are not formed. Then it's a pity that no central European power remained in strength. I hate seeing the peripheral powers dominate the board. |
Jacob’s EOG – Winter 1905 It is with regret that I renounce the throne of Italy. A confluence of issues in the real world have led me to take this action (most importantly I will be losing access to my computer at home - the inlaws are arriving from America) I have enjoyed this game immensely and am highly annoyed that I won't be able to slow the turkish advance. Following Charles' lead, I will also give my opinions- Turkey will win. The Austrian regency basically caused this, but the decision for Austria and germany to move on force into Galicia removed the last hope of stopping the Turk as it caused a turnaround of 4 supply centres and gave the turk a position of overwhelming strength. I was lucky with the French mess and overindulgent with the German. Enjoy the battle, hope to see you on the front lines once I get my life back under control. Stay in touch Jacob |
Christian’s EOGIt is always with a bit of sadness that one takes over the destiny of a country, especially after the death of a deloved Tsar, but it was with honor that I have taken over the destiny of Russia in the Spring of 1902. Although the country was in very good economical position, the International Affairs had been left unattended and most of our neighbors thought that such a neglect was a sign of waror agression towards them. We found England, Germany, Austria and Turkey all converging towards our beloved country. It was clear that something had to be done and quickly, so that Russia would still be on the map in 1903! Negotiations were started with Germany, Austria and Turkey, to find how the previous Tsar would have offended in any way. England stayed silent, although, showed no particular aggressiveness, if not for its fleets getting closer to St-Petersburg. Although Germany sounded extremely friendly, it was soon to be evident that the Kaiser was working hand to hand with the King of England. All seemed lost on the Northern front: with such a strong allience and with Austria and Turkey stealing our fresh reserve to the South, it only looked a matter of time before St-Petersburg would fall. After a season or two, the Kaiser started to talk about double-crossing his British ally. There seemed to be no reason to do so, looking at how well they had worked together in Scandinavia. All that we could think was that Germany's growth that was already impressive made the Kaiser more power hungry. The Kaiser actually came down with a request to set a trap to England and offered Russia to take Norwayas compensation for its help. At first it was thought as a ruse, but it became clear that when Britain was informed of the German strategy, the British King had heard of no such thing. Russia and Britain started working together to repell the German invader. Having 2 ennemies initially to the North, effortswere made immediately to propose an allience to the south with Austria and Turkey. the proposal was to leave a corridor through Rumania and Galicia to funnel Turkish troops to the north. Austria claimed to be very sympathetic to the Russian cause and wanted to work with its people, but still sent troops to be stationed in Galicia. That left Russia with only one friend to turn to: The Sultan. And what a trusty friend he turned out to be. Russia could not face 4 ennemies at once and survive; Turkey HAD to be trusted. The ultimate test was put forward: the taking of Sevastopol so that the fleet could be replaced by an army, IF Turkey held to its word, and vacated for the fall, after the sinking of the fleet. It was done as planned. For the whole duration of the campain, Turkey made huge efforts to make sure Russia was well defended, and the people of Russia could only be grateful and remember Turkey's friendship. Austria on the other hand seemed very confused. Neither Russia nor Turkey could make any sence of its external policy. Its orders were erratic: troops were even ordered to move to 2 different provinces at once. Even Italy seemed to grow tired of its inefficience and started to close in. The temporary Arch-Duke only made matter worse. Austria was now clearly a menace that had to be eliminated. Russian troops assisted Turkish armies in seizing territories that were under such poor leadership, and brought back prosperity. A strong ERT allience grow quickly. Russia was now saved. To show its gratitude, Russian troops were only too proud to support England and Turkey in their march towards Germany and Austria. Russia acquired its first foreign territory when it invaded Berlin. It was without a doubt an act of the utmost provocation in the eyes of the Kaiser, but it had a very specific objective: attract the bulk of German troops, while England was almost free to take a less defended front, in Scandinavia. The Kaiser fell in the trap, and although Germany did not fall right away, it stayed to a size that allowed England to take control of the North. A few years ago, rumors of surfaced that England thought that the allience had run its course. No particular discussion came to actually confirm it, but it was perceived that it could be a serious threat to Russia. As it turned out, both England and Russia made "defensive" moves to protect themselves against such rumors. As it turned out, England felt that Russia might want to reannex Scandinavia to restore its former glory. The Scandinavian war was won by Russia, and although the Tsar elite corps took all of Scandinavia with blinding speed, it was felt that English troops were afterall the people that saved Russia against German invasion. It only seemed decent that no attempts were to be made to invade Britain's homeland. About Italy: although the first Italian government was closer to the Kaiser than a Siamese twin, the second (and very brief) government saw that its survival was dependent on breaking the ERT allience. When it saw it was impossible to break, it turned on its only ally, before commiting Hara-Kiri. The 3rd government in place turned out to be practical and pragmatic. Although it was clear that it would not survive Russian/Turkish pressure, it turned its attention on saving its territories threatened by England, offering cooperation with Russia and Turkey. The Russian people are grateful to Turkey and enev England for the flourishing of its sphere of influence. Its mere survival was all that was expected; its expension was beyond anything it expected. For that, despite the single handed Turkish victory, all of Russia screams "VICTORY" tonight! |
Pursuant to the Tsar’s tale, I tell my story by reference to those influences that shaped each phase of the game. OPENING: Influences: Russia and France's poor communications. Granted, Marco wasn't a native English speaker, but Ariel and he should not have been rulers if they weren’t able to keep up the necessary level of dialogue. Russia especially needs a skilled diplomat at the helm, but Ariel came across as vulnerable. Events: 1) Austria and I combined to put Russia on the back foot and split the Balkans between us. 2) England and Germany allied against France and then Russia. 3) Italy took advantage of France's weak south and invaded. MIDGAME Influences: 1) France held a grudge against England. Larry passed up a chance to save his position and slow Germany’s advance, instead launching a suicide mission against Brian 2) Russia cut a deal with me. Chris came in as the new Russia just as I was starting to worry about the long front developing between Austria and me. I agreed that I needed to help Russia and beat Austria to the stab. Events: 1) I stabbed Austria, moving straight through Sevastopol to outflank Eric. At this time, Eric R had just stepped in for Eric L, but was underinformed and underequipped for the game. He didn't communicate and was a poor tactician, which helped me drive him back and eliminate Austria. 2) Italy continued past Iberia to attack England with the help of France's kamikaze fleet. England was put on the back foot. Charles took Northern France and was looking to extend Germany's empire from Brest to Warsaw if England had continued the alliance. 3) I persuaded Brian to join an ERT (dubbed by someone the ‘Grand Three Alliance’) that would rescue both England and Russia. Their alliance would drive Germany back, while I would distract Italy and force him to leave England alone. 4) In the final stages of my war against Austria, I attacked Italy. Jacob and I both knew it was coming and struck at the same time, but he was saddled with Austria (‘shackled to a corpse', to borrow from history) and fighting a war on two fronts. He was also a little predictable and made the repeated mistake of supporting with his forward unit in Albania. This allowed me to control the Ionian and eventually destroy that unit (credit should go to Chris for that move). He doomed himself by not withdrawing immediately from the attack on England. His successor, Jonathon, could do no better, despite amusing us all with his interesting theories. ENDGAME Influences: 1) The Grand Three Alliance was a complete success. ERT had driven back and almost annihilated Germany. Italy was trapped between England and Turkey. Austria was gone. The only decision left was whether to declare a three way draw or play for the solo. 2) Russia and England's forces, converging on Germany, were naturally drawn up in a battle line against each other. If a draw was not declared, there was no way to prevent war between the two. Russia could not expand any further without attacking England or Turkey. 3) England landed a fleet in Spain. The choice of Spain over Portugal was natural, but gave him the advantage in any race for the solo. Events: 1) I broached the subject of finishing the game with England and Russia individually, arranging with England to crush Italy and Russia and then dissolve the alliance to allow us to go for the solo. However, Chris and Wesley both offered to help me get the solo. Wesley did so in order to preserve Italy's remaining home centres for a couple of years, while Chris I believe did it out of gratitude and the chance to be the second strongest power. 2) The conventional option was to ally with England and hope to beat the stalemate line. But I believed I could trust Chris and Wesley. We arranged a giant convoy from Smyrna to Spain and Italy and Russia attacked England’s forces. Brian rightly pointed out that they were offering me the solo, but right until Spring 1909, a stop-the-leader alliance could have forced a draw easily. If I had allied with England, there would have been no chance of a draw, but my chances were only 50-50. 3) In winter 1908, Russia got 3 builds. If he'd used those units against me, a draw was a certainty, but he continued against England and a Turkish solo was possible as early as Fall 1909. OVERALL I felt I probably deserved the solo, if only for my fleet manoeuvres against Italy and my diplomacy with England and Russia. My successes against Austria, though, were more due to his errors than me. I could have been more ruthless in the endgame, but I decided that I'd like to win without stabbing Chris or Wesley in the back, so I had to trust him till the end. I expect that a purist diplomat would think this was a weakness. Brian I didn't feel bad about stabbing, because we had agreed to put the alliance aside to battle for the solo, and I think he appreciated the move. I thought that Brian, Chris, Jacob, Wesley and Charles were all good players and good company. I was lucky that my original neighbours were a little weaker. Kudos to Brian for being the only original player to survive even after his chance was gone. My involvement with Charles and Wesley fortunately carries on into 919 and 921, and I hope to encounter the others soon! |
Following in the footsteps of those before me... First, I'd like to say that as the only original participant in this game (and that includes the GM), *I'm* actually the winner! After all, none of you were here the whole time, right? :) All kidding aside, I enjoyed this game, and wanted to thank Matt for an excellent job as GM. Any mistakes made were typically minor, and certainly fewer than I would have made over the course of this game. Congrats too to Stephen on a very well-played game - he certainly deserved the solo win. Charles contacted me almost immediately, and we hit it off right away. It made the first couple turns easy for me, and a lot of fun besides. EG is, from my understanding, generally a strong early alliance, and Charles really came off as an excellent player. His original French counterpart did not, which only further encouraged my aggressive opening against France. Unfortunately, I think that did in Marco, and so we had another early replacement, after Babak had to turn over the GM job to Matt right after the game formed. It should have been clear that this was a sign for things to come for this game. Midgame: In the west, my inability to control the MAO early led to Italy's strong presence out there. Furthermore, the loss of Brest not only left a stronger France at Italy's bidding, but units in position to threaten me. I was forced to spend a significant amount of time and effort repelling them - and in all honesty, probably would not have succeeded without Charles continually passing messages along about plans from Italy. Though I ultimately prevailed without losing a single center other than Brest, it was a huge waste of effort that I could otherwise have used to expand, either in Germany/Low Countries, or west in Iberia. I was certainly kicking myself for the 1902 move most of the midgame - it really hampered me. Overall, the midgame was about positioning. In the west, it was the last French fleet that was buzzing around the Isles, preventing me from moving strongly against Italy, which resulted in Italian fleets much further north than they ever should have been. I got a lot of gains in Scandinavia thanks to Chris' help - which was invaluable, and the sole reason Italy/France didn't overrun me in the west - but my units were often misaligned, and worse, spread thinly over a large area. By contrast, Chris made few territorial gains, but had every last one of his units in position to strike at me. This understandably began to make me nervous, especially as Germany was eliminated, and his only real path of expansion was to continue through me. A few comments to that effect from Stephen, and I was more than just a little concerned.
At first, it seemed to me that he'd realized Italy didn't have much of a future, at least in expandability. I offered him what I felt I could without offending Stephen, since by this point I realized I'd need his help against Turkey if I wanted to win. Here again, I still haven't figured out what went wrong, as the next thing I knew, I saw an *Italian* fleet giving Turkey the route to stab me. While in the end, it was a meaningless stab - no loss of center, and actually strengthened my southern position somewhat, it was certainly demoralizing, coming at the same time as the second Russian stab. At that point, it told me that it was "gang up on England" time, which I had no hope of stopping. I know why Stephen moved against me - I was, at that point, his true rival to a solo, and pushing me out of the Med certainly helped his position. What I couldn't figure out - and still can't - is why Wesley agreed to help him. He had to know that Turkey's only moves were to attack him, which wasn't necessarily the case should he have helped me. At the time, it looked like history was repeating itself, with Italy playing "spite England" instead of France this time. Needless to say, not a very happy turn for me. After the big stabs, I was originally determined to make sure Chris/Wesley got nothing else from me - I was going to basically hand Stephen the solo as quickly as I could, and hope he'd support me as best as possible against the other two. As I said, I didn't really hold much animosity towards him for his stab. At least, that is, until he sent a couple messages out that to me, at least, read as... well, if not exactly orders, certainly some very strongly couched suggestions. That just rubbed me the wrong way, and so my new endgame goal was to ensure none of Turkey's 18 centers would come from anything I held at the time. I managed to set up the stalemate line at the entrance to the Med, and could have held him there indefinitely had I not been trying for one last stab at Brest (which it seems I was just fated not to have). Granted, this would have allowed Chris to conquer the Isles, but I knew the game was just a pointless exercise by that point.
Stephen, I'd agree you deserved a solo for the game you played, although I'd argue that had one or two breaks gone my way earlier (or, that I'd played a little more ruthlessly in the midgame), I was just as deserving of that solo as you. Still, congrats, you played an excellent game. |
This was my first game to GM and had a few missteps here and there, but overall it was a very good experience. I did not start the game as Brian had pointed out, but did come in before the first Spring 1901 orders were adjudicated. It was very interesting to see the thoughts of various players that were kind enough to CC or BCC me their negotiations. Many times, I would eagerly look for orders to see who was lying to who. For the most part this was a very easy game to run as most players were very good about getting in their orders on time. Unfortunately, we did have a few that dropped out, but most gave me a heads up on having to leave and therefore did not NMR. As this was my first game to GM, I was feeling my way through the process. There was one point where I was not happy with a decision I had to make, but felt at the time that if I had reversed my decision it would have really screwed up things. Jacob had some very good points, and as a result I ended up changing my House Rules to clarify the situation for future games. The other thing I ended up not being happy about was letting a temporary player take over Austria. In the future I will not let that happen as I think it affected the game greatly. Stephen did great in his negotiations and his moves and deservedly won. Special mention to Brian for being the only other original player and making it to the end. I thought for sure he would be eliminated earlier from the e-mails I got, but he was masterful in remaining to the end and having an effect on the eventual outcome. Christian came in with a crippled Russia to basically help me out in a supposedly mercy position. He turned it around and ended up with the second most Supply Centers at the end. I thank all for putting up with my mistakes in adjudication. I tried to be perfect, but alas I had a run of about 3 or 4 seasons in a row with small mistakes. I would gladly GM another game with all of you in the future and plan on starting one right after Thanksgiving. Any that do want a place reserved, let me know. I'm leaning toward doing a Chaos game, but could change that. |
I believe I had saw the position posted twice before I replied. The first time I looked at it I knew Italy didn't have a chance to do anything. The second time I looked at it I felt sympathetic to the players waiting to get the game moving again, and so I replied. Going into the game I had hoped to work with England. I felt I had the most to gain by helping him, and also though that there would have been a chance the game would have ended in a stalemate, with a 4 way draw. Yea, I actually visualized that! So I started talking to England about pulling back my fleets, moving against Russia in Germany, and having him move his fleets south to stop Stephen from advancing. My suggestions to move against Russia were ignored, while my request for English support of my WMED took too long to acquire. My thoughts were, 1-England did not want to move against Russia, and 2-he was still dealing with Turkey on the Italian equation. Being the fulcrum of the seesaw, the hesitancy of the English tipped the scales to the Sultan. I felt at the time that with my armies in France, English A BEL(?), along with his fleets, he could have advanced into Germany while moving his fleets south to prevent Turkey from advancing and to secure his own centers. He was not ready to move against Turkey, and we then saw a switch of allegiances with Italian foreign policy. Turkey was ready to move against England, and the pendulum swung. |