Shoulder
Injury -- was: Shoulder Joint I've Never Heard Of
(Extracted from Aikido-L)
Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 11:51:51 -0500
From: Margo Ballou
Subject: shoulder joint I've never heard of
Speaking of getting hurt, I have a shoulder injury in the acromial-clavicular
joint. The injury is not yet severe. I'm assuming that I was over-pinned.
I've already seen a doctor, and I'll be seeing an orthopedist on Thursday for an
x-ray and a discussion of physical therapy. Does anyone have any experience
with this type of injury?
I'm currently treating it with ice, and I'll probably add ibuprofen to the
regimen. I'm going to switch from aikido to swimming for the time being. I
would be grateful for other suggestions.
- Margo
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Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 11:00:11 -0800
From: Dave Liebreich
Subject: Re: shoulder joint I've never heard of
Margo Ballou writes:
> I'm currently treating it with ice, and I'll probably add ibuprofen
> to the regimen. I'm going to switch from aikido to swimming for the
> time being. I would be grateful for other suggestions.
Do not overtrain - I created a second shoulder injury when I was too aggressive
in my physical therapy.
5-pound weights *can* be too much when you are doing isolation exercises.
_Dave, who learned the hard way what a supraspinatus is.
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Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 16:01:17 -0500
From: Emily
Subject: Weird Shoulder Joint
Margo-
>Speaking of getting hurt, I have a shoulder injury in the acromial-clavicular
joint. >
Ah hah. That's the one which most gymnasts and aikidoka will very probably
injure.
It's the bit where your clavicle, humerus, acromion process of the scapula and
tons of shoulder, neck and back muscles attach. Follow your collarbone out
towards your shoulder, and right there where it disappears into either a point
or hollow, that's it. I suspect yours is a little achy. Go ahead and rub it a
little if that feels good.
This is the joint I separated mildly in 95. I think I've shown off the remaining
lump of scar tissue. It wouldn't be so bad if I hadn't torn the anterior
deltoid, too.
Is it so bad you need a sling for it? My sports med book suggests a "donut pad"
over the joint during training.
My best recommendations are ice, ice and more ice. I tended to get home and slip
a cold back under my bra strap. When you have it recovered a bit then get to the
rehab.
Naturally anything your doc says takes precedence unless you are looking for a
second opinion.
When it gets past the acute phase, see if you can't get to a good myotherapist
and get some cross-fiber friction on the scarred areas and get some gentle soft
tissue or Trager/Feldenkrais work to restore full range of motion to that arm.
I have %98 of mine. Strengthening my rotator cuff and keeping my shoulders
strong has been a very important part of my training.
Swimming was part of my rehab in the acute phase of my recovery, and it hurt,
but I did it, and it helped.
Nowadays I am just a big baby when being pinned on that side, and let people
know immediately that it's a compromised joint which needs to be protected.
Of course, right now, my whole body seems like a compromised bag of owies which
need to be protected...
:-P
Emily
totally thrilled about going to Germany and meeting the Euro-Listka, and
figuring it can't be much weirder than leaving Texas.. ;-)
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Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 18:02:04 -0500
From: The Dojo
Subject: Re: shoulder joint I've never heard of
On Tue, 26 Mar 2002 11:51:51 -0500, Margo Ballou wrote:
>acromial-clavicular joint. The injury is not yet severe. I'm
Take good care of it, get it treated promptly and make damn sure you get GOOD
medical support.
The problems I have with my shoulder stem from an AC seperation resulting form a
fall from a height onto the shoulder. This was much worse than you have probably
experienced (the end of my clavicle was trying to poke me in the ear), but ANY
AC problem needs treating and good sports medicine folks are the best place to
start.
Get in touch offline if you want to talk about it.
Take good care and heal fast!
Chuck
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Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 22:36:24 -0500
From: "Kim A. Sommer"
Subject: Subject: shoulder joint I've never heard of
On Tue, 26 Mar 2002 Margo Ballou wrote:
>I have a shoulder injury in the acromial-clavicular joint.
>Does anyone have any experience with this type of injury?
I had vestigal problems with my acromoniun (sp?) process after a shoulder
disclocation. For a couple months I thought I could "work it out". Didn't
happen. This was a case where PT with small weights, therabands, and ice fixed
things very quickly.
There was probably a trigger point involved that could have helped me more
quickly but that was a decade ago.
> I'm going to switch from aikido to swimming for the
> time being.
No!!! If it's like the problem I had swimming will at the minimum keep it from
getting better and could likely make it worse. That's strictly from my personal
experience.
Kim
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Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2002 15:50:17 -0800
From: Janet Rosen
Subject: Re: shoulder joint I've never heard of
Margo Ballou wrote:
> Speaking of getting hurt, I have a shoulder injury in the
> acromial-clavicular joint.
AC separation is common in aikido, most often, as far as anecdotal evidence
goes, due to forward rolling problems. As others have said, not to be taken
lightly and I also would not recommend swimming. MD or PT should have specific
exercises to be done to prevent secondary frozen shoulder syndrome, do those and
no others until they tell you.
cheers
janet
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Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2002 19:24:35 -0500
From: Margo Ballou
Subject: Re: shoulder joint I've never heard of
"Kim A. Sommer" wrote:
>I had vestigal problems with my acromoniun (sp?) process after a
>shoulder disclocation. For a couple months I thought I could "work
>it out". Didn't happen. This was a case where PT with small
>weights, therabands, and ice fixed things very quickly.
Thanks, Kim. That's very encouraging. I'm dismayed that (a) I've been
practicing very carefully, and given the way I think I got this injury (training
a beginner), I don't see how it could have been avoided, and (b) I'm not
_supposed_ to get injured in my broad, muscular shoulders! I'm supposed to have
sensitive elbows and knees!
This makes me very peeved. :)
>No!!! [no swimming]
Okay, I'll check with the orthopedist first.
Emily asked:
>Is it so bad you need a sling for it?
Well, the orthopedist appointment is tomorrow, but I suspect I won't need a
sling! It really only hurts a tiny, tiny bit. The shoulder still has full
range of motion. However, the AC joint grinds and makes noises when the
shoulder is at its lowest backward extension, the kind of movement one makes
only when stretching or being pinned.
At present I'm following your suggestion of ice, ice, and more ice. There's no
burning in the morning, but by the end of the day the joint feels warm.
Thanks for the encouragement,
Margo
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Date: Thu, 28 Mar 2002 12:49:27 -0500
From: Margo Ballou
Subject: shoulder installment
I went to the orthopedist this morning. I often love or hate doctors, and I
loved this guy. He was a fountain of knowledge, and really nice too.
It turns out that (surprise!) my diagnosis was right, and my doctor's was
wrong. There's nothing wrong with my AC joint. As I understand the
orthopedist, I have a strain in 3 of the 4 rotator cuff muscles.
I have full strength in both arms, although quite probably less endurance in the
injured arm! We took an X-ray, and everything looks good. I have a p.t.
appointment set for Monday.
This cheers me immensely.
Margo
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Date: Thu, 28 Mar 2002 13:10:58 -0500
From: Mike Bartman
Subject: Re: shoulder installment
At 12:49 PM 3/28/02 -0500, Margo Ballou wrote:
>There's nothing wrong with my AC joint. As I understand
>the orthopedist, I have a strain in 3 of the 4 rotator cuff muscles.
<snip>
>This cheers me immensely.
Great news! Take it easy until they heal up to limit scar tissue formation as
much as you can.
-- Mike "glad it's not anything permanent" Bartman --
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Date: Tue, 2 Apr 2002 09:22:08 +0000
From: James Baldwin
Subject: Re: shoulder joint I've never heard of
On Tuesday 26 March 2002 4:51 pm, Margo Ballou wrote:
> Speaking of getting hurt, I have a shoulder injury in the
> acromial-clavicular joint.
Sorry to hear that, Margo.
> Does anyone have any experience with this type of injury?
A little. When I was a newbie, desperately trying to learn to roll (and
having a great deal of difficulty) I managed, one night, to fall several
times on the point of my right shoulder. The result was a kind of dull ache
and tenderness - I couldn't sleep on my right side. I went to a
physiotherapist who told me that I'd over-stretched the ligaments (I think,
it's a few years ago now) in the acromio-clavicular joint. He basically gave
me the physiotherapist's soft tissue injury treatment - ultrasound,
gentle stretches, a bit of massage, maybe some acupuncture (I don't
remember). It took a few weeks to heal, but it seems to have sorted itself
out.
If it's a soft tissue injury then I would very strongly recommend
finding a
good physiotherapist. Physiotherapists are wonderful, lovely, useful people
for putting aiki-nutters back together!!! :-)
--
James.
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Last updated on 13 Sep 2002