Ikkyo Nage
(Extracted from Aikido-L)
Date: Tue, 30 Apr 2002 09:56:43 -0700
From: Mariana Studart Soares Pereira
Subject: Re: Taking control of the mat
> dropped by for my buddy's grading. One pair was working
> on shomen-uchi
> ikkyo. While nage brought uke's arm down just before the
> latter is brought
> down to the ground, uke suddenly went for a forward roll.
I've practiced ikkyo omote like this a few times as an exercise. My Sensei used
to call it ikkyo nage (I think). It's not really that dangerous, except if nage
holds on to uke's arm, in which case he'd probably have to breakfall...
Mariana Studart
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Date: Tue, 30 Apr 2002 14:26:47 -0400
From: "Drysdale, Alan E."
Subject: Ikkyo nage. Was: Taking control of the mat
> on shomen-uchi
> ikkyo. While nage brought uke's arm down just before the
> latter is brought
> down to the ground, uke suddenly went for a forward roll.
Mariana said:
>I've practiced ikkyo omote like this a few times as an exercise. My Sensei used
to call it ikkyo nage (I think). It's not really that dangerous, except if nage
holds on to uke's arm, in which case he'd probably have to breakfall...
If you feel somebody starting to do this, and it isn't what you want, turn
tenkan. Uke generally loses his balance totally. :-)
Alan
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Date: Tue, 30 Apr 2002 15:23:16 -0500
From: "Bosman, Paul J"
Subject: Re: Taking control of the mat
>> ikkyo. While nage brought uke's arm down just before the
>> latter is brought
>> down to the ground, uke suddenly went for a forward roll.
>
>I've practiced ikkyo omote like this a few times as an
>exercise. My Sensei used to call it ikkyo nage (I think).
>It's not really that dangerous, except if nage holds on to
>uke's arm, in which case he'd probably have to breakfall...
Life imitating the list again. One of our 3rd kyu students is a 3rd dan
in some brand of jujutsu. He pointed out to me another reason to pin
uke's arm at an acute angle to his/her head in ikkyo. If you don't, some
smart-ass sandbagger will front roll out of your pin. I tried it, and
it's not all that difficult most of the time. It is also a good reason
not to lean forward into your pin, because if you are pinning the arm above the
shoulder, and some smart ass tries this, the smart ass will clobber you with
their feet while trying to pull off the roll.
p~
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Date: Tue, 30 Apr 2002 21:43:50 +0100
From: Simon Watkins
Subject: Re: AIKIDO-L Digest - 30 Apr 2002 - Special issue (#2002-379)
On 30 Apr 2002, at 14:00, Automatic digest processor wrote:
> I've practiced ikkyo omote like this a few times as an
> exercise. My Sensei used to call it ikkyo nage (I think).
> It's not really that dangerous, except if nage holds on to
> uke's arm, in which case he'd probably have to breakfall...
I roll sometimes it set me up for nikkyo type thingys but
I have never felt any danger of dislocate.
Simon
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 1 May 2002 10:05:58 +0100
From: Simon Watkins
Subject: Re: AIKIDO-L Digest - 30 Apr 2002 (#2002-381)
On 30 Apr 2002, at 23:00, Automatic digest processor wrote:
> I get this. It's almost happened a few times (though not while I was doing
> ikkyo) and I've always thought it's because I wasn't rolling properly.
It was. If you hurt someone unintentionally you are doing it wrong.
Simon
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Date: Wed, 1 May 2002 10:21:11 +0000
From: Mike ?
Subject: Ikkyo
Well, I've posted a few OT things recently, so I shall compensate by something
on topic.
We hear all the time about the principle of this, and the principle of that.
We also hear that Daito Ryu has this many Ikkyo's and this many Nikyo's and so
on.
Personally I tend to think that the Ikkyo we have is one principle, and Nikyo
another and so on, rather than a set of movements like in Daito Ryu.
So, assuming for a moment that the above is true...
...can someone PLEASE tell me how ikkyo works, its starting to really piss me
off.
I just can't seem to get the kuzushi anymore, I used to be better at it (kuzushi
for ikkyo), but now its just vanished.
Help.
Mike Haft
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Date: Wed, 1 May 2002 09:04:26 -0400
From: Katherine Derbyshire
Subject: Re: Ikkyo
If I knew, I would tell you. Sometimes mine works, sometimes it doesn't work on
the same person. I think it stops working whenever I think I know what I'm
doing. Either that's the universe smacking me for my arrogance, or it's a result
of me "going through the motions" without actually connecting with uke.
There is good news. When any technique suddenly stops working for me, that
usually means that I've adopted a more rigorous definition of "works." It
usually means I'm about to make a jump, and am struggling through the last few
details before I can reach the new level of understanding. I hope that's what it
means for you, too.
Good luck!
Katherine
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Date: Wed, 1 May 2002 10:01:31 -0400
From: Jake Jacobe
Subject: Re: Ikkyo
Mike Haft wrote:
>...can someone PLEASE tell me how ikkyo works, its starting to really piss
>me off.
>
Relax.
Connect with uke's one-point.
Use your hips.
Simultaneously cut as if with sword.
Don't try to do something to uke, but rather move uke by moving yourself.
I hope this helps.
Jake
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 1 May 2002 11:12:58 -0400
From: "Drysdale, Alan E."
Subject: Re: Ikkyo nage
> If you feel somebody starting to do this, and it isn't what you want, turn
> tenkan. Uke generally loses his balance totally. :-)
Aylwin asked:
>So would that be nage / uke doing the tenkan?
Nage (making the technique into ikkyo tenkan / ura / negative, which I realise
you aren't always supposed to do).
Alan
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 2 May 2002 05:16:15 -0700
From: Mariana Studart Soares Pereira
Subject: Re: Taking control of the mat
--- "Bosman, Paul J" wrote:
> Life imitating the list again. One of our 3rd kyu
> students
> is a 3rd dan in some brand of jujutsu. He pointed out
> to
> me another reason to pin uke's arm at an acute angle to
> his/her head in ikkyo. If you don't, some smart-ass
> sandbagger will front roll out of your pin.
Yeah, isn't it fun??? ;) There are also other ways of getting out of an
incorrect or loose ikkyo pin, like curling your body around nage's. My
(ex-)instructor made a point of teaching them to us right at the beginning, so
that we could test each other's pins.
> p~
=====
Mariana Studart
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 2 May 2002 05:21:13 -0700
From: Mariana Studart Soares Pereira
Subject: Re: Ikkyo
--- Mike ? wrote:
> Well, I've posted a few OT things recently, so I shall
> compensate by
> something on topic.
Same here... Especially since I plan to post a few *other* OT things, so I'm
compensating in advance :)
> Personally I tend to think that the Ikkyo we have is one
> principle, and
> Nikyo another and so on, rather than a set of movements
> like in Daito Ryu.
Yup, same here. I didn't even know that Daito Ryu considered them as a set...
> So, assuming for a moment that the above is true...
>
> ...can someone PLEASE tell me how ikkyo works, its
> starting to really piss
> me off.
:D Sorry, can't help you there... I don't know, either. When/if I figure it out,
I'll be sure to let you know ;)
> I just can't seem to get the kuzushi anymore, I used to
> be better at it
> (kuzushi for ikkyo), but now its just vanished.
The good thing is, it probably *hasn't* vanished. You're just being more
demanding of your technique. Which is a good thing, IMO.
> Mike Haft
=====
Mariana Studart
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 3 May 2002 10:15:12 -0400
From: Christopher Bartlett
Subject: Re: Ikkyo
The Daito Ryu ikajo waza are related, but the relationship is not obvious. My
concept of the common principles is that they all (mostly) involve
accepting the attack, then moving ate along a line perpendicular to the line of
attack into a pin or throw. Imagine a right triangle. Ate attacks
along one leg, nage moves along the other, forcing ate to move along the
hypotenuse, usually to disastrous results for ate.
Chris Bartlett
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Last updated on 13 Sep 2002