<Tobi2> yes. http://www.geocities.com/EnchantedForest/Glade/9036 <Otter> geocities sets it at the bottom of the page <Granny-Wicked> do you have geoguide on your page tobi2? <Tobi2> oh, oh, oh, I see <Otter> unless you have a geoguide on every' page <Tobi2> yes, g-w <zz-Who> deb...where is the spacer? <Granny-Wicked> what you see in the cookies is a longer version of the geoguide, I think <z-DebE> On the "about me" page. Click on the button of the girl <z-DebE> that'll take you there...didn't really want to advertise <zz-Who> there you are <Tobi2> DebE, I love your backgrounds and the nice, soft feel to the place. . . <z-DebE> thanks tobi2...I'm working on it <Granny-Wicked> debe did your background come faded? or did you make it that way? <z-DebE> I enhanced all of the artwork <Granny-Wicked> how did you enhance it? do you use psp? <zz-Who> still can't find it? <z-DebE> no...I am an infamous MAC user... I use Photoshop <Otter> near the top Who <z-DebE> left column of the table at the top, right Otter <Granny-Wicked> IMG SRC="transpdot.gif" HSPACE="40" <-------this one <Granny-Wicked> ? <z-DebE> yep <zz-Who> what's it called? <Granny-Wicked> cool I found it!! yipee <z-jimbird> I think it's an interesting and unique outlook on the net. Develop it, DebE, and make the magic. <z-DebE> thanks Jim <Otter> Who --- IMGSRC="transpdot.gif"HSPACE="40" <Granny-Wicked> with photo shop what do you use to lightend or enhance the background? <Tobi2> Tell me again - why do you have this transpdot.gif? <Otter> gamma correction granny <Otter> or brighten and contrast <Granny-Wicked> ah thanks otter <z-DebE> I lighten or darken the entire image as I see fit. In this case I applied a semi-transparent white fill <Otter> sometimes you just need to play with it a bit <Granny-Wicked> psp has those, <Granny-Wicked> cool debe <z-DebE> Tobi2 - just to use as a spacer. So that the left column was wider than the buttons in it <Granny-Wicked> in psp would you use a mask like a semi transparent fill? <Tobi2> OK. Looks nice! <z-DebE> cool! I s'pose I could do that in Pshop too! * Granny-Wicked says "I am trying to learn to much at once I fear" <Tobi2> What if you just gave the Width of the TD, and asked the buttons to align=center? <zz-Who> BTW: you have <H3>..ssdmfm...<H3> <z-dddd> nice page Deb <Granny-Wicked> would a transparent fill work in psp also or would you have to use a mask? <z-DebE> I dunno Tobi2 - can you do that? <z-DebE> who? whaaat? <Tobi2> I usually just tell my gifs to center themselves. Like in the table on any of my pages about my books <z-DebE> thanks dddd <zz-Who> <H3><FONT FACE="Garamond">Just in case you're interested in some information about me....</FONT><H3></TD></TR> <z-DebE> Oh! Thanks! I'll fix that! <Otter> forgot to close the </H3> Deb <Blossom^> well I have to go......everyone have a good night! <Granny-Wicked> night blossom <Otter> nite blossom <Tobi2> goodnight blossom <z-DebE> nite blossom <z-dddd> Goodnight Blossom^ :) <Granny-Wicked> thanks otter back to psp for work on jpegs *again* *** Blossom^ has quit IRC (gotta jet.........nice talking to you folks! See you again soon!) <Otter> granny --just keep playing around with it --it's fun!!! <zz-Who> i'm gonna have to clock-out too...soon <Granny-Wicked> I sure am trying otter, it is just hard when you just don't quite get it <Otter> class is officially over unless anyone has a question <Granny-Wicked> I like the softer page, like debe has, that is what I have been trying to do on all my pages, forever <Otter> your pages look great granny!!!!:) <Tobi2> This was a good class. Thank you! <Zonie> ni-tol <z-jimbird> Have a good night, everybody! <Tobi2> night, everyone <Otter> welcome Tobi and thank you! <z-DebE> Granny your pages are wonderful! <Granny-Wicked> thanks otter, maybe three more classes of html and I will get it down pat!! lol <Granny-Wicked> I like the contents debe but the colors are to bright I fear <z-jbr> thanks all - for your questions and answers! <z-DebE> Well, my page looks ok, but there's NO content! <Granny-Wicked> okay I will do the content you do the graphics!! <Granny-Wicked> I can talk and type!! a lot lol <Granny-Wicked> ask the teachers <z-DebE> The hardest part of this for me was figuring out what to write about! <z-DebE> lol! * Otter thinks Deb and granny will make a good team!!!:) <zz-Who> DebE...i'm having a problem on your tools page <Granny-Wicked> thanks otter <Granny-Wicked> I think so too <z-DebE> Whaddya say Granny, wanna share a brain with a stranger? <Granny-Wicked> truly I can write all kinds of things debe, I could have great ideas for your page, but no graphics ability <zz-Who> The merlin gif keeps fading out???? <Granny-Wicked> sounds to cool debe <z-DebE> What's wrong who? Is the gif goofy? <z-Dunn3> ****Dunn has quit...goodnite youin's...see ya saturday. <zz-Who> Dunn done? <Granny-Wicked> isn't he suppose to fade out? <Otter> lol Who ---you're fading out!!!! :) <Dunn3> Yea.. Gotta finish my work for tomorrow. See youin's later this week ...bye bye. <z-DebE> Well, granny, maybe we should work together. You write my content and I'll do some graphics for you! <z-DebE> Who, you are just bad! <z-dddd> what gif are you talking about fading? <zz-Who> BTW: Saw and interesting solution to the IE/NS marquis problem today <Granny-Wicked> okay debe, I will read your pages and give you some ideas hope fully before Saturday!! <Otter> what who? <Granny-Wicked> yes who? and? use psp animation or gif construction? <zz-Who> someone just used an animated gif to simulate marquees...and it worked fine <Granny-Wicked> that is what I did who on my pages <Granny-Wicked> everyone always asked where did I get that marquee <z-dddd> I haven't tried that yet LOL <Granny-Wicked> it is gif construction <zz-Who> maybe that's where i saw it? <Otter> on old IE 2.0-- animations don't work either!!! *** Zonie is now known as Zonie-brb <zz-Who> saw another page where the student coded <BLINK> inside of the <MARQUEE> <Granny-Wicked> oh otter what happens on ie 2.0? <zz-Who> and durned if it didn't scroll on MSIE and blink on NS <Otter> neat who --great idea!!! <Granny-Wicked> cool who that sounds intersting <z-DebE> it's not supposed to do that is it? <z-dddd> excellent idea! <z-dddd> I may steal that one LOL <Otter> granny --animation's are static on old IE browsers <z-DebE> I wonder if the people who do the most interesting things on the web are the ones that don't know it can't be done...hmmmnnn <Granny-Wicked> ouch so older versions of ie, see my gif as a mess? <zz-Who> no...just see one frame <Granny-Wicked> probably debe, and the professionals learn from them too!! lol <zz-Who> Gotta run all...its been swell <Otter> probably just see the blank space before the scroll starts granny <Granny-Wicked> have a nite who <Otter> nite who <z-DebE> nite who. thanks for the feedback! <z-dddd> Good nite who <Granny-Wicked> hmmmm, got to fix that then <zz-Who> Otter...send that log whenever..thanx <Otter> I can check it granny later --what's your email? *** zz-Who has quit IRC (zz-Who) <Granny-Wicked> mwkwicked@townsqr.com (otter) thanks <Granny-Wicked> and now you now where my nick comes from, lol <Otter> I'll test it and send you a screen shot of the page if it looks bad!! <Granny-Wicked> thanks otter, I appreciate it *** Zonie-brb is now known as Zonie <Granny-Wicked> well I am off to work in psp and url's have a nite all <Otter> nite <Granny-Wicked> debe I will come up with some ideas okay? <Otter> I'm going too-- see you all Saturday!! <z-DebE> Sounds great, Granny! If you need any graphics, seriously, let me know and I'll try! <z-jbr> nite <Granny-Wicked> debe have you check out the other fantasy sites? <z-dddd> nite granny <Granny-Wicked> they have some great ones on the web <Granny-Wicked> nite dddd <z-dddd> nite otter <z-DebE> No, well actually, my husband has....grin <z-DebE> I didn't want to go there!!! Session Close: Tue Feb 24 19:20:18 1998

Session Start: Tue Feb 24 17:30:59 1998 *** Now talking in #webdesign Hey: be careful ... when I tried to give who ops he got knocked off line wb Otter!!!!! who how can you tell the resolution? LOL what we have to do is to rent a large quantity of server space somewhere and divide the costs up so that it is really cheap! May not be here long - mIRC keeps freezing upon me!!!! :( sounds good to me ghatten Thanks Blossom, I'm just reading back now. avoid Geogites LOL......Ghatten...... I made the last upload about 2 minutes ago. I agree ghatten is that what happened? maybe you just need to reboot Otter........ win96 control panel setting display general rebooted 3times already LOL uh oh........ dear dear What is causing it otter? * Ghatten gives Ottercyber-velcro Win95...START/Settings/Control Panel/Display/General Otter do a scan disk next time after reboot Otter..log? Upgraded my entire system about a week ago --- still a few bugs I guess! Hi Ghatten Or you can do a right mouse click on the desk top and go to Properties/Settings Hi Roz you probably got a cross linked file Finally got the page up. It just about killed me. Hi jimbird! Hi jimbird! When you find out what it is tell me LOL Hi Tobi2 Granny Wicked: try taking a look at this web site... it checks your web pages for different resolutions.... http://www.dot.net.au/younis/window2.html Also for different platforms That's a great site Flamingo I found the site in a Graphics book Hi WindSong What are platforms? Windows 95, Mac Windows 3.1 Those are different platforms or operating systems Kind of shoes..its a 70s thing Ok, I see. what is a shoe thing? 60's thing Who!!!! LOL brb oh...you must be older than me i never could walk in those things..........LOL I never wore them LOL granny: did you get the web site that I put up for you? Weren't made for guys I like sandles I wouldn't wear them : ) no flamingo I got disconnected Clogs are pretty awful, too. http://www.dot.net.au/younis/window2.html * Otter loves clogs!!!! :) i preferred the high-heeled pumps with my minis So the page that Flamingo recommended will show you how your page looks on different screen resolutions and on different platforms, like how it looks on a Mac if you use Windows hahaaaaaaaaa Ghatten, they are saying "Throw Me somethin 'Mister" today in the BIG EASY!!! * Ghatten likes barefeet Who? minis? aw thanks ghatten Who -- you must look dazzling!! All but over now Oletex webmaster split well there went webmaster again : ) I'm on wiregrass Oh fun oh myyyyyy wb gang Want some Velcro? thought it was my puter again!!!:) It probably won't help but I will take it well if they won't let me stay in through the front door, I will use the back door too!! Don't use webmaster tonight lol Well maybe we should see if anyone has any questions before we get disconnected again! Try using Wiregrass I have a question about lesson 7a that I posted on the discussion board oh go ahead I got the following error message when I first logged onto the page JavaScript Error: http://www.vu.org/webdesign/desk/lesson7a.html, line925: syntax error. I just wanted to know if anyone knew what it actually meant? oh mY! I have a question about why browser specific Java Script was used for button : ) I'm getting to old for this type of thing!! Did anyone else have a problem with the lesson? I didn't .... I got it fine this afternoon buttons don't work in IE4 : ) It didn't interfere with the lesson even though I got that message nope no problem, read it fine!! didn't try a thing except mouse over was cool Ghatten, I had a problem when I attempted to go to Part 2 from the bottom of part 1 No, the button doesn't work in IE I was just wondering why? Well if there was something wrong in the way the JavaScript was written it would return a syntax error It worked when I went back to the index and clicked" part 2 Did anyone else have a problem with the mouse-over? geeeee.......I didn't have that problem dddd: does that happen every time? no error for me ghatten with the error that is not me who it was neat Nope it only happened twice No--it worked fine. Mouse over seemed to work backwards for me got message when NOT on button? But it did happen to tweety too What browser do you use dddd? Netscape 4 (thank you Blossom) you're welcome Tobi2! still works that way???? is that right? Funny thing is the button worked so I didn't understand the error The button was in part 2 but you had a problem with part 1 dddd: Which version or Netscape 4? of 4.02 Hey Zonie: could the version be causing the problem? what build is it yep go to 4.04 Not tonight LOL I would like to talk about the mouse-over when we get a chance I did not seem to have a problem with the mouse over.... go ahead Who Did everyone have that problem? nope not me Did you want message to go away after mouse was moved off button? The mouse over worked for me... just fine :-) it only works when the cursor is on the link Who After first time over button...message appeared at bottom and stuck there not here... I did not set it to do an onMouseOut event handler, just the one that was in the script I copied So it might very well have stayed on depending on browser so the answer is yes...stays there Netscape 3 Who? okay so the answer is to reset it on mouseout ...yes 3.02 It works great with 4.04 I'm using Netscape 3.02 and it didn't stick when I tried it. dangit...went to help to check version and knocked the applet off actually 3.01 here at work I have netscape nav 3.04 gold worked fine here WELL I'VE STILL GOT A T-3 AND YOU DON'T!!!! LOL lol who!! that is true How are we doing questions tonight -- ? * Ghatten says this is a conversation is a good example of some of the problems and considerations in using JavaScript etc on web pages!! I have one Tobi -- ask your question just asking Tobi...keep it on lessons if possible I think tobi will go first then ro I have some to but they have mostly nothing to do with java scripting Is there an ideal size for photos? Is there an optimal number of thumbnails to put on a page? * Ghatten says good this is not on current lesson, sorry. the more images on a page, the slower the download time even with thumbnails S'okay I put 9 thumbnails on my "photos" page. Each one links to its own page. I usually suggest the guideline of a max of 30k total file size for the HTML page and the images That would take about 30 seconds to load up hmmmm, I'll have to add everything up... And is probably about the limit of patience for most people Yes, or store all in a folder and look at total file size for all in folder I think I've probably exceeded that. I agree with ghatten Some pictures that are the same size in real life are different numbers of kbs. I'm going to have to leave. Yes, that's true Tobi Oka Ro seeya ro go ahead and ask you question quickly Thanks. On the top of my page I put the two Irish blessing, one on each site of St. Patrick's picture. The text flows over and I wanted to change the text to Arial which would close it up to be line for line. URL? But for some reason no matter where I put the code I could not get the text to change from Times to Arial. I suspect because I was tired. But could you comment on this Hmmm that is odd--do you have arial installed on your new hard drive? http://members.xoom.com/web_lady/stpatty Yes I do. I checked that out. It was the stangest thing as I have it done in my HTML Resource page. I don't know how I left it so the code can be anyplace now... I just went on to something else to keep the page moving. hmm let us take a look brb Roz yes put the in-between the Try putting the face and size 'under' the And in each cell you want to change make sure you also close it in each Ro: you might want to break this page up into more pages... I think it is way too long... sorry Don't be sorry... you ARE correct! I have just been trying to get it out and not worrying about the size. You are absolutely correct. It is a great page but it is still loading or use jump links from the top to the different topics Also two images are not appearing here great page ro, again you did a good job!! You are ALL correct. the happy holidays ring and hawlogo and then jump back to top! But it is an AWESOME page you have the font as part of the TD I did not register with the rings yet. They will not load until I do and I love the St Patty image I will do that tonight. Lots of great info Took forever to find St. Patty. I wrote to about 10 people for permission Yes, that's what I meant--take the font info OUT of the tag place a inside the cell Nice colors to use and onky got back about 3 so far. nice page ro!!! :) I still need a heading for the page. Thanks Flamingo. More to come. evening all! hi Thanks Otter. Used your blessings, did you notice? LOL --- glad to be of help!!! *** Who is now known as zz-Who You certainly were. I have other but for now those are the ones that are there.

Ro...where lol, zz-who * Otter thinks a few more z's and Who will be asleep!!!! Ro...where's your Passover page? Let us know if the font works after you change it Passover may be the next page... doing research I will thank Ghatten and everyone for your kind words. I had a neat Passover one last year Who -- see if I have it someplace for this year!!! * zz-Who thinks its hard to use keyboard reclining. Anyone will Passover info please send along. I will probably do the page if no more computer problems. rfruchtman@earthlink.net Ok, I'll see you all on Saturday I hope. nite ro Nite All have a good night ro! nite ro! nite I'm gone to work on my page. Got to get it registered so people will come and visit. nite ro..and thanks for the song Pulled an all-nighter last night got to get to bed at a reasonable time tonight. Nite. wifey loved it (and me) am I disconnected? yes guess not, sorry. Tobit2.......you're here......lol It says ping - pong - ping - pong ooooops......sorry for the spelling..... just wondering the same thing --awfully quiet tonite is granny OK? Any other questions? Is there a science to cellpadding and cellspacing? I usually just pick numbers! yes just waiting to speak LOL I pick and look I just try to make it look nice and fat. That's how I make tables in GENERAL! ok LOL... same here... that is the science... Granny you did say you had questions yes thanks ghatten 1. on some of my pages there is a light line next to the border, is that because it is a jpeg not a gif on the background design? which page? Granny: URL? all of them ghatten http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Hills/3111 go to page two and down to granny's other pages where's the border granny -- I don't see it what are you seeing GW? http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Hills/3111/open.htmlThis page Granny? go to bottom of the second page click on granny's other pages the open, animals, school etc they all have extra light lines Blue background with a line border? I do not see anything that looks odd yes a background with a line border do you mean the little marks on the border? (on animal page) The only problem that I see is that the text is on top of the line border... I have a 17" monitor think you need wider cell on the left sorry do you mean the little marks on the border? (on animal page) yes otter Bad graphic problem the extra light lines right side of the border I used psp, I thought it might be because it is a jpg instead of a gif that shouldn't matter -- cut a pixel or 2 off the bottom of the image and then try it (or it may be at the top of image!!) look at hello page, it shows up worse there then anywhere enlarge the image in PSP and you should see the line there oh sorry otter, I just found what you were talking about, yes I need to correct the missing vertical lines on the animal page also that is not the problem I was speaking of it is the long vertical lines lighter then the bars on the right side of the bars that is a mess oh dear..I must be blind as a bat * Ghatten says no offense to bats I don't see this either it looks like a faded picture I do not see anything that looks amiss with the images at all Me either gotcha --were you trying shading there? me either Ghatten........ (hello page) no otter was not trying to shade I made three or four lines dark to light then up comes the extra lighter lines, looks messy try to refill the lt. blue color and it should go away like a run in a nylon okay could it be caused by jpeg format? instead of gif? I tried 256 color, in order for that not to happen no -- I save in both and never had that problem errrrr, okay will try and fix again 2. question 2. is there a way to calculate table widths better? I could look at it on my hubby's 'puter he has worse resolution same science as cellpadding and cellspacing!!! LOL I just use hit and miss, keep changing the width= till I get what I want, never use % I have spent hours trying to get the buttons aligned centered and the page to align just to the right side of the border, but can't get it right one reason I avoid borders but the border is cool tobi2, better then what I had before work with border "1" to set it up and then set border back to "0" less background messes on it it's easier to align things that way sure is : ) what kind of increments do you use in going up or down on a table? 5? 20? easier to see where one starts and the next begins too : ) aw, thanks otter, that makes sense, that makes a lot of sense, I was doing it without borders and guessing a lot Granny: I use a spacer gif the same size as my border line to help with text running over my border line what is a spacer gif flamingo? It is a transparent gif transparent nothing.gif and do you make those in psp flamingo? yes I tried to make each border the same size, but alas I fear it may not be so it is a tricky process use the grid lines, it helps a lot example ... if my border is 100 pixels wide then I make a spacer gif 100 X 100 pixels 100x1 would load faster : ) yes 3. also would it be better to make the buttons wider and height smaller? with so many? thanks flamingo I understand now You could try doing the buttons differently and see if you like the look or to put things in between buttons so they run down the page, and can be found? Granny...look around the web and find what YOU like.. also connected to JavaScript would it be better to do the drop down menue instead of buttons? with more pages? there is nothing wrong with that gosh who I like it all but can't seem to be able to do everything - lol I have the drop down menu on my Library pages at my site Granny.......works well there...... at least not on one page..i hope if you use a drop down menu, be sure you have a link back to it on every page I might try that to blossom lol who okay thanks otter I will stop questioning for now, thanks all, guess more tweaking for me!! a lot of people use them without return links and you get lost on their pages re the spacer gif -- do you just put that in once? or now and then as you go down the border? I have it on each Library Page...... only one tobi Stop me if i'm wrong but...you would probably be wise to pick one style (thing..method..whatever) and use that exclusively for one site that is what I was trying to do who, but then it can be boring to, (Personal opinion here) It is "user-friendly" when all pages of a particular site look and act the same or similar Not all your sites have to be the same... I have buttons on front door and drop down menu on Library pages... okay back to the drawing board again ;) BTW: there's your rocker...by the fireplace I need to go--cat just knocked down the shelf over sink!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! you will spend a lot of time there, get a comfy chair : ) seeya ghatten thanks who, thanks for finding it for me wow......have a good one ghatten! goodnight, ghatten. good luck G come back soon ghatten Zonie I will stay logged in for the d/l sorry ya'll see ya sat k re: transparency? Good night Ghatten *** Ghatten (webdesign@ACCS-AS54-DP06.nwrk.grid.net) has left #webdesign gif of a ghost : ) Yes, DebE, do you have a question? just real quick, coz actual oletex was first. Could you use a transparent 1x1 gif and then use VSPACE and HSPACE to make it however wide or long you needed it? Would it load faster than say an image the right size? might degrade the transparency of it I don't think that I would try it that way... could try and see, never thought of that : ) I change the size attributes for transparent gifs and never had a problem just make it the size I need!!! :) flamingo...why not? cool, just learned something new : ) I have found that it is better to make all graphics the correct size what size would that be flamingo? for quality sake for sure : ) Some platforms/ browsers don't recognize the changes the same way but if is transparent whos gonna know : ) true -- otherwise it distorts the image -- but not if transparent I agree for a real graphic, but a transparent one isn't supposed to be seen it works It did on my page...just thought I should check to see if I was supposed to do it that way (grin) It works... yes url