SSML-124, 23 November 2000

*************************************
From: "Johnny Belinda" 
Date: Sat, 28 Oct 2000 16:53:35 PDT
Subject: Re: [siobhan] Pettiness

>>...what has Siobhan done musically anyway? It's been four years since she 
>>released anything officially on her own and even that wasn't good enough 
>>to warrant an album release (I of course, think that her solo stuff is 
>>really fab, but after subjecting numerous unbiased people to it, they 
>>think that its CRAPOLA!) So we're left with the question: was Siobhan 
>>really the talent of Shakespear's Sister, or was she carefully manipulated 
>>by svengali-esque Dave Stewart?  In summary:  "You can take the girl out 
>>of bananarama, but you can't take the bananarama out of the girl". Thanks 
>>F&S. <]

*************************************
From: googoomucks@cs.com
Date: Sun, 29 Oct 2000 01:25:56 EDT
Subject: Re: [siobhan] Pettiness

I think Shakespear's Sister was a project, fronted by Siobhan. Dave was 
primarily responsible for the instrumentation, Siobhan provided the angst, 
lust & pathos with her lyrics & image. It worked. When "Sacred Heart" came 
out, I remarked to my girl, "Wow! This is THE better Eurythmics album!" Cos' 
I thought "We Two Are One" SUCKED!

Marcella is talented musically & vocally, but is all substance and NO 
style... Siobhan IS style, with a lot of potential, given the right 
collaboration. I loved "Sacred Heart," but I didn't care for most of 
"Hormonally Yours"... You could tell Marcella had more of an input, there was 
so much blue eyed soul present... Or rather, her version of that.

I love stuff like "Cruel World," "Andre," "Your History," "Heroine," 
"Suddenly"... The darker stuff. It was probably Dave that ultimately ruined 
things... He knew Marcie had the chops, and "Stay" was a huge success at the 
sacrifice of Siobhan's vision.

What a mess. I love Siobhan and I anxiously await her return, but I'm not 
holding my breath. I hope she does something to prove her detractors wrong!!!

Charles in New Orleans

*************************************
From: "alex franco" 
Date: Sun, 29 Oct 2000 01:30:32 EDT
Subject: Re: [siobhan] Pettiness

I TOTALLY AGREE WITH YA GOO GOO.  I ANXIOUSLY AWAIT HER RETURN AS WELL.
SHE MUST COME OUT WITH SOME NEW STUFF, I HOPE REAAALLLLLLY SOON.

:)

*************************************
From: "Christopher Gietl" 
Date: Sun, 29 Oct 2000 02:35:40 -0500
Subject: Re: [siobhan] Pettiness

greetings all, 
it is halloween and i have had a few pints... but i came back and checked the emails and to
my surprise i receive an email from "bananastein" commenting on siobhan or mainly her lack of input to shakespears sister,,,,,, what bullshit is that. bananarama are wonderful new wave fun pop, shakespears sister is brilliant "thinking" pop. dave stewart was more heavily involved in sacred heart and that was an amazing album as was hormonally yours which he was involved with as well. marcella was "technically" there but if you really think about it, she was there for siobhan to pose around. siobhan definately had more of a sense of pop music, image and uptmost style. marcy was a great back up singer.   the third album was absolutely lovely and i really enjoyed suddenly, excuse me john, do i scare you, opportunity knockers and go! were they all penned by stewart? NO! and what about "was it somehing that i said?" what was stewart's involvement? NONE! and that is one of her best tracks. so let's stop slagging. 
and on to bananarama, i love them and have been a fan since 1938, (shy boy, robert de niro's waiting, cruel summer, rough justice, trick of the night, what a shambles, i heard a rumour, love in the first degree being brilliant) but i am sorry, they just don't cut it since siobhan's departure. pop life, ultra violet and please yourself are weak attempts at best.
and keren and sara as a twosome, sorry just don't cut it. RDNW2000? vocals are weak and uninteresting.they have to layer the vocals and everything to make it sound "full" or finished.  siobhan on waterloo? FABULOUS!!!! siobhan is not singing "a la shakespears sista" she is just singing like siobhan. let's think of how the girls got into the guinuess book of records in the first place.... KEREN, SARA, &  SIOBHAN! so lets stop slagging the original lineup for they are the ones that created bananarama. stop being so ungrateful!
tell me one thing, why slag siobhan? answer me that question, because i really would like to understand the negativity towards her. is it because she left? or got married to dave stewart, or just got herself a life? or is it that she made three brilliant fucking albums? bananarama where heading down a hole, and siobhan jumped ship for herself and continued creatively on a path for herself, what is wrong with that? anyway enough is enough, i have had it with the siobhan slagging, do you want to  enjoy re-releases of singles and cover versions on the bananarama front or await the brilliance to be released by siobhan and the psychonauts  or siobhan with shakespears sister, you decide.

i am sorry for this  but i feel almost that i have to take sides on this. there is too much +siobhan/-siobhan. jacqui the poor soul totally got the short end of the stick. she probobly would have been better off  not joining bananarama.

now this is my opinion and for discusssion only  and i would really like to hear your opinions----------
ba- ba-  banana

*************************************
From: "John Jennings" 
Date: Sun, 29 Oct 2000 16:40:38 -0000
Subject: [siobhan]  i give up

roight ok, I knew it would come to this eventually, you've lost 
subject matter regarding ss and siobhan so now you're off getting at 
each other... i got ten emails in my inbox today, 9 of them were you 
freaks shouting at each other, i just give up, so i'm unsuscribing, i 
have a lot more important things to worry about. Besides, there
hasn't been an interesting topic on this list for months anyway. if i get
any interesting news from shuv i'll send it to mike or someone to forward 
to the list...
 the end of an era... hehe
take care everybody etc etc etc, don't kill each other.
John J
www.ilonline.co.uk

p.s. heres some subject matter for you now i've gone - bananarama
were a crap victim of the cringe-factor-brothers otherwise known as stock 
aiken and waterman, none of their music has been any good, s,a&w have 
only ever produced music that 5 years olds like anyway...
hehe, that'll get you talking....

right, off i go...
ber-doing.

*************************************
From: DreamDunes@aol.com
Date: Sun, 29 Oct 2000 14:15:51 EST
Subject: [siobhan] Not this old chesnut again ;)

"Christopher Gietl" 
<< marcy was a great back up singer. >>

Marci was *more* than that!!  She might have stood back from the 
limelight at the start of Sister but in 'Hormonally Yours' she was just as 
much a part of Shakespear as Siobhan.  Don't get me wrong, I love Shuv (I 
suppose that's why I'm on this list ), but you have to give Marci her dues 
- she had to try and keep the band together while Siobhan struggled with her 
personal problems.

Best,
Jon

*************************************
From: CCM5217@aol.com
Date: Sun, 29 Oct 2000 16:20:51 EST
Subject: Re: [siobhan] Digest Number 310

Just to put my two cents in, I don't think Bananarama were completely lost 
after Siobhan left.  I think "Pop Life" was their best album ever, and while 
"Please Yourself" and "Ultra Violet" weren't highly original, I don't think 
either deserved to be called "mediocre".  Furthermore I think people should 
give at least some credit to Marcella Detroit.  She was a part of the band 
and is given more songwriting credits than Dave Stewart (who, on Hormonally 
Yours, was credited by the name "Manu Guiot", who is a musician that worked 
with the Eurythmics) while she was in the band.  After she left there was a 
definite change in the music, so it cannot be said she played no part at all. 
 If it had all been Siobhan then the music would have sounded pretty much the 
same, and I think we can all agree that the 3rd album is quite a departure 
from the first two.  Whether that's good or bad is everyone's own personal 
decision.  After giving the 3rd album a second chance I have found myself 
liking it much more than I did on first listen.  I think some of the tracks 
are absolutely brilliant and rank among SS's best, such as "Can You Wait That 
Long?" and "Do I Scare You?", while some others rank among their worst.  As 
for Dave Stewart, I think he is a very talented man who did some great work 
with SS, but it seems to me that some people place too much importance on his 
involvement and others don't give him enough credit.  In their heyday the 
band was 2 people: Siobhan and Marcella, with a third wheel in Dave.  And as 
for Siobhan's vision being sacrificed in "Stay", I think that's unfair.  It 
was a great song, and by far their most popular.  From Marcella's story it 
sounded like she and Dave essentially wrote it and Siobhan added in stuff 
later.  I think it was mainly the work of Marcella and Dave, and Marcella had 
every right to sing lead.  Besides, as much as I enjoy Siobhan's singular 
singing style, she does not have the chops to have sung the lead on that 
song.  I think both she and Marcella did their parts very well on that song 
and both should have been very proud of it.  And on another note, although I 
liked "Sacred Heart" better, I thought "We Too Are One" was excellent and it 
was one of Eurythmics' best albums.
    Has their been any word on any plans to release material by Siobhan and 
the Psychonauts, and have they in fact recorded anything yet?

Bye

*************************************
From: "Johnny Belinda" 
Date: Sun, 29 Oct 2000 14:33:44 PST
Subject: Re: [siobhan]  i give up

>>right ok, I knew it would come to this eventually, you've lost
subject matter regarding ss and siobhan so now you're off getting at
each other... i got ten emails in my inbox today, 9 of them were you
freaks shouting at each other, i just give up, so i'm unsuscribing, i
have a lot more important things to worry about. Besides, there
hasn't been an interesting topic on this list for months anyway. if i get 
any interesting news from shuv i'll send it to mike or someone to forward to 
the list...<]

*************************************
From: DEBRUYN John 
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 08:42:41 +1000
Subject: [siobhan] Lemons and Peaches

	I agree with Bananastein wholeheartedly when she states that this
mailing list has gone to the dogs. Very rarely is anything newsworthy or
musically important ever discussed, and it seems to completely revolve
around the ramblings of hardcore fans who should probably switch of their
computers and get some fresh air (and some perspective!) or people
advertising items for sale on ebay etc ( or trying to prevent sales of items
on Ebay!!!)

	And its a very catty group of people. Seems like everyone is
entitled only to the opinion that Shuv & Marcy are gods and can do no wrong.
If they are so "supremely talented" why doesn't either of them have a record
contract?? And in defense of Bananastein, Dave Stewart was heavily involved
in Shakespears Sister, operating under the guise of Manu Guiot (check your
album credits for that one!). No wonder Shuv was getting so pissed off, she
seemed to have found herself back in a trio!

	In my humble opinion, comparing SS & Bananarama is like comparing
lemons to peaches. They both produce music worlds apart from each other. 

	John

	PS: IF YOU ARE GOING TO REPLY TO THIS OR ANY OTHER MESSAGE, PLEASE
REMOVE UNNECESSARY PORTIONS OF TEXT. I hate having to read 4 small messages
stretched over 6 pages!!!!

*************************************
From: moorejs 
Date: Sun, 29 Oct 2000 17:30:30 -0600
Subject: Re: [siobhan] Digest Number 310

Hi all,

I have to chime in, as it were, on the comments made about Siobhan. I'm in complete agreement with Christopher. Bananarama are not the band they once were - and that is certainly due to Siobhan's departure.
 
Why haven't we heard anything from her? I think we all know the answer is Politics, Darlings! Record producers (and possibly Dave Stewart) have done her in.

Sarah, I believe that we're all entitled to our opinions BUT...
If you want to slag off Siobhan please do it elswhere!
and as for your unbiased friends who think the third (And Quite Brilliant) SS album is Crapola - I think you ought to find some other friends love - these have got their musical tastes up their arses! :)

Anyway please all of the negativity and pettiness really should end.  We should be sharing news and music - which I believe, Sarah, was your intent in the first place. I can't wait to get my CD's in the mail! It is just unfortunate that things are either misconstrued or whatever.

Please people, let's try and remember to treat each other with respect and common courtesy. 

Love N' Kisses,
Jeffreak!

Oh dear, Have I crashed my car again? Have I killed another friend?
oh life's so tragic...

*************************************
From: Sarah Mager 
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 13:18:18 +1300
Subject: Re: [siobhan] Digest Number 310

Hi,

Enticed out of my email cave for a few caustic remarks on this email:

>tracks. so let's stop slagging.
>now this is my opinion and for discusssion only  and i would really like to
>hear your opinions----------
>ba- ba-  banana

Are you sure you want to hear my opinions? Like all good emails my last was
one to entice the reticent into discussion (it worked btw). And of course,
everyone missed the bit where I said I really liked the third album, but my
point was, that as fans we are so far up the arse of Siobhan fandom that we
lose perspective.  My point was that non-fans or people who had a passing
interest in Hormonally Yours don't like the third album, London Records
were too embarrassed to release it to recoup their enormous losses on it.

And I never intended for a direct comparison of Bananarama vs. Shakespear's
Sister.  I never take the moral highroad that Bananarama are musically
better than anyone.... (even I have enough perspective to realise that
their talents are at best ephemeral).  

Also, I dispute all of your claims that Dave Stewart had little or no
influence on Shakespear's Sister. She lived with him, loved him, married
him, bore his children. Of course she was influenced by him. He may not be
there in the credits or liner notes but the two albums are intrinsically
influenced and shaped by Dave's presence in Siobhan's life. That's like
saying that Bananarama's present choice to cover "Careless Whisper" hasn't
been influenced by Andrew Ridgeley.

bananastein
(Signature)
bananastein@clear.net.nz / bananastein@yahoo.com
http://www.geocities.com/bananastein/index.html

*************************************
From: JemBeautiful@aol.com
Date: Sun, 29 Oct 2000 21:30:59 EST
Subject: Re: [siobhan] Digest Number 310

> After giving the 3rd album a second chance I have found myself 
> liking it much more than I did on first listen.  I think some of the tracks 

This first time I listened to it, I didn't like. I gave it a second chance 
and now its one of my fav CDs of all time
later
Brian

 TotallyJem, SpiceBeautiful, Step2theSTEPS, "Fab Ferret 5" and beyond..., 
NanaNanaBananarama, Mojo Jojo's Powerpuff Girls, BS's Bull Poo page, SHEPPY 
DOLLS by B.Sheppard
http://www.geocities.com/Hollywood/Highrise/2572/BJS.html 

*************************************
From: "Dean Lucas" 
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2000 13:28:18 -0000
Subject: [siobhan] Re:  i give up

> roight ok, I knew it would come to this eventually, you've lost 
> subject matter regarding ss and siobhan so now you're off getting 
> at each other... i got ten emails in my inbox today, 9 of them were 
> you freaks shouting at each other, i just give up, so i'm 
unsuscribing, 

Me too. I don't want my mailbox filled with messages which are 
insults towards either Siobhan, Marcella or Bananarama. Everyone has 
a right to their own musical taste - this shouldn't be the place to 
debate it.

Dean.
http://www.shakespears-sister.com

*************************************
From: mmclaughlin@berwickshirehs.org.uk
Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2000 15:58:52 -0000
Subject: [siobhan] The Third Album?

Does anyone know of any copies of the third album around or will it 
ever see the light of day - just joined the list so would appreciate 
suggestions of where to get it - apart from Napster which doesn't 
work on my office computer.

Michael

*************************************
From: "Lori Downie" 
Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2000 12:05:53 -0500
Subject: Re: [siobhan] The Third Album?

I found a copy of three of the new singles  (the entire album is expected to 
be released within the next couple of months) on ebay; or try 
smoorecords.com...they have copies available as well.

Lori

*************************************
From: "Shakespear's Brother" 
Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2000 12:20:16 -0800
Subject: [siobhan] singles from the third album?!

I search eBay's listings daily for "Shakespear's Sister" and "Shakespears 
Sister" and I've seen no new listings for singles from the third album. When 
I checked Smoo Records' catalog, they had one copy of the "I Can Drive" 
promo CD single and no other titles in stock. Are you referring to another 
group and/or album?!

*Live Your Life Be Free" <<~NICK~>>

*************************************
From: "Rev. Lucifer Love" 
Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2000 12:32:11 -0800
Subject: RE: [siobhan] The Third Album?

I'm a newbie, too, who also joined to see if I could hook up with a copy of the third album somehow. I LOVE the "I Can Drive" single, but all I've heard of the proper album are a couple lo-fi RealAudio clips. I'll, of course, buy the official release when/if Kiss the Icon ever gets that all worked out, but being a big fan, I'd understandably like to hear the music that's been sitting stagnant for a couple years.

If anyone in Listland could help me locate a CD copy or MP3s, it'd be greatly appreciated if you could email me directly.

*DISCLAIMER: I don't work for any music publishing or record company, or a law enforcement agency. My interest is for personal use only.*

-- -- -- -- --
The Rev

http://www.LuciferLove.com
 (new sound clips 11/00)

*************************************
From: JemBeautiful@aol.com
Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2000 18:59:50 EST
Subject: Re: [siobhan] The Third Album?

> I found a copy of three of the new singles

I think that is just the promo from 1996... I think is the date. It also has 
Suddenly and Oh No It's Michael. The album is going to finally be released in 
the next few months. It's on the official web page.
later
Brian

*************************************
From: Marcymailouts@aol.com
Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2000 16:08:57 EST
Subject: Re: Happy Thanksgiving from Marcy

Happy Thanksgiving 
Peace Always
Marcy D...
check out some new mp3s...
http://www.marcelladetroit.com

*************************************

    Source: geocities.com/sunsetstrip/pavilion/3545/ssml

               ( geocities.com/sunsetstrip/pavilion/3545)                   ( geocities.com/sunsetstrip/pavilion)                   ( geocities.com/sunsetstrip)