Following are selected posts to the Holisticat (TM) Mailing List on the subject of fevers. There's a lot of information here, and the posts are arranged in ascending chronological order. If there is a particular word you're looking for, it's probably best to utilize the "Find in Page" function in your edit menu!

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<13 May  99 From: Lee Re: Kitty fever>

Any ideas how to bring down a cat's fever?  Peaches perked up after what the  vet gave her, but her fever appears to be back and she's back to how she was before.  She has had a steroid shot, so homeopathics will probably not be very effective.

Hi Lee ~

Poor Peaches!   Hugs & purrs to her.

I'm still having problems with a recurring fever in Django.   The first time, when it was rather high (plus the time Zach had a 104+ fever) I wrapped a freezer container of blue ice in a towel & placed it in their sleeping spots.   I also wiped them down with a cool, wet towel if the fever seemed high enough to warrant that.

I don't know if this would be appropriate for you, but at this point when Django starts feeling a little warm (temp gets up to around 102.7 on average) I give him a dose of echinacaea, and I've been giving him GSE tabs on a daily basis.

Now for my question...this "fever of unknown origin" has been going on (& off) for about 3 weeks now.   I thought it might be digestive system oriented, (as a reminder...he was a bit constipated & had elevated neutraphils when I took him in before) so I've been giving him psyllium mixtures occasionally, & have added pumpkin to the vegies.  He's pooping quite nicely & regularly now, but the fever still recurs.   Also, he hasn't gained any weight for almost 3 months now, and for a 9 month old, that seems
a bit odd to me.....am I just being neurotic on this count?   My concern really stems from the fever, the fact that he's not eating as well as he used to, and he's not being quite as active as he used to.....OK he is maturing a bit, but he's still a kitten & I think he sleeps too much & is a little too lethargic.

The other oddity I'm noticing is that he licks his lips a lot.   As soon as he wakes up, sees me coming & anticipates attention....it really seems excessive to me.   Does this ring any bells for anyone?

Finances are a bit of an issue  right now ~ after $500 in vet bills for both guys in the last couple of months, & getting no results, I've been hoping I could clear this up on my own, but at this point I'm wondering if more extensive blood tests, or possibly a homeopathic consult, might be in order.

Any thoughts from the knowledgable gallery out there will be most appreciated!

Lee and Jillian,

Have yall tried yarrow tea?  It's really good for reducing fevers.  For humans, the herb boneset (from which homeopathic Gelsemium is made) is excellent but I dunno if it's safe for cats.  If kitty has chills and matches other symptoms of Gels, check that out as an option.  Lee, don't worry about the steroid shot; u can still give Peaches a homeo remedy.  If u like, u can give her a dose of Nux to clear the negative effects of any allo drugs from her system, and then give her a dose of the remedy u want
to give her for her current problem.

<<quite nicely & regularly now, but the fever still recurs.   Also, he hasn't gained any weight for almost 3 months now, and for a 9 month old, that seems  a bit odd to me.....am I just being neurotic on this count?   My concern  really stems from the fever, the fact that he's not eating as well as he used  to, and he's not being quite as active as he used to.....OK he is maturing a  bit, but he's still a kitten & I think he sleeps too much & is a little too  lethargic.>>

I think u are right to want to stay on top of this one, Jillian.  Fever for that long has to have some basis - an infection of some sort, but it must be frustrating to not know what:(  Did u get a CBC done on him earlier?  I'm wondering what the WBC count was on that.  If I remember, u said the neutrophil count was hi.  The GSE is good, but u might want to give him a break from it, and alternate CS w/ GSE?  I'd give acidophilus too just to make sure the good bacteria is replenished.

<< The other oddity I'm noticing is that he licks his lips a lot.   As soon as  he wakes up, sees me coming & anticipates attention....it really seems  excessive to me.   Does this ring any bells for anyone?>>

Will he let you examine his mouth?  Could be he has some infection going on in there, and that's why he has the fever?  Is this since the vet last checked him out?  I hear ya on finances; sure is rough, esp when u can't get a definitive diagnosis.

U could try homeo by looking at these specific symptoms.  I'm teaching tonite so won't be able to help ya but maybe tomorrow if u email me all his symptoms - general (like does he seek warmth, drinks water, etc) and specific - licking lips etc. I can look stuff up in the Reps.  Bunny's got bloody poops again, so I'll have my nose buried in the Reps this weekend anyway:(

Hi everyone -

<<Now for my question...this "fever of unknown origin" has been going on   (&off) for about 3 weeks now.   I thought it might be digestive system  oriented, (as a reminder...he was a bit constipated & had elevated  neutraphils when I took him in before) so I've been giving him   psyllium mixtures occasionally, & have added pumpkin to the vegies. >>

Jillian, from everything I've seen and read (which is by no means exhaustive, just what I've seen :) fevers rarely result from a digestive disturbance, per se. More often, a fever goes along with something like a bladder infection, and the two make the cat feel lousy. Like Sam was puking from a bad bladder infection once. Fevers also cause dehydration, and dehydrated cats don't eat as well.

I went to Cornell CVM's "Consultant" page - where you can search for a diagnosis based on signs. Using fever, constipation and weight loss I found 23 possible diagnoses. Here's the site: http://www.vet.cornell.edu/consultant/consult.asp

I elected sign, then feline for the species and started with fever as a symptom. After you get a few symptoms, use "search for diagnosis"

<<Also, he hasn't gained any weight for almost 3 months now, and for a 9   month old, that seems a bit odd to me.....am I just being neurotic on   this count?   My concern really stems from the fever, the fact that   he's not eating as well as he used to, and he's not being quite as   active as he used to.....OK he is maturing a bit, but he's still a   kitten & I think he sleeps too much & is a little too lethargic.>>

One of mine really doesn't gain any weight unless I free-feed kitten food. I'm fairly certain he has kidney issues, but that's a whole
'nother ball of wax. I think if your intuition is setting off warning bells, you're right to be a little concerned. A 9 month old should still be gaining weight, and his energy should still be high. Jezebel, my youngest, is always up for a game, and invents toys out of whatever she can find. She'll be 2 in September.

<<The other oddity I'm noticing is that he licks his lips a lot.  >>

I agree with Leah - in my experience, this has always indicated nausea.

<<Finances are a bit of an issue  right now ~ after $500 in vet bills   for both guys in the last couple of months, & getting no results, I've   been hoping I could clear this up on my own, but at this point I'm   wondering if more extensive blood tests, or possibly a homeopathic   consult, might be in order.>>

I hear ya on the $$ issue - I'm waiting to get financial aid checks so I can take Max to the vet :( If ya wanna look up the symptoms at the Consultant link above and let me know what all sounds plausible, I can read thru a few things and see if I can figure out which tests might be a good idea.... Don't have much else to offer except good thoughts and  healing vibes for sweet little Django :)

Sandy, Leah & Vick ~  Thanks for all your caring & suggestions!  I've been  crazy-busy since Wednesday eve so this is my first computer time since then  (& I'm tired right now so hope I make sense <G>)

<<Did u get a CBC done on him earlier?  I'm wondering what the WBC count was on that.  If I remember, u  said the neutrophil count was hi.  >>

Yes, had a CBC (do I remember from some recent posts that different labs have  different definitions of a CBC?), and everything was normal except for  "slightly elevated neutrophil"  I don't have a hard copy of the results; will  pick one up as soon as I'm near the vets.   At that point I'll see about  those "band cells & mature neutrophils", Leah   (hey, I just found out about
neutrophils & now you're telling me there's immature & mature ones Leah?   sheesh!  <BG>)  Also had a urinalysis, and all was normal with that.  My   usual holistic/homeo vet was out of town so I saw an allo vet in the same  office.

<<The GSE is good, but u might want to give him a break from it, and alternate CS w/ GSE?  I'd give acidophilus  too just to make sure the good bacteria is replenished.>>

Sandy, good idea on the acidopholus, I'll start some today.   That's exactly  what I'd been planning to do re: the CS; in fact I gave him some yesterday,  and last night, this morn, & this eve he's been zipping around, ate pretty well, temp is normal.  This doesn't mean a lot to me yet, since this has happened before in the last few weeks, but the fever & listlessness have returned after a day or three of normal activity.  Although I do think he ate with a little more gusto this morn than he has been doing.  The lip licking is still going on, tho.

<<Will he let you examine his mouth?  Could be he has some infection going  on in there, and that's why he has the fever?  Is this since the vet last  checked him out?  >>

Yes the licking is new, but everything in his mouth looks fine to me  (however, someone with more experience might see something I don't)

<< U could try homeo by looking at these specific symptoms.  I'm teaching  tonite so won't be able to help ya but maybe tomorrow if u email me all his symptoms - general (like does he seek warmth, drinks water, etc) and specific - licking lips etc. I can look stuff up in the Reps.  Bunny's got  bloody poops again, so I'll have my nose buried in the Reps this weekend  anyway:(>>

Oh dear, sorry poor Bunny!  ::::::hugs & purrs:::::  I'm going to spend some  time documenting his history & symptoms, cause I think I may end up having a constitutional done for him.....since I had a holistic consult done when he first came home, the price of the homeo consult is deducted by the amount of the holistic consult.....still a chunk of change but hopefully it will pay off in health benefits!   Anyway, I'll send you some of the basics & if you run across anything interesting sounding for me to look into further I'd really appreciate it Sandy, thanks!!!

<<Others may have some ideas on this licking of the lips, but in my experience with my pets, this is related to nausea.  Kitty is just not feeling well, combined with the occasional fever, which would cause him to feel hot or thirsty.>>

I don't get the sense that he's nauseated, but I'm trying to watch closely & see if there is any indication of this....so far nothing in my little human brain that indicates it, but how do I know from a human-watching-kitty point of view?  I get more of a sense that he's dehydrated; so I've been pumping 5cc of water into him occasionally.

<< More often, a fever goes along with something like  a bladder infection, and the two make the cat feel lousy. Like Sam was
puking from a bad bladder infection once. Fevers also cause dehydration, and dehydrated cats don't eat as well.>>

Wouldn't a bladder infection show up in the urinalysis?   I'm quite clueless about what the tests show & how to read them....I'll get copies of the tests done & hopefully start educating myself.

<<I went to Cornell CVM's "Consultant" page - where you can search for a  diagnosis based on signs. Using fever, constipation and weight loss I  found 23 possible diagnoses. Here's the site:  http://www.vet.cornell.edu/consultant/consult.asp>>

Vick, thanks for this site!   I'm going through some of the info there, &  I'll see what I find.

In a message dated 5/13/99 3:44:35 PM Eastern Daylight Time, lknipp@ writes:

<< I think the blue ice in towels is an excellent idea  and probably makes him feel more comfy. >>

Another thing that helps to reduce a temperature is bathing in peppermint  tea. You might want to make some peppermint tea and put a wahcloth in it and rub your kitty's forehead with it.

Hi everyone -

<<Yes, had a CBC (do I remember from some recent posts that different   labs have different definitions of a CBC?), and everything was normal   except for "slightly elevated neutrophil" >>

Since Sandy asked about the white count - neutrophils *are* WBC's: they are the ones that ingest and destroy foreign particles and bacteria.

Your cat's CBC sounds lie the true definition of CBC: complete blood count. It should tell you how many of each type of blood cell are hanging around at the time of the draw.

<<Also had a urinalysis, and all was normal with that. >>

If that was normal, you can likely rule out liver and kidney issues. If they haven't done a full blood screen (one that shows liver enzymes, kidney levels - BUN, Creatinine, etc.) I'd definitely get one of those done. We called 'em "vet screens", but your office may have another name for them. Normal results there will help you rule out liver and kidney completely.

<<Yes the licking is new, but everything in his mouth looks fine to me  (however, someone with more experience might see something I don't)>>

If ya hafta go back, I'd mention this to the vet. Does he paw at his mouth? Seem to only use one side to chew? Although the latter could be normal - Skippy only chews on one side of his mouth.

<<I don't get the sense that he's nauseated <<snip>>  I get more of a   sense that he's dehydrated; so I've been pumping 5cc of water into him   occasionally.>>

The water should help, but typically for dehydration, we'd give 100cc's of sub-q fluid, so you may need to step up the syringes :) I get extra water in cats by cheating -- really watering down left over soup liquids, chicken broth and even tuna juice. I also add 5 cc's or so to each feeding.

<<Wouldn't a bladder infection show up in the urinalysis?   I'm quite  clueless about what the tests show & how to read them....I'll get copies of the tests done & hopefully start educating myself.>>

The bladder infection was kinda just an example... an infection should have shown up on the urinalysis. But most infections are self limiting,and will resolve in 5 days regardless of the treatment used, so a urinalysis could be clean on a cat w/ a chronic problem :(

To understand blood work takes time and seeing the crap over and over. The Cornell Book of Cats explains stuff pretty well, and I know Leah swears by Volhard's book The Holistic Guide for a Healthy D*g for this stuff, so ya might wanna see if they have that at your local library. I got an older version of the cornell book for something like $6 on a clearance table at Books A Million, so check those :)

There are also a few websites that explain blood work. My favorite is http://www.neosoft.com/~uthman/lab_test.html . There's also http://www.baysport.com/clinic/bloodexp.html but it's pretty simplistic.

How's Django doing today?

I've been away from home too many hours of the day for the past 3 days to keep as close an eye as I would like on things, but tonite it looks like I've got my old Django back! :D   He's been this active for short times in the past few weeks but his spirit (devilish tho it may be <G>) is really there tonite.  Zachary was the one who turned up his nose at dinner, which was fine w/ Django cause he just ate both portions.  I think Zach doesn't like the latest vegie mix...he shows his disapproval by only coming within a few inches of his food dish, staring at it for just a moment, then scratching the floor nearby & turning around & stalking off.  Usually he'll come back & eat later, but not if someone else polishes off the dish first!

Thanks for the blood work sites Vick...I've bookmarked them for futures.  (Hopefully I won't be needing them too soon).

Interesting thing, I gave Django a dose of Colloidal Silver on Thursday, and within a few hours he seemed to be better.   Another dose yesterday, and another today, and now he seems fine.   Could be that it was just something running its course, but then again, maybe the CS really did the trick for him.

Thanks again Sandy, Vick & Leah for your advice.

Jillian, who is smiling again - in spite of the fact that my busy schedule has resulted in a cold & sore throat :( Django, who is happily creating havoc again >^;;^< and Zachary, who is wondering what happened to the quality of food in this
joint. >^òó^<

In a message dated 5/20/99 6:54:34 AM Pacific Daylight Time, GoForaSailwrites:

<<Our knee jerk reaction in this western world is to force the temperature  down  any which way we can but, if it isn't elevated that much, it might be best to   let it burn itself out.>>

Emily ~

As a reminder of the history of this case, Django started out with a temp of  103.7, chills, not eating, no energy...clearly very sick.  I had a CBC & urinalysis, & the only abnormality was elevated neutrophils.  He was given sub-Q's & I cooled him down & temp returned to normal for several days.   After 5 days temp shot up again & I started GSE & echinacea/goldenseal for a week.   Temp was up & down, mostly up, appetite & energy still low.  I then started CS & again, temp came down & he seemed OK for a couple days, then the same symptoms returned.  3 weeks after the first temp rise, on Tuesday he ate one small bite of food at breakfast, another at dinner & temp was 103.7 again.   After the scare of FELV & FIV was ruled out, and a long conversation with my homeo/holistic vet about all the options, I was ready for antibiotics.

Emily, I really do appreciate your research and your opinions, I just ask that you do the same for others of us who are learning all we can and making our own educated decisions.  Please give us credit for thinking through our decisions.   Some of us (myself included) are deeply anti-allopathic  for ourselves and (in my case, more recently) for our kitties, but that does not mean that I will never utilize the allo meds that are available, when I feel they are called for.

I think it is valuable for all of us to remember that some people on this list are highly knowledgable and educated and experienced, and some are brand new to the concept of holistic cat care.  NONE of our opinions are written in stone!  The nature of education is that, as more is learned, attitudes change, and this goes for health as well.  I think it helpful for ALL of us
to remember that, no matter how firmly an opinion is stated, it behooves us to read, ask, observe, and educate so that we can make our own decisions.

OK, now I'm off my soapbox <G>  No replies are necessary, I certainly don't want to start anything here!