Question144

Why do you think some theists insist on connecting evolution, which is a science, with atheism, which is a lack of belief or disbelief in a god or gods?

• Evolution is the answer to the original question that theist have answered wrongly by saying: "It was all done by the creator". That is the first attack on religion. Evolution also is the answer to most questions that "spiritual" thinkers claim science cannot explain. For instance: The meaning of life? : Survival! Of course theists hate Evolution, and of course, the place it in the camp of the "Enemy". (Peter van Velzen #1107)

• Generally because these theists take their religion's creation story of the earth literaly, and see that evolution provides an explaination for life on earth that does not require the existence of YHVH, Jehova, Allah, Ahura Mazdao, Brahma, (I apologize about the 38 thousand or so creator gods I left out) or even the IPU. They also see it as a plot by us evil satanic atheists to fool little Jonnie into believing that God didn't do it, and that maybe God doesn't even exist.

  There's also the arrogance that we have to be specially created. After all we mustn't be just animals. Biologically speaking, we sure look like animals to me. (Rian B. Jensen #317)

• Pure ignorance. It defies one of their dogmas, so it must be put in the same basket as the rest of defiances. Labeling it as "atheistic thinking" keeps the flock far away from it, not even considering the possibility of giving it the benefit of the doubt. (Angel Arnal #1443)

• Simple.

  The entirety of Christian theology is based on one significant "event"- the creation of "original sin", a policy set into place at the very beginning, with the total screwing of Adam and Eve. Christianity cannot take evolution, nor any non-biblical creation account, as fact, becuase to do so would be to abandon faith in the Adam-and-Eve story, which would cuase their entire theology to fall apart.

  But that's what you get when you try to live inside a house of cards. (JT IceFire #1569)

• I think this has more to do with their views of other theists than their opinion of either evolution or atheists. Fundies are so narrow minded, and so afraid of opening up even the slightest possibility of their being wrong, that they must believe that other theists who accept evolution are actually atheists in disguise. Those theists have just as much faith as the fundies - they just have at least a modicum of reasoning ability. If fundies started to reason logically at all, their entire worldview would fall apart. (Scott Davicson #1045)

• Evolution refutes primitive Old Testament Christianity. Do most Xians go completely literalist? Of course not, but that's because most don't think this through at all, preferring to go quietly along the paths carefully marked by their leaders. Although the leaders are often quite aware of more subtle theologies, it's not to their advantage to try to communicate that any more than forced.

  So, oppose evolution and you maintain a quiet, fleecable population and a high respect job without having to worry about integrity.

  We already know that nearly no Xian, regardless of how educated and intelligent, would consider opposing other Xians, regardless of how ignorant and stupid, if it meant apparently "letting the side down" in front of non-Xians. (Dewey Henize #122)

• Since I started posting here, every week I see at least three or more threads started by theists attacking evolution. I think that they are missing the obvious point, as atheists, we don't accept their Sky-Daddy as real. Some of us see no evidence for its existence, some see evidence for its non-existence. Either way, no god means no creator/designer therefore no creation. No supernatural creation means that the universe and everything in it had to come into being and develop by natural means.

  If a person supports theory A and I support theory B, and even if that person thoroughly discredits theory B, has he proven theory A? I think not. I can still come back with theories C,D E, F, ad infinitum. The only way he can prove A is to present positive evidence for A. So far I have seen no evidence for the existence of god, and overwhelming evidence for evolution as the mechanism for the development of new species.

  BTW, even though I chose a career in science, evolution had very little with my decision to become an atheist. That decision rested more on logical, philosophical, and moral grounds. In brief, I could find no answer as to why a supposedly all good and all powerful deity should treat his own creations so poorly.

  So to the theists, if you want to argue evolution, abiogenesis, or the origin of the universe, please go over to talk.origins, or better yet your own ngs, but if you want to argue them over here, please show us your god first. (John Hachmann #1782)

• Categories:
  1. Believe in evolution.
  2. Believe in evolution except for transition to man.
  3. Believe in guided evolution.
  4. I sometimes encounter arguments about the first cell. Most of these people reject evolution in general, but I don't know about all of them.
  5. Reject evolution, but accept the rest of science and logic.
  6. Reject science and logic.

  Group 6 people exist, but the position is nonsensical because you can't think without logic. The Pope and most Christian leaders don't fall into group 6 -- they can fall into any of the groups 1 through 5. 3 seems to be popular.

  Almost all atheists fall into group 1. It's possible for an atheist to fall into group 3 with the guiding force being a space alien instead of god.

  If the Bible is not 100% true, then either it's not the word of God or God is imperfect. In either case, life after death cannot be 100% guaranteed. Many Christians want that 100% guarantee, so they cling to a literal interpretation of the Bible. They accept the Genesis creation story and stubbornly reject all evidence to the contrary. This rejection of evidence can reach nonsensical levels and they can become antagonistic. Nonsense of Biblical proportions. (Michael Alexander #18)

• I think many theists (fundys that is) see evolution as a non religious belief because from their perspective the only true way to believe is Genesis. They see evolution not as an idea arrived at through the scientific method but as deliberate disobedience to the lord. In short being unscientific in outlook they can not recognise science for what it is. They can not see an idea about or an answer to one of life's questions as being anything but something based in at least some small way on faith. And they confuse what what atheism is. Believing it is necessarily a belief system needing apologies which they see evolution as supplying. They see theist evolutionists are weak and misguided souls. I have heard that they hate theist evolutionists more then atheist evolutionists because they are outside their neat simple black and white ideas. (Peter Kelly #1417)

• Because they base "God" only on their needs, and they can't really articulate their needs. So to many of them "God" is love, because they want to be loved. To others it's law&order, because they need *that*. And some can't say anything, because they have no fucking clue whatsoever about their needs. (Norbert Sima)