mathgenuis1: matt
imbutapawn: trip
mathgenuis1: what is up
mathgenuis1: i am sick as a dog
mathgenuis1: i stopped by your house this weekend
mathgenuis1: your little sister was there
mathgenuis1: nobody else
imbutapawn: not me, for sure
mathgenuis1: for sure
mathgenuis1: are you going back for thanksgiving
imbutapawn: how are you aside from sick, and what are you sick with?
imbutapawn: yes
mathgenuis1: i believe the flu
imbutapawn: non-anthrax?
mathgenuis1: i dont believe so
mathgenuis1: i keep coming up with more questions and losing answers that i thought i had
mathgenuis1: i saw mike brecker this weekend
mathgenuis1: i saw that he was a master of his instrument
mathgenuis1: i have only seen this two other times
mathgenuis1: with the teacher i had for four years and with david leibman
mathgenuis1: i realized that this is something that i want to acheve
mathgenuis1: i dont know if i want this on the saxophone or not
imbutapawn: i understand that
imbutapawn: what would be your other option
imbutapawn: i am trying to achieve it right now as well
mathgenuis1: i dont have any clue
mathgenuis1: i love music
imbutapawn: i love ideas
imbutapawn: you are trying to take the music in your head and put it in the world
imbutapawn: and once you master the technical art of that, you can forget it
imbutapawn: and let go
imbutapawn: and go places that have not yet been gotten to
imbutapawn: like coltrane
imbutapawn: i am trying to do the same thing with my thoughts
imbutapawn: my intellectual thoughts
imbutapawn: learning to express them
imbutapawn: then forgetting it
imbutapawn: and letting go
mathgenuis1: there is a great price to pay to get there
mathgenuis1: it means giving up everything else
imbutapawn: i don't know
imbutapawn: that's one of the things i have been wondering about
imbutapawn: in addition to wondering if, when i finally let go, i will be able to get back
mathgenuis1: i dont think there is any other way to get there
imbutapawn: you might be right
imbutapawn: but i have not gotten that far yet
imbutapawn: it might take everything i have to offer, and then some
mathgenuis1: its all a crap shoot
imbutapawn: i suppose
mathgenuis1: for some reason i get the feeling that there is only one shot
imbutapawn: you mean that like, if you don't start now, that's it?
mathgenuis1: you have to decide to aim for something and there is no time for another real shot
mathgenuis1: there are so many possibilities; i know you see them
imbutapawn: yes
mathgenuis1: but greatness comes directly from singlemindedness
mathgenuis1: Adam and I went to see Amon Oz last week
mathgenuis1: the leading hebrew intellectual
imbutapawn: who is
imbutapawn: ok
mathgenuis1: he introduced us to the possibilites that the hebrew language has to offer
mathgenuis1: apparently it is very different from other languages; different types of words have different meanings
mathgenuis1: basically the language offers a different take on reality
imbutapawn: dude, hold on
imbutapawn: i have something very important to say about that
imbutapawn: but my mom just called
imbutapawn: give me 5 minutes
mathgenuis1: altighty
mathgenuis1: i will keep typing
mathgenuis1: in order to appreciate the language and all of the hebrew works throughout the centuries that it has been in existance you need to dedicate years of your life
mathgenuis1: to understand the humor, the political refrences, historical significances you need to completely dive in to the culture and history of the hebrew speakers throught out history
mathgenuis1: once you do this you have done a great thing, you might even say that you have lived a full life, but there was no time for anything elas
mathgenuis1: else
mathgenuis1: you might have hobbies
mathgenuis1: but you can only do this one great thing
imbutapawn: oh, ok
imbutapawn: i see where you are going
mathgenuis1: and you never know if you will get the job done in the end
imbutapawn: but my interests do not lie in the past
mathgenuis1: it is a big crap shoot
imbutapawn: or in the thoughts of others, as selfish as that may sound
imbutapawn: though that all goes into what you could refer to as your 'vocabulary'
imbutapawn: which, in a nutshell, is simply the range of thoughts you can accurately express to another person
imbutapawn: hey - think about this for me
imbutapawn: this is how i think of the process of communication...
imbutapawn: first, you have a thought which for these purposes we will consider 'pure' (though it really isn't - it's influenced and manipulated by many other things)
imbutapawn: and you have to take than thought and turn it into something that can be expressed, either by language, or music, or some other commonly understood means of communication
imbutapawn: and that usually involves a lot of data compression, which means you lose some things
imbutapawn: and then, you have to transmit the thought
imbutapawn: across time and distance
imbutapawn: where it can be garbled even further
imbutapawn: and then, when it gets to the other person, they have to unpack it, and try to extrapolate backwards to the thought that was originally in your head
mathgenuis1: all true
imbutapawn: so, if you think of it that way, there are some pretty big hinderances to what is commonly known as 'understanding'
imbutapawn: i think i might have found a patchwork fix for that...
imbutapawn: it is what i have called 'trust' for so many years, without really knowing what i was talking about
imbutapawn: trust, to me, is when someone has enough of an understanding of who you are, that you truly believe that when you let a thought go, and they receive and put it back together, it is as close as it can possibly be to your original thought
imbutapawn: trust is believing in that with another person
imbutapawn: so anyway, that takes care of the interpersonal communication
imbutapawn: but there is another side to what i am trying to do
imbutapawn: that involves communication between the world (reality? maybe) and our minds
imbutapawn: the things that exist are not accurately represented by our thoughts of them
imbutapawn: because from a young age, our mind has learned to categorize and compartmentalize and 'interpret' everything we perceive
imbutapawn: for ease of organization, and later, expressio and communication - i assume
imbutapawn: so when we see, we don't really see. and we sure as hell don't understand.
imbutapawn: and i want to
imbutapawn: and i think that this quest is the one i would have to devote myself to
imbutapawn: because the way i see it, it basically involves forgetting everything i know
imbutapawn: forgetting how to think, and forgetting how to talk about what i think
imbutapawn: so that i can begin to understand
imbutapawn: i want to make the world transparent
imbutapawn: that's all
mathgenuis1: do you think it is the lack of information that limits our understanding
mathgenuis1: or lack of true information
imbutapawn: no
imbutapawn: all the information is there
imbutapawn: our minds just mess it up
imbutapawn: partially because they have to for it to be of any practical use to us
imbutapawn: our mind has to attach 'meaning' to everything we perceive
imbutapawn: and that meaning is not something that is an inherent part of the thing itself
imbutapawn: it just is
mathgenuis1: agreed