FYI

Singapore is one of the cleanest cities in the world. I'm not sure if its still this way, but when I went a few years back, gum chewing was not allowed because its very unpleasant to see gum stuck to the mass transit seats and the sidewalks. There's other fascinating things about Singapore's culture such as "no spitting in the streets", "no J-walking", and "mandatory toilet flushing". What a great place to live!!!

Sherman, Howzit ! Thanks for the info on singapore . Yeah , I rather live in places like singapore . Too bad Hawaii , is'nt like singapore . Thanks again , sherman . Take care .

Laine

You're supposed to keep it tight against your body. The tail comes down into a sort of 'cup' shape that fits over the tail's butt. The tail needs to adjust the body so it fits snugly on there and stays in place. It only gets tough when the tail has to go up to help the head do a trick and then has to get back quickly while straigtening the lion and getting back to the end. It's also tough when doing rolls, you need to keep the tail tight around your body to keep it on you.

Geoff

I'm glad that lion dancers are trying to keep the professionalism up. Just to add, since a lion dance is to bring in good luck, one must always be sure not to criticize or behave rudely or crudely especially around the celebrating hosts, this should include comments about the celebrating party, other groups of people and most of all the members performing lion dance group.

Hi everyone. Im doing an "informative" speech in my speech class about lion dancing. I need some suggestions on what to talk about. The subject can't be too broad, nor can it be too technical. The speech also has to be about 5-7 minutes in length. So I've narrowed it down to:

* informing my audience how lion dances are performed
* the principles behind lion dancing (i.e. history, why...)

Keep in mind that I have to keep it simple enough so that people in my class can understand what I'm talking about so nothing too technical such as getting into puzzles and stuff like that. Also besides the website, what are some other good sources of info located on the net? Thanks...

U know at the end of the tai...the stick to control that big furry piece of thing...u know wut im talkin bout...mostly seen on those modern competition style...wit the big furry thing on the tail...the old traditional lion tails dotn have that thing.

Pk

ps i jus read dueces(sorrie if i mis spell yo name i deleted the email alrdy so i cant go bak to it) post...yes i am talkin bout the samethin as he is.

Maybe you can also talk about what Lion dancing represents? As in, it's symbolism. And how, and which ways it's tied into martial arts.

Jason

Jason: That would fall under principles. If I decided to choose this approach, I plan to explain why lion dancing is done and the history that it came from. Thanks.

Actually, the real old lions did have a stick that the tail player would wiggle between his legs. The stick was about 18" long and kind of looked like a long spoon. I think in some cases, it was even designed to look like a butterfly or a bat. It was way before my time....

In china...I've seen lion dancers, sifu's, tail people smoke while they lion danced...especially the tail guy, just casually holding the tail and with a cig hanging from his lips...who says you can't smoke while lion dancing...

I did a similar thing but it was 7-10 minutes and we had to tell a story somewhere in the speech. 5-7 minutes isn't a whole lot of time.

I started by showing a poster I have so people could get an idea of what a lion even looks like, and told very briefly why it doesn't look like a "real" lion. Then I told the most common origin story (the nien monster) and talked about how lion dancing has been used through the ages--exhorcism rituals, celebrations, the ming revolution, and modern competitions.

That was a huge amount to cover, but my intention wasn't to give a comprehensive report, just a glimpse of the rich history so people would be curious to learn more. I ended by telling where they could go for more information.

If your audience already knows what lion dancing is you may want to focus on explaining one routine, or maybe demonstrating some of the skills.

Chris

China and Hong Kong today (and the older generation of Chinese residing in North America) have one of the greatest percentage of smokers in the world (in the 40's and 50's North American Non-Chinese fit this profile as well) and it is true that some Si Fu do subscribe to the habit, but the greatest number of those who do not smoke are to be found in the health and medical professions in China and Hong Kong. So those Si Fu that practice the art in a holistic fashion for health and self-defense, rather than just for fighting, do generally not smoke. So of course one can smoke and do Lion Dance or Kung Fu, but it is not a good thing as it does not set a good example for the youth and is not healthy. Smoking is not a healthy practice both for the smoker and the bystander inhaling the carcinogenic second hand smoke of the smoker.

'Kam' - Wes Cameron

hey everyone does anyone know where in the SF bay area i can get 12 foot long peice of bamboo?? they are for the flags. would anything else that it realitivly cheap work just as well? cause it needs to be strong and straight and light. how do u guys transport such a long peice of flag pole to the site?

For the group I used to dance with, we bought poles for wooden railings. These were cut in half, so they'd fit in a car, but had a bolt and metal sleeve on on end so we could screw them together at the performance. (Kind of like an old fashion fishing pole, since you mention bamboo.)

We rarely used stands to hold them. Usually we got people from the public to hold them which seemed rather popular.

For drying out the drum head before the performance, we used to clamp a 100-W light under the drum pointed at the bottom of the drum head at quite a few hours before the performance, sometimes overnight. Lighting a fire sounds fast, but risky. Even if the weather permited, the neighborhood was not a good place to leave valuable stuff outside.

Cheers,

-Lars

Hey all,

Thanks to all of you for your advice, support and encouragement! Our club now has a big lion and a little lion. Thanks to David Lei for donating the little lion! The kids are sooooo excited! Next weekend we go indoors for the winter and we will begin learning a basic routine that my sifu taught me years ago. I hope I can remember it! Thanks also to Chris Low for sending us a video tape of Lion Dance Competitions! Chris--you can see our lions at our web page: Whitefish Bay Kung Fu Club I'll send you better pix as soon as I get them scanned!

Again, thanks everyone--Lion Dancers Rule!!!!!!

Chuck

It is a scientific know fact that the main cause to fires occuring while lion dancing has been attributed to smoking while lion dancing according to the Chinese surgeon general, Dr. Xu Juding...it is a leading cause to death while lion dancing. Cigarettes left in the lion head or tail and cause the lion to catch fire and burn the lion head and tail. In incident in Dungguan, Guangdong, China, not only the lion dancer and tail were killed while smoking...but a fire also ignited the fireworks factory in which they were lion dancing in front of, killing countless numbers of people. To this day, you can find a warning on the carton of all Chinese cigarettes that states, "The Chinese surgeon general has found that smoking while lion dancing is hazardous to your health". Smoking while liondancing is the leading cause of death. The Chinese surgeon general also advised inhaling firecracker smoke equally as harmful to a lion dancer's health. It was advised that chewing gum is a safer and healthier alternative. Better yet, chewing 'gum cho' is even more healthier. I find that, instead of splitting open and kicking away the tangerines and oranges from the offerings..it's better to save them by placing it down your shirt then eating it afterwards. It can also be made into a very refreshing juice. The skin of the oranges can be dried and also eaten. The seeds can be planted to make a new orange tree as well...Oranges and tangerines are rich in vitamin C and is known to build up the body's immune system...are you still reading this?

Thank god we don't live in Singapore. Signs signs signs.

you bad boy! ;)

You can use a closet pole which you can get up to 20 feet long and the dia is the correct size for most flags and is fairly cheap.

yes, i did a similar speech for my speech class in university for about 10-15 minutes. most of the audiences were never aware of the chinese lion dance. i did well on that speech.

i brought in a lion costume and gave a brief story about how it started with the monster and people fighting it. then it went on and became tradition for new years. demonstrated the different movements of the head like blinking the eyes,ears,mouth, etc. to show the emotions of the lion. and told them to look for the lion dance on campus at chinese new year festivals.

Sorry Everyone

I will not be able to return any emails for an indefite period of time. Thank you for taking the time to send me an email and hopefully I'll be able to return a reply to you someday. Take care.

Thanks everyone for the suggestions. I think Im going to title my speech "principles of lion dancing" and discuss the history, why there is lion dancing, and how it used in special events today.

Hi Everyone,

I'm researching how lion dancing reflects Chinese culture for a school project. Does anyone know if there are women lion dancers? Are there troupes that I could contact where women are participants? Are there groups that are against women lion dancing?

Thanks in advance for your help,

Samantha

Hi Samantha,

Traditionally there were no women lion dancers. Chinese had very specifically defined gender roles and women were not included in the martial arts, and from what I remember hearing/reading were not even allowed to touch the lion dance equipment. There are of course some exceptions to the rule (the Wing Chun style of Gung Fu was developed by a buddist nun and named after a young girl).

Today this has changed and most groups have women on their team, and there are even all-women teams. An interesting point of research may be to interview groups and find out when the first woman joined. I know for my group it wasn't until the late 70s/early 80s.

The only real lead I can give you for all-women groups is the Gund Kwok group in Boston, Massachusetts:

Gund Kwok Lion Dance Troupe, gundkwok@hotmail.com

There was also a team from China(?) of all women in the 1998 Malaysian International Lion Dance Championships, and one in Sifu Tat Mau Wong's San Francisco competition in either 1989 or 1991. I don't remember the names of either of those groups, maybe someone else on the list can help you out with them.

In June oneof the topics we discussed on the list was whether or not it was okay to lion dance in mixed pairs (a woman playing either part of the lion and a man playing the other). Opinion was varied, as were the reasons given for either argument. You can check the discussion out in the list archives at:

http://www.oocities.org/lionscave1/Archives/000601.html

There are also several women lion dancers on this list, maybe you could interview them.

Okay, that was long, but I hope helpful,

Chris

P.S. I'm interested in learning what you find out--please email me a copy of your report when you get it done, thanks!

10-29-00. Sunday

It was today that the Taiwan Cultural Festival was held from 10 a.m.-6 p.m. at the McCoy Pavillion at the area of Ala Moana Park, in Honolulu, Hawaii. Because, I had to do some priority stuff, I could'nt make at 10 a.m. at 11 a.m. was the lion dance blessing, I ofcoarse missed it. Because, I got there at about 12 p.m. But, as I was driving around in my pick up truck. I saw a white van, with guys with red shirt with the lion head picture in the back. They were members of the Chinese Physical Culture Assn. (Jung Mo Tai Ouk Oui) the first and the oldest kung fu club, to be established in Hawaii.

They did a skid, with short poles there were atleast 13 people involved with the performance. The performance was fabulous. They had a nice white head and white tail with matching pants to go along with the head and tail of the lion. before the performance they were practicing in the park around the McCoy Pavillion. And the performance attracted people looking from there cars, tour buss, one man in his wash & wax business mini van, was tying up traffic when he stopped in front of the stage area, but on the opposite side of the street. The car behind him over took him, lucky there were'nt any car comming on the other side of the street. Otherwise there would've been an accident. But, lucky there was no accident.

For those of you Hawaii people like me, check the channel 2 news evening news at 6 p.m. other than that you can contact channel 2 news for a copy. If you want. Ofcoarse, the head had a minor fall, the head player fell forward but prevented by stepping forward with his right foot. But they corrected themselves by going back on the jongs. but they were great, everything was perfect, they have always been better. From a long time ago they have gotten into doing the Championship style lion dance. Mainly, because the lion dance skid is very much exciting.

The jung mo club, probably used the nice red head large and a medium size lion head for the lion blessing ceremony, for the opening of the Taiwan Cultural Festival. but, I forgot what color medium size lion head they were using, sorry. All, I know that it was good though. I thought that the 5 clubs in Hawaii, was going to be comming out. But, I was wrong, only had Jung Mo. The jung mo kung fu/lion dance club, will be just as good as the other 4 groups in Hawaii. Well, that's for now. Take care now. The music always sounded traditional, that's why as the performance was going on alot of people was comming to watch. Good performance Jung Mo. Bye !

I just want to send a big thanks to the webmaster of this page (Chris Low I believe?) for creating this website. You have made it so much easier for me to do my speech on lion dancing. Before I decided on this topic I was afraid that I would have to search high and low to be able to find much information on what I need. But your webpage has done all that for me and now I have so many resources I don't know where to start!

This is a question to all of you: Which story should I use to explain the history and origins of lion dancing? I'm having a hard time picking one out. Thank you all!

has anyone seen this Hong Kong movie called "Born To Be King" It's actually Young and Dangerous #6. They had a funeral scene in Taiwan with these different type of lion heads. They way they played was very different from anything i seen. They would swing the head almost down to their waist from left to right. Anyone know of this?

Being rudeness or being unprofessional begin with intent, if the lion peeing was to put down, such as peeing on or at someone or another lion, then I would feel the line was crossed. Traditionally if someone did that to another lion then all hell might break lose. If because part of your chang is to drink while your standing on the pan or whatever, and then pee afterwards, especially for entertainment purposes then I see no insult. It has no ill intent.

Lions are to bring in good luck, happiness etc... to add to the prospicious occasion. If the group itself does not have this intention, then the blessing that the lion has brought is only as superficial as those who performed it. Many think professionalism is only external, especially in appearance, but truly it must be from deep within.

Many traditionalist consider kicking the chang as crude, what's your take on this?

Hhm.. the message below was sent to list-help@liondancing.org for some reason.. it looks like spam, but at least it wasn't sent from a forged address and seems to be on topic too, so I'll forward it to you guys. Maybe some will find it interesting.

Btw, well over 500 messages were posted on this list since we moved to list@liondancing.org! Next up: 1000 messages :-)

Regards,

Serhat Sakarya

---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Tue, 31 Oct 2000 15:05:56 +0800
From: James Wong
Subject: Lion Dance

Dear Friend,

As a fan of the lion dance, you will certainly be enchanted by the exquisite detail on the sculpture shown in the attached picture. When you take a closer look at the lifelike sculpture, you will see the talent of the artisan who successfully captured the powerful energy of the traditional Chinese performance. Rendering with breathtaking expression, the sculpture is so real that it looks as the lion will make a leap in any instant.

Being made in fine pewter, the Lion Dance is a treasured gift to your fellow lion dance partner. You will be thrilled by the attractive price and be proud of owning such a unique piece of art in your collection.

Please take a moment to look at the web site

http://www.heritageworkshop.com/buyit/showcategory002.php and check out for the detail of the Lion Dance (#00207) from the category -- Images of Orient.

You may buy from our US site at http://www.heritageworkshop.net if you are situated in USA and Canada.

Sincerely Yours,

Heritage Workshop
www.heritageworkshop.com

Hi again Samantha,

Hope your research is going well.

Check this troupe out in Houston, TX: Kwok Wei Lion Dance Troupe http://24.160.68.56/

They were founded by the late Sifu Annie On from Vietnam. On the photo page there's a shot of them dancing 12 lions for a supermarket. Their contact information isn't listed on the website, but if you're interested I can let you know how to contact the guy who referred them to me.

Take care,

Chris

Hi,

Anyone have any suggestions, plans, etc. on building a drum stand? I'd like to be able to get it off the floor and tilt it--also the kids who want to play it (and me) are too tall for it to be on the floor. Something with wheels would be nice.

chuck

The story I went with was the Nien monster attacking the village. It seemed to be the most common. My absolute favorite though comes from Hawaii. You'll have to check the archives (Apr 23, 1996) to read it. I died laughing when I found it...

Glad you find the site useful--that's why I maintain it! It's hard to believe that it started out as the Lion's Den with only 8 groups, and now it's grown to where sometimes it's hard to keep up with all the new stuff people send me to add. But it's all good and fun. With Serhat and Rob administrating the list now, it's truly a global venture.

Good luck on your speech!

Chris

Hi-

My brother built a stand for My Si Fu and Si Mo's troupe a couple of years back.

Essentially he made the top that sat on a square frame. the top had a hole cut through the centre to allow the drum sound out. The square frame had wheel attached on casters at each corner. To tilt the drum towards Si Fu (who plays and is also tall) he did a three point lift with two in front and one at the back. The two in front were higher than the back piece. This drum stand has worked out well and is still in use now after a good amount of use over the years. I will submit a rough drawing of the plans at a later time ( as soon as I have some time! haha)

hi everyone

anyone knows where I can get videos?? or even the book by Dr. Hu?? (i tried looking through bookstores but they don't have it) and does anyone know if it is any good or what it is about??

clue me in please... thanks

Shel