Hello Everyone,

Please just drop this subject and move on to lion dancing. I believe this was the sole purpose of this list.

Vinh Nguyen

O ya dave...i reserved a copy too earlier...reminding you too...you know how much it would cost about?? so i can ask my parent ahead of time and if they say it cost too much than i can tell you to give my reserve copy to someone else.

I didnt say i know everything about chinese martial art...i just said tehre were a southern shaolin and a northern shaolin which i thought u didnt know since u didnt talk or say anything bout the southern shaolin in yo response.....hmm i never contriubuted anything positive on the list before??...hmm...not sure if yall remeber...but do yall remeber that time when i try to explain why the vietnamese would use a steel gong instead of those copper gongs??..hmm...that positive rite??....hmm...let see....the time i ask about the lions in once upon a time n china 3...that positive.....thats all i can tink of rite now

Laine Nakachi wrote:

Corey,

Hello, I agree with your post and it makes since too. Since we allready know' how to do lion dance, we should also learn how to repair lion heads. To me peeling the paper mache off the lion head head itself, sounds too delicate. Because of the fact that you don't want to break the bamboo frame. But, I guess if people like sifuchuck had mentioned that they also had reconstructed a fut san lion head, then it must be possible then. I myself have a large multicolor lion head and it's china made.
****************************

Laine,

I hope it's okay with you that I post this to the list, in case other people are also interested in hearing about other techniques for repairing lions.

When a lion is painted by a gifted artist, it hurts to peel the papier mache off the lion's framework. Not the lion, just my soul. If the framework is well made, it should suffer no damage to the binding. We've peeled paper off poorly painted lions and that actually felt okay, because we knew we were going to improve its appearance. This kei lun was actually papered and painted over brand new, because I felt the head didn't match the tail very well.

Anything is possible.

> I was about to reinvest in another lion's head. But some how,
> you probably gave me an idea. And plus if other people who do
> lion dance like you and me can do it, so could I.

Yes you can. Do it for love though, because your time cost to do a good job will probably be much more than the dollar cost of buying a new head.

> By the way corey, where can you get those Sah Gee from anyway?
> How much do they cost. And the last time I repainted my own
> lion head. I used those acrylic type of paint, the people who
> worked ovr at the hobby company in Honolulu, had told me about it.

The supply of sah gee I got comes from Guangzhou and Hong Kong. There are several different kinds used for different purposes. In a pinch, you can use calligraphy paper found in stationery stores that sell Chinese brushes and inks.

> Your post was very interesting and you speak the truth about
> lion head and manufacturing in general. But, your post I have
> to admit was very long. My eyes was getting tired allready, but
> I saved this response to your post for today. You seem to know
> alot about lion dancing as well as lion head and manufacturing
> in general. We can also use your knowlegde.

My love for the art is deep, my talent and knowledge is shallow. There are plenty of people on this list with a great deal of knowledge; the trick is to persuade them to share this knowledge and to gnott erietaight theghm whythe uhnrheel8ed bykrng aynde gnonncense. Because truthfully, I believe it dissuades those with knowledge to share from sharing it. Sorry about the long posts. I'll cut them from now on.

> You must've collected alot of notes then when you were in
> Guangzhou and Hong Kong?

Yes. Short enough? ;-)

> But you know what it'll be nice and great, if lion dance maker could
> create a video or somekind of material on how to repair lion heads.
> But I guess that's impossible because, they probably want us to send our
> lion head back to them, so they can repair themselves, but don't know.

Don't hold your breath. Nobody who makes lions wants to spend time repairing them for their customers. They'd probably much rather sell them a new head.

Corey,

How you doing? I'm glad that you replied to my email post, and yes go ahead and give it to the list@liondancing.org. An I'm glad that my email post on (Lion Dance) Repairs & manufacture. Has given you an idea. Take care.

Laine

I am sending this to the list even though I know I should not - sorry, but it is the last on the topic.

Hello Pk,

Pk - I said you rarely if ever contribute anything positive to the list-well you have pointed out some positive ones-2. The trouble is your unproductive posts outnumber your positive ones and the greater issue is your attitude in the unproductive ones. I hope that you can change-listen and accept the word of those that are more experienced and knowledgeable than yourself, watch how you word things so that your words are not perceived as insults or impoliteness (although we all can word things wrong at times) and if you can try to use more proper English and please do continue to contribute positive initiatives and responses to others initiatives on this site.

'Kam'- Wes Cameron, Si-Fu

Lion Dancers,

Hello, anyway I just wanted to share with you my input on this subject. Lion Dancing by Choy Li Fut practitioners would do their performances the way sifu wes, has described. The difference is that they would do the traditional kung fu salute, do a short set which involves block and punch, kick. And the last move a high spinning kick. Then both the head and tail would quickly as they can, get into the lion's head and tail. And do a sleeping lion routine, and followed by 3 bows right, left, and middle. From their do the hanging horse stance with the lion's head snapping in the air with the mouth closed. And from there doing their tradtional lion dance.

Because, in Hawaii kung fu club's like the Kong's Sil Lum Pai Kung Fu Assn. And the Au's Shaolin Arts Society would do their lion dance this way. Although Au's Shaolin Arts society it's sifu had branched off from the original kung fu assn. which was Kong's Sil Lum Pai Assn. My long time friend was involved with Kong's Sil Lum Pai Assn. Until he continued his training with Sifu Mak Hin Fai of Seattle. Originally sifu Mak Hin Fai was originally teaching Choy Li Fut Kung Fu in Honolulu, and the lion dance to the students of Kong's Sil Lum Pai Kung Fu Assn. While Kong's Sil Lum Pai and Au's Shaolin Arts Society, is teaching Hung Gar & Choy Li Fut.

And every kung fu club in Honolulu would have their own hand formation. And they would jump over the lion's head and tail, get into the head and tail as quickly as they can. Do sleeping lion routine, do the 3 bows right, middle, left. And start their traditional lion dancing. Like Lung Kong Physical Culture Club in Honolulu. They do their traditional lion dance at all the Daiei store in Honolulu, Hawaii. For New Year's day. I guess these hand formation or short kung fu sets rather, are all created to show respect to the past kung fu masters or sifus who had died long time ago. So probably students and members of a kung fu club would show respect to their kung fu ancestors, as they are starting their lion dance performance to the public. Which I think is good. But there are ways to do it, as Geoff Hudson would have his students do cartwheels over the lion's head and tail.

So to me it is traditional to do this. If I'm not mistaken, long, long time ago. In Honolulu, The Kuo Min Tang Society which is a kung fu club I think back in the 80's did this routine before they had started off, their traditional Lion Dance they did cartwheels over the head and so on. Also the Gee Yung Club did this routine too, at one of their chinese New Year Performance. They did a short hand formation and jumped over the head and tail of the lion, and did the sleeping lion routine, the 3 bows, and began their lion dances. Okay before I make everybody go to sleep, because of my long email post, take care.

Bye. Happy Late Thanksgiving.

Laine

the movements before entering the lion is to showoff your gungfu and gungfu style to everyone to let people know what you're all about before entering. it also puts the dancer in the right state of mind as well as a formal salutation of respect.

maaaan..KAm....you sure been hard on poor PK...>message edited on request<..you should be more accepting of his style and age instead o being the list's gestapo tryin to get everyone to gang up and kick him off the list and creating a air of hostility...if you don't like his posts..just delete it..if you don understand ebonics and gangsta rap...either learn it or jest ignore it by deleting it...PK's age is the ideal age for getting into lion dance and you jus wanna kick him out and discourage him...maan....

Hi there,

some general comments about the recent arguments going on on this list.

As I understand it, it is a list on which people are cordial and polite to eachother. This will prove more and more difficult as the list grows, but I believe it is doable and highly preferable. The fact that other lists can be more 'violent' than this one means little - we don't have to follow bad examples, right? Flames can be exchanged in private email.

There was some talk about banning.. this would be a sad measure to take, since it indicates failure to resolve matters normally. I really do hope it will not come to that. If it will, however, signing up under different names, etc will not really help a lot. Interest should lie in preventing being banned in the first place, not trying to circumvent it.

I personally do prefer well written emails and I generally don't even try to read those that are badly written. But that might be a somewhat elitist approach.

On a totally unrelated note, the freud server has officially died; it has been taken out of the name servers even, so liondance@freud.et.tudelft.nl is also.. dead.

Regards,

Serhat Sakarya