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>From EVANS@BINAH.CC.BRANDEIS.EDU Fri Sep  3 02:58:25 1993
Date: Thu, 2 Sep 1993 14:32 EDT
From: Ronald Hale-Evans 
Subject: Sketch of a binary language
To: conlang@diku.dk
Message-Id: <01H2H5LW834G9AMFKZ@BINAH.CC.BRANDEIS.EDU>
X-Vms-To: CONLANG
X-Vms-Cc: EVANS

Howdy, conlangers!

Here's a tidbit I found on Delphi that you might enjoy. I have
difficulty understanding it myself. My main question is, does this
language have a vocabulary?

I am going to invite the author of this piece to the list.

-- Ron H-E

================================================================

This file describes an artificial language I have been attempting to create.
This is its first public appearance.  (C) Copyright 1991, by Tom Breton

Note that this sketch may not be complete and may need to be altered at a
later date.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Structure, overview
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

The central principle I have used has been simplification. I have tried to
reduce meaning to the fewest reasonable number of units of meaning.

I ended up with three.


1) What I call 'binding'. It is like a pronoun. You can also think of it as
a variable-name in a computer language. You bind an arbitrary name to a part
of a state-transition or to a number.

A binding is of one of 2 types, descriptive or asserted. 

   If it is descriptive, the name it uses 
EXCLUDES EVERYTHING INCOMPATIBLE WITH WHAT THE STATE-TRANSITION EXPRESSES
(for a state-transition), or
IS QUALIFIED BY A NUMBER (if it is a thing)
  Think of it as qualifying a noun with various adjectives.


   If it is asserted, it is 
ASSERTED TO BE COMPATIBLE WITH WHAT THE ST EXPRESSES, or 
ASSERTED TO BE ENUMERATED (or ASSESSED) ACCURATELY BY THE NUMBER.
  Think of this as words on either side of "is", "am", or "are"
Assertive bindings also have a place where they can be bound to a probability.



1A) Mapping: At some time in the future, this will be expanded to include a
'key' that can map out in lesser or greater detail what is being left out.



2) The core concept, what I call 'state-transition' (ST). This concept
includes:
2 STATES, and
AN OPERATION THAT DEFINES BY WHICH PROCESS THE FIRST STATE IS ACCESSIBLE TO
THE SECOND and/or 
A THIRD STATE(S) WHICH MUST BE CROSSED TO GET FROM THE FIRST TO THE SECOND.

The ST can be bound to a name.


 If there neither a operation nor a middle state is specified, the operation
 is logical negation: If the second state is incompatible with the first,
 it is considered accessible to it.

   Different things are bound to one pole are thereby described or asserted
   to be equal.

   Things are bound to opposite states are described or asserted to be
   incompatible.


3) Number. A number bound to an operation signifies that it is repeated that
many times.

The number can be bound to a name.



Control characters: These would not be neccessary if the language proceeded
in a perfect environment, but of course it doesn't.

Controls characters are not at all complete. They mean such things as,
"oops, that last was not what I meant" or "the next utterance will be a
name" or "this is a special ellipsis, referring to something outside the
language such as what I'm pointing to"


---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Expression, overview
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

There are many different ways of expressing this language

 1) Speech  
  It's broken into pairs of syllables, and specific sounds can only come at
  specific places in the pair.

   Sounds that don't fit into that are used to represent control characters.


 2) Poetry   
  The speech way has so few rhymes and is not particularly mellifluous, so
  I've worked on a poetic variant suitable for singing. It will
  automatically format into harmless little rhymes, with a fixed metric
  foot.  It is not at all complete.

   The same sounds as in speech are used to represent control characters.


 3) Raised-dots
  This system uses more dots per character (12) than Braille but never uses
them all. I find it easier to identify by touch than real Braille. It moves
in a plow-the-field style instead of left-to-right

   Violations of the which-dots-can-be-used-at-the-same-time rule are
   control characters


 4) Gestural
  Like a sign language, but more regular. This combines hand-shape, hand
  orientation, motion, and secondary hand shape/position.

   Free one-hand gestures are used for control characters.


 5) Script
  For freehand writing. This also moves in a plow-the-field style. Each
  stroke by itself conveys a few bits of meaning.

   Dotted characters are control characters.


 6) Printed
  Suitable for a printer or TTY. It consists of short lines in any of 4
  orientations (-|/\), in groups of 16.

   Control characters are round instead linear.


 7) Iconic
  Made with Icons: 
  A fish-shape [  X) or |><)  ] for the state-transition, 
  partially filled-in bars with triangular ticks along the sides for numbers,
  connecting lines like an electrical circuit diagram for binding,
  rectangles for mapping[ ]

   Control characters will act directly on the screen.


 8) For mechanical storage.
  Bit-for-bit representation, with conventions to make storage space smaller
and indexing easier.

   Every 16 units, there is a 4-bit character which points to the next
   control character, if any, or says '0' if there is no such character in
   those 16 units. If there is one, the count to 16 is reset right after it.



----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Structure Syntax: This is how the structure is translated into bits:

name: 
.     |: any 4 bits except 0000 :| (repeat as desired) 
      (0001 means that the foregoing part encapsulates the next. In its own
context* the string may be used without everthing before 0001, at all other
times the whole is neccessary)
.     0000 (Terminates the name string)
end of name

   (* This context will have something to do with mapping, but as yet I
don;t know what)

Binding:  
.     name (If it's null, the rest of this is omitted)
.     2-bit index for what comes next: 
{00: This binding is descriptive only, 01:name of the proposition follows,
10: probability follows, 11: both follow)
.     [name of proposition]
.     [number: probability] (The exponents both assume an initial -1, a
negative mantissa is interpreted as 1-x)
.     00: terminates the binding
end of binding


Mapping is to be defined later.


State-transition:
      00
      |: binding(s) :| (to the first state. Terminated by a null (0000)
binding.
      |: binding(s) :| (to the second state. Terminated by a null (0000)
binding.
      |: binding(s) :| (to the median state. Terminated by a null (0000)
binding.
      |: binding(s) :| (to the transition operation. Terminated by a null
(0000) binding.
      name (if any)
      (1111) terminates the ST
end of state transition


Number-part: Expressed in binary notation where groups of 2 bits express a
single binary digit in signed redundant binary notation.
( 11 = 1, 10 = 0, 01 =-1, and 00 terminates the string. )

Number:  (usually expressed in floating-point notation)
      01
      4-bit index for what comes next, repeated every 4 number-parts if
      neccessary.
      1st bit: Does anything come before the exponent?
( If the 1st bit is 0,
      2nd bit: Do we have an exponent?
      3rd bit: and a mantissa?
      4th bit: And does anything follow this? )
( If the 1st bit is 1, the next 3 say, "OK,  how many places of
exponents to the exponent are we gonna need?" 000 means, try again with an
8-bit index)
      [number-parts as specified in the above]

Pairs before the default are an exponent *to* the exponent and precision.
Pairs afterwards are moments of probability, starting with precision.
(The mantissas afterward assume an initial 1 unless there is no exponent.
The exponents express a relative difference from the previous exponent, not
an absolute exponent.


----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Exression Syntax:


Speech: 4 types of sound, each of which have 4 sounds:

    vowel,liquid,silibant,consonant
00:  ee      ee/y  th        t        
01:    r     sh        k 
10:   l     s     (silent) 
11:  oo      oo/w  f         b


The sequence for an accented syllable is: silibant, consonant, liquid,
vowel, liquid.
For an unaccented syllable:silibant, consonant, (schwa), liquid.

If two adjacent sounds are in the same column above, the second is left out.
The only exception is consonants, where that's unworkable because silance is
one of the sounds. Same-row consonant-silibant pairs switch places, because
that is slightly easier to pronounce.

This yields a 24 bit channel per foot. There are 2 more easy bits to be had,
in voiced/unvoiced nature of a foot and which syllable goes first, but I'm
reluctant to break up a nice multiple of 4.




Song/poetry: This is incomplete. In singing, short syllables are exactly 1/2
the length of long ones if there is no length given.

Feet will be divided into sections, and some sections will
repeating the last foot for rhyme and alliteration, some will be fresh.

 A foot is grouped into 3 parts: 
The silibant, consonant, and first liquid from its first syllable, whether
that syllable is accented or not.
The vowel and second liquid from its accented ayllable
The silibant, consonant and liquid from its second syllable.

The metric foot persists until changed, (speech decides it anew each foot)
Unlike speech, you can use patterns not containing exactly one short and one
long syllable.




Raised dots:
There are 12 positions a dot can appear in:

1  1' 8   [another  ]
2  2' 9   [character]
3  6  3'  [starts   ]
4  5  4'  [here     ]


For the numbers with a prime (') symbol, always either the number or the
primed number has a dot, ( normal = 1, prime = 0 ) 
For the others, there's a dot if the bit is 1, otherwise none.


This is written plow-the-field style, first left-to-right and then
right-to-left.
If there is a dot in all three of 4, 5, & 4', that means the line is about
to reverse itself. The pattern does not rotate when it reverses.




Gestural:

The gesture begins with a motion of the dominant hand to a position where
the hand touches something.

The dominant hand's orientation takes 2 bits, its motion takes another 2,
its hand-shape takes the first 4 bits, and the secondary hand's shape &
position take 4 bits.

Hand orientation: 00: Palm down, 01: palm toward one'sself, 10: palm away
from ones'self, 11: palm up.

Motion:  00: Make a circle, 01: move from the other hand's shoulder, 10:
move from the other hand's hip, 11: move from the same hand's hip

Hand-shape: In brief: Thumb for the first bit, index finger for the second,
middle finger for the third, and pinkie for the fourth.

At more length, these are approximate regular American hand-sign
equivalents: (Sorry, I can't do much for British or Australian signers who
may be reading this)

0000: O, 
0001: A, 
0010: D, 
0011: L, 
0100:  
0101: V, 
0110: U (Using only the thumb and the middle finger is too hard)
0111: 3, 
1000: I, 
1001: Y, 
1010: , 
1011: , 
1100: F,
1101: 5 (again, the sign that would be here if we followed the pattern is hard
1110: B
1111: C

Secondary hand's orientation and miscellaneous: 
0000: Mirroring the primary hand
0001: (The primary hand touches the chest)
0010: (The primary hand touches the chin)
0011: (The primary hand touches the secondary hand's elbow)
0100: Palm down, middle 3 fingers extended (W)
0101: Palm up, middle 3 fingers extended (W)
0110: Palm down, index finger out, middle finger down (K)
0111: Palm up, index finger out, middle finger down (K)
1000: Palm down, index and ring fingers crossed (R)
1001: Palm up, index and ring fingers crossed (R)
1010: Palm down, index and ring fingers both curved
1011: Palm up, index and ring fingers both curved
1100: palm down, hand with all fingers together and thumb out
1101: palm up, hand with all fingers together and thumb out
1110: Palm toward yourself, hand with all fingers together and thumb out
1111: A fist





Script: Each stroke expresses 4 bits:
    1 : The direction (1 = upward, 0 = down)
    2 : The rotation at the beginning of the stroke (1 = clockwise)
    3 : The rotation at the end of the stroke (1 = clockwise)
    4 : Whether it's connected to the next stroke (1 = yes, 0 = no)




Printed: Each line expresses 2 bits by being in one of 4 orientations:
{00 = -, 01 = /, 10 = \, 11 = | }

Each line has a tiny dot beneath it so that adjacent horizontal lines don't
cause a problem counting them.

These are grouped by powers of 16, first a horizontal left-to-right line of
16, then a top-to-bottom list of 16 such groups, then 16 of *these*
left-to-right again, until you run out of page space.




Iconic: There is a 1-to-1 correspondence between symbols used and structure.
The exact implementation is up to the application developer.
There is also a 'link' icon which can be expanded to show parts of the text
not on the screen, a map box in reverse video.



Mechanical storage: There's no trick to storing a stream of bits. But I hope
to use the structure of the language to make it easier to store and
retreive. This is incomplete.

For instance, often repeated sequences are turned into symbols, which are
listed at the beginning of the whole.
Numbers can be changed from signed redundant binary into ordinary binary.


----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Usage: Definitely the trickiest part. You can't approach this language with
the idea of finding equivalent words and making a mental dictionary of
translations. You must dissect your thoughts, as it were, into the basic
concepts of this language.

For instance, the idea of counting something:

 Perhaps you would count by comparing the entire thing (B) to a standard
 object, (A). Then you would descriptively bind number to A and assertively
 bind both to the same pole of an ST without a transition rule, to assert
 that they are equal.
 
 Or, if you were counting some things in the group and not others, perhaps
 cows in a field without counting horses, you would define the operation of
 comparing to your standard by descriptively binding your standard to the
 second state of an ST, and taking the operation from that with an assertive
 binding, attach that name to another name to copy it, and enumerate it with
 regard to the group you are counting.


One thing that's needed for this is an a priori system of measurement. Such
a system will need 3 basic units, each insufficient to generate the others.
Two are basic and obvious (the speed of light and Planck's constant), what
the third may be is not at all apparent to me.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

I've tried to explain this as clearly as I can, but at points in the file
I'm sure I have not been able to. It's a particular difficulty in describing
a language that doesn't follow the usual "Here's a word, how it's pronounced,
how it's written, here's an English synonym" pattern.  I hope to be able to
explain it more obviously as this progresses.


Tom Breton

on Delphi, TomBreton
on CompuServe, 71141,3433


Permission is hereby given to disseminate this file in any medium, so long as:
1) It is not changed or altered in any way, including this notice.
2) There is no fee charged for it. A nominal fee to cover only the cost of a
diskette or similar physical media is acceptable. An online service may
charge only normal connect-time charges for this file.
3) It is made clear this version is not final.
4) It is made clear that the gestural and raised-dot symbols herein are not
the same as Braille and sign language as presently used.

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * 
"The Sea refuses no river; remember that when a beggar buys a round."
--Pete Townshend * * * * * Ron Hale-Evans, evans@binah.cc.brandeis.edu
PGP 2 public key: finger evans@binah.cc.brandeis.edu




>From martyb@vnet.IBM.COM Thu Sep  9 23:09:51 1993
Received: from vnet.ibm.com by odin.diku.dk with SMTP id AA21193
  (5.65+/IDA-1.3.5 for /usr/spool/listserv/catmail -L CONLANG -f); Thu, 9 Sep 93 23:09:51 +0200
Message-Id: <9309092109.AA21193@odin.diku.dk>
Received: from BLDVMB by vnet.IBM.COM (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with BSMTP id 1682;
   Thu, 09 Sep 93 17:08:02 EDT
Date: Thu, 9 Sep 93 15:08:55 MDT
From: "Martin R. Bartels" 
To: conlang@diku.dk, esperanto@rand.org
Subject: Solresol

Does anyone know where a description of Solresol in either
Esperanto or English (or both would be best - so I dream)
of "Solresol" is available?

For anyone totally unfamiliar with this planned language,
it's Jean-Franc,ois Sudre<'s "Langue Musicale Universelle"
(Solresol) - a language based on music.  It is briefly
mentioned in David Richardson's "Esperanto: Learning and
Using the International Language" (p.27), and Mario Pei's
booklet "Wanted: A World Language" (p.11-12), as well as
others, I'm sure.

Quoting from the latter source:

   The early 19th century, for instance, saw Jean-Francois
   Sudre's "Langue Musicale Universelle", or Solresol,
   which was based on the international names of the
   musical notes, with all words formed out of combinations
   of the syllables "do, re, mi, fa, so, la, si [sic?]".
   Statistically, these combinations yield seven one-syllable
   words, 49 of two syllables, 336 of three, 2,268 of four,
   9,072 of five, for a total of 11,732 primary words, a
   respectable vocabulary in any language.  Shifts of stress
   from one syllable to another yielded additional words and
   separate grammatical forms.  The language could be sung,
   played, or hummed, as well as spoken.  It could be written
   as music.  It could be expressed in taps, or even colors.
   Solresol gained wide acceptance, and was sponsored by such
   figures as Victor Hugo, Lamartine, von Humboldt, and
   Napoleon III.  But it became, so to speak, extinct in the
   early years of our century.

This is as much as I know about Solresol, but I would like
to know more - not really on any practical level (as with
Esperanto, and possibly Lojban), but I really would like to
know how this language was recorded in so many media, and
perhaps someday I'd like to try to compose some music
"which says something."

Any information would be appreciated, and can be sent to
me directly at  or posted if the interest
seems general enough.

Thanks everyone!

---Marty   



>From shoulson@ctr.columbia.edu Fri Sep 10 21:08:13 1993
From: (Mark E. Shoulson) shoulson@ctr.columbia.edu
Date: Fri, 10 Sep 93 15:05:47 -0400
Message-Id: <9309101905.AA17605@startide.ctr.columbia.edu>
To: conlang@diku.dk
In-Reply-To: "Martin R. Bartels"'s message of Thu, 9 Sep 93 23:20:11 +0200 <9309092109.AA21193@odin.diku.dk>
Subject: Solresol

I, too, have been looking high and low for anything that would actually
give me any insight into Solresol, but it doesn't seem all that easy.  I've
pretty much given up hope of finding anything in English; I'd probably
settle for French and this point and do what I could to understand it (Rick
H., you still out there?  Any pointers?  I'm positive I've asked this
already, but I don't seem to have a good answer.  hey, I just found
something that Eric Floehr posted here back in October 1991, which he got
out of _The Artificial Language Movement_ by Andrew Large; I'll try to
repost it.  It's still not enough.  Any language this unusual makes me itch
to see it!

~mark

P.S.  Wait!  I found the pointers Rick H. sent me last August.  Not that
they'll be easy to track down...

To: shoulson@ctr.columbia.edu
Subject: stuff
From: jwt!bbs-hrick@peora.sdc.ccur.com (Rick Harrison)
Date: Tue, 25 Aug 92 13:50:15 EDT
Organization: The Matrix

Solresol
--------
 
Gajewski, Boleslas
Grammaire du Solresol, ou langue universelle de Fr. Sudre
Paris: 1902 (44 p.)
 
Sudre, Jean Francois (1798-1866)
Langue musicale universelle
Paris: 1866 (480+ p.)
PM 8008 .S94
 
also described in:
 Couturat, Louis & Leau, Leopold
 Histoire de la langue universelle
 pp. 33-39

Good luck!



>From dasher@netcom.com Sat Sep 11 20:22:45 1993
Date: Sat, 11 Sep 93 11:23:04 -0700
From: dasher@netcom.com (D. Anton Sherwood)
Message-Id: <9309111823.AA28030@netcom3.netcom.com>
To: martyb@vnet.IBM.COM
Subject: Solresol
Cc: conlang@diku.dk

I believe there's a longish description of Solresol in HISTORIO DE LA
MONDO-LINGVO (not the easiest book to find!).



>From donh@netcom.com Sat Sep 11 22:04:59 1993
Message-Id: <9309112005.AA21127@netcom2.netcom.com>
To: conlang@diku.dk
Cc: donh@netcom.com, donh@netcom.com
Subject: Re: Solresol 
In-Reply-To: Your message of Sat, 11 Sep 93 21:29:14 +0200.
             <9309111823.AA28030@netcom3.netcom.com> 
Date: Sat, 11 Sep 93 13:05:17 -0700
From: Don Harlow 


Dasher (Anton Sherwood) wrote:

> I believe there's a longish description of Solresol in HISTORIO DE LA
> MONDO-LINGVO (not the easiest book to find!).
> 
Third edition, updated by Sergei Kuznetsov, was reprinted last year 
by Ruthenia in the CIS (but which of the IS that's in, I'm not sure -- 
Belarus, perhaps?). Author is Ernst Drezen.

Question for the knowledgeable among you: Is _Progreso_ (in Ido) still 
being printed? The last issue I saw was dated 1987 or 1988, and I've 
heard a rumor that it has disappeared -- but I'd like to know for sure, 
one way or t'other.



>From laibow@brick.purchase.edu Tue Sep 14 04:06:30 1993
From: laibow@brick.purchase.edu (The Songbringer -- Marnen to the common folk)
Message-Id: <9309140201.AA22257@brick.purchase.edu>
Subject: help
To: conlang@diku.dk (Conlangs List)
Date: Mon, 13 Sep 93 22:01:38 EDT
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11]

help



>From EVANS@BINAH.CC.BRANDEIS.EDU Wed Sep 15 04:17:17 1993
Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1993 22:15 EDT
From: Ronald Hale-Evans 
Subject: More from Tom Breton
To: conlang@diku.dk
Message-Id: <01H2YD99W7ZC9BVVJN@BINAH.CC.BRANDEIS.EDU>
X-Vms-To: CONLANG
X-Vms-Cc: EVANS

Howdy again, Conlangers. I'm forwarding a message I received tonight
from Tom Breton, inventor of that weird, nearly-vocabularyless
language I posted a couple of weeks ago. Think you'll find it
interesting. 

-- Ron H-E

>Ronald:
> 
>Thank you for your note and your comments.
> 
>How "busy" is Conlang? How many messages a week, and how long are they
>typically? I'm really up to my neck in a big programming project (called
>Tehomega) and I'm afraid I can't spare a lot of attention.
> 
>Also, what are the character of the discussions? Do you discuss
>Loglan/Lojban a lot? Talk over a potpourri of individuals proposed
>languages? Dissect Esperanto? Attempt co-operative projects? Discuss
>abstract principles of language and language design?
> 
>Even if I don't join at this time, I'd like to hear about it, and I'll
>keep it in mind for less busy times.
> 
>Is there an archive site for the list? Even if it's too busy for me to
>jump in and participate, I'd still be interested in the high points.
> 
>> I read the piece about your binary language that you left on Delphi in
>> 1991. I'm having a little trouble understanding how the language
>> works. Does it have a vocabulary?
> 
>You have hit the nail on the head. My foremost goal was to reduce
>vocabulary to an absolute minimum.
> 
>Language constructors want to eliminate grammatical irregularities of
>course, but I to eliminate vocabulary irregularities too.
> 
>I wanted to be able to "construct" a word much as we "construct" a
>sentence. The same way that we can spontaneously and meaningfully say
>things no-one has ever heard before (EG "Look at that cow dancing on the
>roof"), I wanted words to be made. You can well imagine what that could
>do for barriers of jargon and unfamiliar vocabulary. The same way we can
>dissect sentences into orthagonal parts, I wanted words to be treated.
> 
>I tried to do this by using the absolute minimum vocabulary possible,
>letting everything else be syntax.
> 
>The result can best be summed up: "The operation was a success but the
>patient died."
> 
>I can (unless I've made some mistake) show that the basis of RESC, the
>state-transition, is sufficient to describe a Universal Turing Machine.
>This implies that it can in principle it can "construct" anything
>intrinsic to language.
> 
>But the key phrase is "in principle". In practice it took an enormous
>amount of effort to say normal, everyday things. It was like trying to
>talk in machine code. The fact that it took as little or less effort to
>express abstruse mathematical ideas was small consolation.
> 
>I attempted a few changes to save it, but I had to admit that it could
>absolutely not succeed as a language.
> 
> 
> 
>I don't feel it's entirely wasted, though. The advantages of a
>mostly-constructed vocabulary are strong:
> 
>  Barriers of jargon would be easy to not erect. Or says the cynic,
>  when erected, they'd be obvious and easy to bypass.
> 
>  A language completely based on such a small set of rules could be more
>  universal.
> 
>  If you have ever heard an argument turn into a word-game, you can see
>  how vocabulary that tries to stand unattached can frustrate
>  communication. (Or, says the cynic, be _used_ to defeat it.)
> 
>  In principle it's easier to learn, as it requires that less raw
>  information.
> 
>  Again in principle, it can save some time and effort by eliminating
>  unneeded "tag-along" information. Gender-pronouns are a familiar
>  example of this.
> 
> 
> 
>For another (minor) thing, I like the idea of an infinite supply of
>pronouns. Have you ever heard "He trusted in him that he would deliver
>him", from Handel's _Messiah_? I counted (If I remember correctly) one
>hundred and seventy-six ambiguous third-person male pronouns in the
>work.
> 
>I give you permission to forward this to the Conlang list if you feel it
>is appropriate.
> 
>        Tom
> 



* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * 
"The Sea refuses no river; remember that when a beggar buys a round."
--Pete Townshend * * * * * Ron Hale-Evans, evans@binah.cc.brandeis.edu
PGP 2 public key: finger evans@binah.cc.brandeis.edu



>From JLEONI%ucrvm2.ucr.ac.cr@vm.uni-c.dk Sat Sep 18 00:38:34 1993
Message-Id: <9309172238.AA27921@odin.diku.dk>
Date:         Fri, 17 Sep 93 11:33:00 UCR
From: Antonio Leoni 
Organization: Universidad de Costa Rica
Subject:      Informacion
To: CONLANG@DIKU.DK
X-Acknowledge-To: 

Estimados se:ores;

     Como parte de las investigaciones pertinentes para la obtencion
de un grado en linguistica en la Universidad de Costa Rica, necesito
informacion acerca de las lenguas Interlingua (de IALA) e Interlingue
(Occidental).  Aparte de las gramaticas y bibliografia general mucho
agradeceria si me pudieran facilitar las direcciones tanto de correo
usual, como de correo electronico.

     Respetuosamente,

                      Antonio Leoni
                      


ANTONIO LEONI                   VERBA TIBI SUPERSUNT.

                 KIA LA SEMO, TIA LA RIKOLTO.



>From matthew@viper.uk.tele.nokia.fi Mon Sep 20 17:23:05 1993
Message-Id: <9309201523.AA26782@odin.diku.dk>
Date: Mon, 20 Sep 1993 16:22:31 +0100
From: matthew@viper.uk.tele.nokia.fi (Matthew Faupel)
To: conlang@diku.dk, JLEONI@ucrvm2.ucr.ac.cr
In-Reply-To: <9309172238.AA27921@odin.diku.dk> (message from Antonio Leoni on Sat, 18 Sep 93 16:26:58 +0200)
Subject: Re: Informacion

AL= Antonio Leoni 
     in a message sent on Sat, 18 Sep 93 16:26:58 +0200

AL: Estimados se:ores;                  Dear Sirs,

AL: Como parte de las investigaciones   As part of the research I'm doing
AL: pertinentes para la obtencion de    for a credit in linguistics at the
AL: un grado en linguistica en la       University of Costa Rica, I need
AL: Universidad de Costa Rica, necesito information about the languages
AL: informacion acerca de las lenguas   Interlingua (from IALA) and 
AL: Interlingua (de IALA) e Interlingue Interlingue (Occidental).  Apart
AL: (Occidental).  Aparte de las        from grammars and a general 
AL: gramaticas y bibliografia general   bibliography, I would be very
AL: mucho agradeceria si me pudieran    grateful if you could provide me
AL: facilitar las direcciones tanto de  with addresses for both normal
AL: correo usual, como de correo        and electronic mail.
AL: electronico.

Presento aqui la informacion que tengo  Here's the information I've got 
sobre estos idiomas; espero que te      about these languages; I hope that
ayuda.  No tengo el tiempo para         you find it useful.  I don't 
traducir lo siguiente al espanyol (y    have the time to translate the 
tambien, quizas ya no tengo la          following into Spanish (and perhaps
habilidad; no he usado mi espanyol      I no longer have the ability; I
desde hace demasiado tiempo!)  Espero   haven't used my Spanish for far too
que me desculpes.                       long!)  I hope you'll forgive me.

N.B. toda la informacion es del libro:  N.B. all the information is from the
                                        book:

            "The Artificial Language Movement" by Andrew Large, 
           pub. Blackwell/Andre Deutsch 1987, ISBN 0-631-15487-6.


                                Interlingua

A language created by the International Auxialiary Language Association
(IALA) with the following stated aim:

Our aim is not to 'make' a new international language, but to present the
international vocabulary standardised in its most general form with only
such complements of words as are supported by natural languages.  We believe
that this auxiliary language will be a language the passive use of which
(reading and listening) should hardly require any previous learning on the
part of educated speakers of the European languages in any part of the
world.

The roots of the language were chosen based on their presence in the four
control languages English, French, Spanish and Italian, with German and
Russian being consulted if a given word could not be found in at least three
of these four languages.  The first dictionary and grammar for the language
was published in 1951.  A major proponent of the language, Alexander Gode,
calls it 'Standard Average European'.

Brief example of Interlingua verbs:

crear - To create.
  creante - creating, create - created, crea! - create!
  io crea - I create, io creava - I created, io creara - I will create
  io ha create - I have created, io habeva create - I have created
  io habera create - I will have created.

vider - To see.
  vidente, vidite, vide!
  io vide, io videva, io videra
  io ha vidite, io habeva vidite, io habera vidite

audir - To hear.
  audiente, audite, audi!
  io audi, io audiva, io audira
  io ha audite, io habeva audite, io habera audite

Example text:

Scientistas varia justo como nos alteros.  Ha sapientes e fatuos, sobrios e
dissipatos, solitarios e gregarios, corteses e inciviles, puritanos e
licentiosos, industrios e pigros, et cetera.  Como genere iles exhibi certe
tendentias.  Per exemplo, iles son totos de alte inteligentia.  Le
scientista pote essere stupide re certe cosas, ma il debe haver le basic
potentia mental que es requisit pro devenir scientista; il non pote essere
moron in le stricte senso psicometric.

Contact:
  Union Mundial pro Interlingua,
  Beverwijk,
  Netherlands.

There is also an Interlingua Institute of New York, but I have no more
address than that.


                               Occidental

This was the brainchild of an early participator in the Esperanto movement,
Edgar von Wahl.  Occidental was published in 1922 and was designed
specifically for use by existing speakers of European languages.  It
deliberately tried to be naturalistic in approach and as such has a number
of irregularities in it's pronunciation, orthography, word endings and
affixes.  The result is that "Occidental presents such a natural appearance
that it might pass as a dialect spoken somewhere on the shores of the
Mediterranean" [F.L. Sack, The Problem of an International Language. 1951].
Occidental has died out (much as most other Esperanto challengers of the
period have).

Example text:

Li ide' pri mund-literature, quel Herder e Goethe hat conceptet essentialmen
ex li vidpunctu del arte, ha nu gan'at ancor mult plu grand importantie ex
li vidpunctu del scientie.  Nam de omni comun possedages del homanite' niun
es tam vermen general e international, quam scientie.  Ma omni comunication
e transmediation del scientie usa li medie del lingue.  Do li
internationalita` del scientie inresistibilimen postula li internationalita`
del lingue.  Si noi considera, que hodie pluri sciential ovres specialmen
libres de aprension, trova se traductet in decidu o plu foren lingues, tande
noi comprende quel immens quantita` de labor on vell economisar, si on vell
posser comprender libres partu' sur li glob sam generalmen quam por exemples
notes o tables de logaritmes.

a`: a grave, e': e acute, u': u acute, ' in gan'at is indeed an apostrophe.
Text file Source (historic): geocities.com/raiu_harrison/conlang

geocities.com/raiu_harrison

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