on-reflection-digest Friday, August 27 1999 Volume 01 : Number 1834 nogg: Progday schedule for Labor Day weekend gg: Pretentious . . . the lot of you! gg: GG! Fabio Katz at Chapters Pinecrest, Ottawa, Canada, Fri Aug 27 gg: Tan d'Organs (or Chewing the Cuds in a Weight?) gg: You a Vert? (or Well, Come to the Seven T's!) gg: The Missing Piece Re: gg: Gier goes to GorGG no gg: Nathan Mahl gg: ebay gg: Re: GSYBE gg: NoGG: Ponty-DiMeola-Clarke gg: Morse w/Deep Purple; The Onion; Level 42; Kenso; Claudio's convention; Phipps meets GG; FZ's book Re: gg: Gier goes to GorGG Re: gg: Gier goes to GorGG gg:no Sky Re: gg:no Sky Re: gg:no Sky gg: Mr.Sirius RECORDS Magazine Vol.33 99/08/22 gg: GG <-> Yes Re: gg:no Sky Re: gg: Cocker in Colorado gg: Celebrity Deathmatch: GG vs. Yes Fwd: Re: gg: GG <-> Yes Re: Re: gg: GG <-> Yes nongg: Skunk Baxter needs your vote gg: pRe: tend, us? (or Thot he fooled you?) ?Re: gg: GG <-> YeseY <-> GG :gg :eR? Re: gg: GG <-> Yes Re: nongg: Skunk Baxter needs your vote Re: gg: New Mammiepoll (was: GG <-> Yes) Re: gg: New Mammiepoll (was: GG <-> Yes) gg: Mammiepoll gg: Mammie's new Poll Re: gg: Gier goes to GorGG ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 09:18:56 +0000 From: Toby Trott Subject: nogg: Progday schedule for Labor Day weekend Wacky Racontuers, Here is the schedule of events for this years Progday festival in Chapel Hill, North Carolina over the Labor Day weekend (September 3-5). If the last several years are anything to base a judgement on, this should be a great weekend of music and comraderie. Come one, come all. I'll let Peter tell you the rest: > The following is the schedule of events for ProgDay '99. We will attempt > to adhere to this schedule as closely as possible, but please keep in mind > that events beyond our control may interefere with such lofty ideals. > > ProgDay '99 will occur rain or shine. In the unlikely event of extreme > weather conditions, the festival will be moved indoors at the Cat's Cradle, > in Carrboro, NC. Cat's Cradle is located on Main Street in Carrboro, NC > (Jones Ferry Road) just a quarter mile from Go! Rehearsal Studios. > > FRIDAY NIGHT, SEPTEMBER 3, 1999 > > 7:00pm Doors Open > 8:00pm ENVISION 90min > 10:00pm AFTER THE FALL 90min > > SATURDAY SEPTEMBER 4, 1999 > > 10:00am Gates Official Open > 11:30pm HOUSE OF USHER 75min > 1:30pm EQUINOX 90min > 4:00pm CONSORZIO ACQUA POTABILE 90min > 6:00pm DISCIPLINE 90min > > Note: The following are not official ProgDay Functions, but are > fully endorsed and recommended by ProgDay High Command :) > 9:00pm Dinner at Carolina Brewery > 10:00pm Ozone Quartet/Bon Lozaga @ Local 506 Club > > > SUNDAY SEPTEMBER 5, 1999 > > 10:00am Gates Officially Open > 11:00am APOCALYPSE 90min > 1:00pm DARK AETHER PROJECT 75min > 3:00pm THINKING PLAGUE 90min > 5:00pm NeBeLNeST 90min > 7:15pm TEN JINN 90min > > 10:00pm Dinner at Chili's Restaurant (across from Travel Time Inn) > Midnight Pool Party Jam Session Anyone? (Travel Time and/or LaQuinta) > > > > > Peter > Manager, Carolina Packaging & Supply > Chapel Hill, NC (919) 968-1181 > ===== ===== ===== > Founder & Benevolent Dictator of ProgDay > The Outdoor Festival of International Progressive Rock > ProgDay Website: http://www.hrzdata.com/progday/ I can email more details to anybody who wants them. Toby @home it's tjtrott@mindspring.com, @work it's trott@sas.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 06:37:30 -0700 (PDT) From: JohnEric Subject: gg: Pretentious . . . the lot of you! Hail! For some time now, I've been trying to define what it is that defines the true progressive Rock or Jazz fan. A friend of mine at work helped me in this. Supposedly, he enjoys prog Rock. After loaning him several CDs to try out, I have made the following observation that applies to virtually all of the truest prog fans. Bands like Pink Floyd, Nectar, selected Hawkwind, and other such bands are fairly accessible to the uninitiated ear. you don't really have to reach very much. On the other hand, Gentle Giant, Tull, Focus, Ekseption, Renaissance, , etc., most people to say things like "outrageous, outlandish, and pretentious". I now believe that the real prog fan ENJOYS and is thrilled by pretension ("Gone" can be that way). So that's it then ... be ye overjoyed by pretension! Remember, GG released a double LP CALLED "Pretentious", which followed on the heals of "Giant Steps" JEE __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 20:43:42 -0500 From: DE Johnson Subject: gg: GG! Fabio Katz at Chapters Pinecrest, Ottawa, Canada, Fri Aug 27 From Stickwire: >Hi everybody, > >I'll be playing at the Chapters Pinecrest bookstore in Ottawa, Ontario, >Canada this Friday, August 27 from 8:00 to 10:00 PM. > >I'll be doing originals and covers (Piazzolla, Bach, Schubert, Telemann, >Gentle Giant, Lennon-McCartney, Santana) arranged for solo Stick (and >loops for some songs). Visit http://www.geocities.com/soho/suite/7007 >to listen to some sample songs. > >Chapters Pinecrest is located at 2735 Iris Street, next to Ikea. >http://www.chaptersglobe.com/Stores/Store.asp?STOREID=2144 > >Hope to see you there! > >Fabio Katz >http://www.geocities.com/soho/suite/7007 >fabiok@home.com >#1344 6+6 Standard Tuning Grand Stick with MIDI >Oberheim Echoplex ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 20:45:11 -0500 From: DE Johnson Subject: gg: Tan d'Organs (or Chewing the Cuds in a Weight?) "Ant" , who chewed off his bottom lip and apparently (?) became a eunuch due to aural ingestation of RtF 'RW' music writes: >The people who work in the media must have got it from somewhere. >It's cyclic. (D)...and sickening. Good point - it didn't start in the media, but (J)they certainly are dragging it out. >The thing is it's often done so subtlely you are unaware of it's >effect. You can often hear people proffering aquired attitudes in >a sort of 'invasion of the body snatchers' way. (D)Uh, I won't go there...you're right, though. 'Art' and 'taste' is (O)often not about substance but _sub_stance_...that is: 'subjective (U)stance' among one's 'peers.' Then this is thrown into the cesspool (G)we like to call 'culture.' (J)I'll take a dive... DJ/CiViLiAN/le Uncroyable M. Personne ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 20:48:37 -0500 From: DE Johnson Subject: gg: You a Vert? (or Well, Come to the Seven T's!) "Scott Steele" wrote: >This happened in the latest issue of Downbeat - the critics all >got together and beat up on Stanley Clarke and Lenny White for >putting out Vertu. "What's this, fusion? We hate that, don't we?" (D)Yowzell Mickman...I think I just had a MAJOR musical flashback... (J)Where have I known this before? DJ/CiViLiAN/le Uncroyable M. Personne ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 14:53:07 +0100 (BST) From: Rik Beck Subject: gg: The Missing Piece Quoth Jerry, > My current favourite, has to be F#A#~ > Which, as everybody knows is by Godspeed You Black Emperor, as > recommended by our very own R Beck. And as witnessed by Ant, > Richard, Mikko and others at the Union Chapel in Islington, London. > > Has to be my favourite band name, at the moment, too. Thanx for the name-check. However, you forgot the all important '!', as in GYBE! rb ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 09:53:32 -0400 (EDT) From: Daniel Barrett Subject: Re: gg: Gier goes to GorGG On August 25, 1999, mammienun@webtv.net wrote: >From what I've heard, Geir is the man. He is the originator of OR. >We owe the guy. Geir is certainly one of the most active GG fans on the planet, and as founder of "Proclamation," he definitely deserves all our thanks! The O-R mailing list, however, was founded by Malcolm Smith, not Geir. Dan //////////////////////////////////////\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ | Dan Barrett Creator, The Gentle Giant Web Site | | dbarrett@blazemonger.com http://www.blazemonger.com/GG/ | \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\///////////////////////////////////// ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 11:51:37 -0400 From: "Jerry McCarthy" Subject: no gg: Nathan Mahl Following NEARfest '99 in June, I posted a review of the festival and I raved about the performance of the band Nathan Mahl, a last-minute fill-in for Finneus Gauge which had cancelled late. It was the first time I'd ever heard them and I was really impressed. I want to encourage you all one last time to check out that Nathan Mahl performance which is available at http://www.studiomlive.com/nearfest/nathanmahl.html. They are a fine band and I think they will appeal to many GG fans. A highly recommended way to spend 1 hour and 14 minutes of your time. For the procrastinators and/or newcomers on the list, Studio M has the entire NEARfest broadcast, 9 bands (plus a lecture by Larry Fast/Synergy) over 2 days, available for download on their site at http://www.studiomlive.com/nearfest/. The NEARfest site is at http://www.nearfest.com/nearfest/. - --Jerry (NP: ... oh, you figure it out) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 10:43:06 -0600 From: Jeff Smith Subject: gg: ebay I just scored a German import of GG's Three Friends off ebay for $15.50. I should hold my breath though, I haven't received the CD yet - it should arrive by this weekend. From Claudio in Grand Junction: >8. Take a tour of Joe Cocker's Mad Dog Ranch Castle and Diner >(sometimes he's there and sometimes he even speaks!) How about going to Joe Cocker's garage sale? There was an article about it in the Colorado Springs Gazette - don't know if its taken place yet. He was selling a guitar and some stage clothes among other things. np: Marillion - Brave Jeff Smith ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 13:13:46 -0700 From: "Frank Lauria" Subject: gg: Re: GSYBE From: Ant - -----Original Message----- From: Jerry Bartlett >>My current favourite, has to be F#A#~ >>Which, as everybody knows is by Godspeed You Black Emperor >Ah that was a night to remember wasn't it? A multimedia experience. The >music, the film show, the taste of canned Boddingtons, the smell of old >incense and the feel of a hard church pew on your coxic. They're coming to Philly soon--worth checkin' out? What type of music? P-Frank ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 13:16:22 -0700 From: "Frank Lauria" Subject: gg: NoGG: Ponty-DiMeola-Clarke Saw this CD at the used CD shop yesterday--anybody familiar with it? It looks to be all acoustic. P-Frank ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 10:33:14 -0700 From: "Scott Steele" Subject: gg: Morse w/Deep Purple; The Onion; Level 42; Kenso; Claudio's convention; Phipps meets GG; FZ's book >I know that Morse plays with Deep Purple, but has any of the stage work he's done with them been released? Which studio CDs have his name to the credits? I own Deep Purple's Purpendicular and Abandon, both studio recordings, and Live at the Olympia. All are hot stuff dude, come on over and check them out. >http://www.theonion.com/onion3530/ebay_drunk.html Thanks Jerry! This was a hilarious way to make fun of my buddy who has spent probably $5000 on E-Bay in the last year (but he's gotten some incredible deals. >LEVEL 42 - "Guaranteed"(Alan Holdsworth on guitar) This is a ripper. Tatsurou brags about investing in Kenso CDs: >p.s. No fusion on this one. It's _fission_! Hee hee hee! Bring it to GORGG! >I'll be happy to stock the bar, but you can mix your own drinks...I tend to take mine straight, no mixologist here! It's best to not water down the good stuff. >Featured events: >5. If we do it in August, we can all go to the Olathe Sweet Corn Festival! I'm an O-R reader - I *love* corn. >6. Race rental cars from one end of town to the other (record is 10.6 minutes by my son) I know I can beat that record. >10. Hang at my house elbow-to-elbow and listen to some of the greatest music ever made! I'll be right there boss >Oh yeah, free alcohol... I'll really be right there boss - should make Number 6 (above) even more interesting. >Thank you for the warm welcome. Here's why I bought TPatG first: < . . . > it was my birthyear (now that was the deciding factor). As good a reason as any! >I brought it to the listening station and listened to the first minute or two of each track. I was impressed! The tracks that caught my attention on the first listen were Aspirations and No God's a Man (I smiled when I was pelted with the barage of vocals in that one). Have you heard Keneally's version of No God's a Man yet? It rocks! >>FZ's book is a good read, full of enthusiasm about music and very funny. >Yes that's another thing that hooks you into an artist/composer, getting to know a thing or two about their life. I'll put that on my xmas list. You'll be glad you read it. You'll be reaching for the Zappa CDs and putting them on the spinner while you're reading. - S. np: Hughscore, Highspot Paradox scottst@ohsu.edu ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 19:25:12 +0200 From: "Jorunn Nome & Bert Vijn" Subject: Re: gg: Gier goes to GorGG GG'day, mates! Dan Barrett spaketh thusly: > The O-R mailing list, however, was founded by Malcolm Smith, not Geir. I've mentioned this before, but I'll repeat it: I have put the stroboscobic interrogation light on Geir for this one. 3 times the last 2 years. 3 times has he been forced to explain me exactly how it happened. To secure scientific circumstances, I've asked him both when it was hot and when it was cold, both early on the day and late, both while he was busy and stressed and while he was relaxed. Everything has been done to secure everybody the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth, in a scientific, controllable manner. Geir's version has remained consistent. It went roughly like this: Geir started a manual mailing list. He called it On-Reflection. He had between 20 and 30 listmembers when he read Malcolm Smith's announcement. He contacted Malcom and roughly said: "Hey, I've already got a list. It's called On-Reflection. You wanna get it for free? Some 25 listmembers will follow with the deal! This is an offer you can't refuse!" The rest is history. Now _I_ don't claim to know everything. But this is what Geir has told me 3 times, and yes, I really did pose him critical questions. After the writings on O-R, I wanted to make sure. For scientific purposes, I must repeat that I am not a member in the Geir Hasnes fanclub. For all I know, he's a liar. But I don't expect so. I think it's about time you people sent Gary Citro those 15 bucks, so we can all ask Geir again on Saturday October 9th, preferably sung as a 3-part reflection, ehm... invention. ;^) c-ya, v-bert ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 15:05:01 -0400 (EDT) From: Daniel Barrett Subject: Re: gg: Gier goes to GorGG >Dan Barrett spaketh thusly: >> The O-R mailing list, however, was founded by Malcolm Smith, not Geir. On August 26, 1999, Jorunn Nome & Bert Vijn wrote: >[according to Geir on multiple occasions] >Geir started a manual mailing list. He called it On-Reflection. He had >between 20 and 30 listmembers when he read Malcolm Smith's >announcement. He contacted Malcolm.... Interesting! I'm happy to be corrected if that's how things happened. I just remember Malcolm's original announcement. Dan //////////////////////////////////////\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ | Dan Barrett Creator, The Gentle Giant Web Site | | dbarrett@blazemonger.com http://www.blazemonger.com/GG/ | \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\///////////////////////////////////// ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 13:38:09 +0100 From: Bob Taylor Subject: gg:no Sky In message <00c601beeee0$93cb1ec0$4a64883e@anton.media.uki.ime.reuters.c om>, Ant writes >The people who work in the media must have got it from somewhere. It's >cyclic. Very true. >The thing is it's often done so subtlely you are unaware of it's effect. You >can often hear people proffering aquired attitudes in a sort of 'invasion of >the body snatchers' way. > >Ant We wouldn't be human without these tendencies to form "group mentalities". It gives a sense of belonging; and the most susceptible time (though it's an ongoing problem) is adolescence. Here's a question that I've always wanted a satisfactory answer to: Of all GG fans I'd expect that nearly all - at least 95% - would admit to liking Yes and have their CDs to some degree; but of all Yes fans, it is likely that a much lower proportion (<10% ??) would say they were GG fans as well. This is a question for the Yes fans on the list, I suppose, but what is it that is missing in GG albums, that leaves so many unimpressed? (it is fair to assume that the great majority of the Yes-buying army have some knowledge of GG; and could have heard at least one album). Bob - -- Bob Taylor ------------------------------ Date: 26 Aug 1999 15:09:01 -0500 From: "Lindsey Spratt" Subject: Re: gg:no Sky On Thu, Aug 26, 1999 7:38 AM, Bob Taylor wrote: > Here's a question that I've always wanted a satisfactory answer to: > Of all GG fans I'd expect that nearly all - at least 95% - would admit > to liking Yes and have their CDs to some degree; but of all Yes fans, > it is likely that a much lower proportion (<10% ??) would say they were > GG fans as well. This is a question for the Yes fans on the list, I > suppose, but what is it that is missing in GG albums, that leaves so > many unimpressed? I think the Yes tunes are easier listening: simpler textures (less going on at one time), more familiar harmonic, melodic, and rhythmic structures. The voices are stronger and higher, and Yes was better at memorable "hooks" (this is related to their reliance on the more familiar structures). I remember being quite startled by the harmonies on PatG when I first heard it. > (it is fair to assume that the great majority of the Yes-buying army > have some knowledge of GG; and could have heard at least one album). I'm not convinced of this. I think GG-aware people are a very small group even among Yes-buyers. - -lindsey ------------------------------ Date: 26 Aug 1999 16:13:07 -0500 From: "Lindsey Spratt" Subject: Re: gg:no Sky On Thu, Aug 26, 1999 3:28 PM, MogulHespa@aol.com wrote: > spratt@alum.mit.edu writes: > > << I think the Yes tunes are easier listening: simpler textures (less going on > at one time), more familiar harmonic, melodic, and rhythmic structures. The > voices are stronger and higher, and Yes was better at memorable "hooks" > (this is related to their reliance on the more familiar structures). >> > > This whole paragraph seems to imply that Yes is a superior band to GG (even > though you may not mean that) . . . > Once I got into GG, all Yes (up to Drama) suddenly sounded like a bunch of > virtuosi playing at once to impress, while not concerning themselves as much > with texture and counterpoint. Sure, this is an exaggeration, but that's > because GG is the extreme example of careful part-writing. While each > member > of Gentle Giant can be called a "virtuoso", I can find no example in any of > their albums of "playing just for the sake of it" -- i.e. "look how fast I > can play!" > Since I prefer (generally) more complex textures and moderately unusual musical structures, I don't equate "stronger and higher" voices with "more musical" voices, and I don't consider memorable hooks important (generally); I think my comments actually imply that GG is the better band for my tastes. I DO think the points I made help account for why there are many people that enjoy Yes but do not care for GG (the original question). - -lindsey ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 17:16:57 -0400 From: Tatsurou Ueda Subject: gg: Mr.Sirius RECORDS Magazine Vol.33 99/08/22 Ciao all! There's summer sale going on at Mr. Sirius's record shop. Sale ends 8/31 Japan time. MUSEA single CD items of FGBG and BR number and Japanese band are all 2,100yen ($19.00), and for order of 5 or more the price goes down to 1,680yen($15.25)/CD. Offer excludes KENSO "IN THE WEST" and "Le Meiller Du Rock Progressif Japonais". 2CD items are also excluded. Price does not include shipping. Japanese Progressive rock FGBG 4223.AR MargeLitch - FANTASIEN FGBG 4247.AR GERALD-MERIDIAN FGBG 4293.AR VERMILION SANDS - Water blue FGBG 4294.AR KENNEDY - Kennedy ! FGBG 4290.AR OUTER LIMITS - The Scene of pale blue STARLESS - SONG OF SILENCE + WISH - Japan Baroque In The Future/DEJAVU MOTOI SAKURABA - Force of Light TERU'S SYMPHONIA/Do Androids Dream Of Electric Camel? GERARD/Pandora's Box ARSNOVA/The Book of The Dead ARSNOVA / Goddess of the Darkness MUGEN / Sinfonia della Luna PAGEANT/La Mosaique De La Reverie MAGDALENA/Same OUTER LIMITS/Misty Moon OUTER LIMITS/Silver Apple On The Moon Progressive music FGBG 4278.AR ZELLO - Quodlibet(Sweden) FGBG 4299.AR RUNAWAY TOTEM - Andromeda(Italy) FGBG 4297.AR TWENTY FOUR HOURS - Oval dreams(Italy) FGBG 4296.AR Christian BOULE- Photomusik(France) FGBG 4295.AR CAST - Imaginary window(Mexico) FGBG 4287.AR UN VOYAGE EN PROGRESSIF - Volume 1 (France) FGBG 4286.AR BAJA PROG 98(Mexique) FGBG 4274.AR Sebastian HARDIE - Windchase(Australia) FGBG 4273.AR SEBASTIAN HARDIE -Four moments(Australia)
Melodic Hard Rock from France BR 8051.AR FAR 'N HIGH - Attraction of fire BR 8039.AR HIGH POWER - Live 84/87 BR 8058.AR KHOMA - Same BR 8040.AR VAE VICTIS II - Same BR 8048.AR DYSLESIA - My own revolution BR 8053.AR HOT LINE - Melodic Hard Rock Force BR 8043.AR MUREN - Lies'n Tears BR 8049.AR ARSENIC - Etats d'urgences BR 8038.AR ATTENTAT ROCK - Le gang des Saigneurs BR 8050.AR HEADLINE - Escape thru the land *Other FGBG/BR titles are available to choose from at http://www.musearecords.com/ Also at Mr.Sirius record shop, there's new section for the French Jazz label "DEUS Z". http://www.kasaya.com/guest/z.htm If interested, e-mail me in private by 8/29. Tatsurou ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 15:30:58 PDT From: "Dan Weese" Subject: gg: GG <-> Yes >(it is fair to assume that the great majority of the Yes-buying army >have some knowledge of GG; and could have heard at least one album). The Yes versus GG debate has gone on for quite some time between my brother and me. He's a huge Yes fan, with almost no GG affinity. I'm a huge GG fan, with a strong Yes tendency. Here's the summary of several years of discussions on this topic. I love Fripp, my brother can't stand him. He has his head firmly in the 70's, and listens to tripe like Gota. I was born in 58, my brother in 60, a little too young to really be hippies. In several of our formative years, my brother and I lived in a small town where our father was a college professor, and we acquired the tastes of the college students who befriended us. He hung with more real hippie types, and I hung with more Tolkien / sci-fi / musician types. Our truest overlap is the music we love, (and sing), in common, and a great deal of that is Yes. There was a happy synergy between the Roger Dean artwork and the whole Yes sound, which propelled their idiosyncratic sound into the hippie world. Yes was also made to sound lots better than they actually were by the work of Eddie Offord, their engineer. The reality of Yes: the terrible rows, Wakeman's drinking, etc. was widely known, but somehow ordinary record buyers never quite saw much beyond Jon Anderson and the theatrics. The marketing of Yes revolved more around the conjured image of Yes than its musical content. Gentle Giant was a word-of-mouth band. Everyone who bought Gentle Giant was introduced to GG by a friend. GG appealed, and continues to appeal to musicians, because of the technical excellence of the compositions and consummate showmanship of GG. Unlike Yes, there was no cohesive image with which to market GG: the record industry could peddle dungheaps to the masses, but presented with the jewel in that dungheap, they didn't know what to do with it. Excellence doesn't sell. Dumb it down. Least common denominator. How do you market a band which can do so many things so well? Rabelais? It is a pity that more musicians have not forged alliances with more multimedia types. The Yes, Bowie, Gabriel and Pink Floyd machines knew how that worked, and succeeded. GG's management should have done more along that line. _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 18:48:10 -0400 From: "drj_saro" Subject: Re: gg:no Sky - -----Original Message----- From: Bob Taylor >(it is fair to assume that the great majority of the Yes-buying army >have some knowledge of GG; and could have heard at least one album). i think that _that_ is a BIG assumption. there are a lot of fans of the "big name" prog bands (like Yes or Pink Floyd or 80s Genesis) who do not have very deep or wide knowledge of other music (witness the activity on _their_ e-mail lists when someone mentions an "obscure" band.) (even worse are people who think that the Moody Blues or Alan Parsons are the be-all-and-end -all of prog!). on the other hand, someone who is a fan of more obscure bands has obviously picked up on the big names on the way out. thank you for your time and attention. Julius J. SAROKA drj_saro@neo.rr.com Cuyahoga Falls OHIO ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 21:26:45 EDT From: Claudio666@aol.com Subject: Re: gg: Cocker in Colorado In a message dated 8/26/99 10:55:59 AM Mountain Daylight Time, Jeff.Smith@wcom.com writes: << How about going to Joe Cocker's garage sale? There was an article about it in the Colorado Springs Gazette - don't know if its taken place yet. He was selling a guitar and some stage clothes among other things. >> Yeah, it was a couple of weeks ago. All for his Kids' Charities (worthy cause) and it was stuff he only wore once. If you saw it, you'd see why! Apparently, he had to have a new outfit for every gig... Claudio n.d. Heavenly Daze Colorado Raz-Wheat. yum! Fruity! n.p. Chiefs/Jaguars ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 22:55:33 EDT From: Claudio666@aol.com Subject: gg: Celebrity Deathmatch: GG vs. Yes An interesting thread, on reflection...I certainly had Yes' "Fragile" before GG "Octopus". Yes because "Roundabout" was on the radio and was much better than everything else they were playing. I bought the import of "Octopus" because it had a Roger Dean cover and so I figured it must be good. Of course I got a bad copy so bought the domestic version. Columbia vs. Vertigo? Usually worked just the opposite... So I'm one of the many who liked Yes before I knew about GG. But it was GG that enthralled me with their composition and musicianship. No one had recommended either one to me, I had different motivations for buying each. I've said in here before how I think Atlantic had a better "machine" and probably more far-sighted A&R people than Columbia (and later Capitol) which resulted in Yes, Genesis and ELP having some commercial success. But let's not forget Payola. Even after the scandal of the 60s, it was still being practiced in the 70s, though not as blatantly. GG's problem was mainly not being a "singles" band, much to their credit and I love them for that. Yes, parlaying their radio success, had already gathered enough fans to release "Close To the Edge" and "Tales" and still remain commercially viable without another single. And I love them for THAT. Though, when they had waned and were trying a comeback, what did we get? That's right, "Owner of a Lonely Heart" which started their cycle all over again. So, I would agree that GG was mainly (and still is) a word-of-mouth reference. Unfortunately, there just weren't enough mouths at the time. Though touring with Yes was a wonderful move, and I thought they blew them off the stage, their music was, and remains, just too cerebral. Maybe they should have worn capes... However, if my local record store had not had a well-stocked Import section, how long would it have been before I discovered the Boys??? As in most things, it's a matter of being in the right place at the right time. Sadly, GG was not. Claudio I'm anticipating a flaming diatribe, don't let me down! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 23:40:53 -0400 (EDT) From: mammienun@webtv.net Subject: Fwd: Re: gg: GG <-> Yes - --WebTV-Mail-5592-1121 Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit - --WebTV-Mail-5592-1121 Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Message/RFC822 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAsAhQy5zWgjYz3pLd+kPQ1iQBOXdBcUQIUSJYjsMd+1OOXklGlsifLb2Skvmo= From: mammienun@webtv.net Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 20:10:01 -0400 (EDT) To: danweese@hotmail.com (Dan Weese) Subject: Re: gg: GG <-> Yes Message-ID: <18420-37C5D759-9872@postoffice-263.iap.bryant.webtv.net> In-Reply-To: "Dan Weese" 's message of Thu, 26 Aug 1999 15:30:58 PDT Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) This discussion got me thinking. It's time for another mammiepoll! When you 1st heard GG, did you like them immediately? Did you run out and start buying their albums, or did some time go by before you began to appreciate them? How old were you and what year was it when you 1st heard/bought GG? My answers: Loved them right off the bat (Octopus..It was 1974 when I 1st heard it...I was 13 at the time)...bought my 1st GG within a year (Free Hand) - --WebTV-Mail-5592-1121-- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Aug 1999 00:45:59 -0400 From: "Richard Worthy" Subject: Re: Re: gg: GG <-> Yes The first album I heard was interview. It just blew me away. It was early 80's shortly after the band had ceased. A friend of mine gave me a tape and it sat in my deck for prob 2 months straight. First album I bought was the german import of Octopus. found it in a used record shop and couldnt pass it up. Think I paid $2.00 for it. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Aug 1999 01:18:03 EDT From: Claudio666@aol.com Subject: nongg: Skunk Baxter needs your vote It's true! Skunk Baxter considering a run for California Representative Brad Sherman (Sherman Oaks) seat as a Republican candidate. He says he won't let his past of sex, drugs and rock & roll cripple his campaign. "I'm going to admit I did all that stuff. But the most important thing is to learn from your past." he said in an interview at his West Los Angeles recording studio. "I'm not Thomas Jefferson reincarnated, but America has been really good to me. I just want to give something back." True story! Vote early and vote often! Claudio ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Aug 1999 12:55:23 -0500 From: DE Johnson Subject: gg: pRe: tend, us? (or Thot he fooled you?) JohnEric wrote: >Hail! (C)Hail yes! >For some time now, I've been trying to define what it is that defines >the true progressive Rock or Jazz fan...I now believe that the real >prog fan ENJOYS and is thrilled by pretension ("Gone" can be that way)... >...Remember, GG released a double LP CALLED "Pretentious", which followed >on the heals of "Giant Steps"... (D)...which is now known as a pretentious title (in more than one circle). (E) (J)Pretentiousness = Self-indulgence = An artist doing what they believe is right for them as a living, breathing, expressive entity! (C)Critix who don't understand this are jealous since they have either no (i)creative bones in their body, or their creative bones have been broken (V)by themselves and/or those around them. Ultimately, any artist that (i)values their work will 'stick to her/is guns' and get trashed for it. (L)Look at all the _really_good_ artists... (i) (A)"History never repeats...I tell myself...before I go to sleep." Split Enz (N) DJ/CiViLiAN/le Uncroyable M. Personne ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Aug 1999 12:58:38 -0500 From: DE Johnson Subject: ?Re: gg: GG <-> YeseY <-> GG :gg :eR? "Dan Weese" wrote: >Excellence doesn't sell. Dumb it down. Least common denominator. >How do you market a band which can do so many things so well? Rabelais? (D)I know exactly what you meant. However, I _wish_ it was really the (J)'least common' denominator. Sadly, it's the 'lowest' of the low instead. (D)Most people don't know how to deal with talent. They either put it up on (O)a pedestal to worship or trod on it (rarely regretting that later). Most (U)real artists are only 'discovered' after they are no longer with us. I'm (G)glad there are exceptions, but they tend to make the rule, I think. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Aug 1999 02:34:09 EDT From: SPBrader@aol.com Subject: Re: gg: GG <-> Yes Mammiepolls:: << This discussion got me thinking. It's time for another mammiepoll! When you 1st heard GG, did you like them immediately? Did you run out and start buying their albums, or did some time go by before you began to appreciate them? How old were you and what year was it when you 1st heard/bought GG? My answers: Loved them right off the bat (Octopus..It was 1974 when I 1st heard it...I was 13 at the time)...bought my 1st GG within a year (Free Hand) >> It was 1972 and Octopus had just been released (yes, it was the Roger Dean sleeve that swung it!). I was 14 and pretty much loved it straight away. I bought GG, AtT & TF as quickly as pocket money would allow and was ready for IaGH on the day of release. Si n.p. Weidorje ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Aug 1999 02:34:10 EDT From: SPBrader@aol.com Subject: Re: nongg: Skunk Baxter needs your vote Claudio on the hustings: << It's true! Skunk Baxter considering a run for California Representative Brad Sherman (Sherman Oaks) seat as a Republican candidate. > > If I lived there, I would. For the Democrat candidate ;-) Si n(ot) p. : Anything by Skunk Baxter ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Aug 1999 09:18:35 +0200 From: Sven Eriksen Subject: Re: gg: New Mammiepoll (was: GG <-> Yes) > Mammiepolls:: > > << This discussion got me thinking. It's time for another mammiepoll! When > you 1st heard GG, did you like them immediately? I liked them, but not as much as some other groups who were around at the same time. I also knew about their Simon Dupree history and was somewhat sceptical (although I did own the Simon Dupree album). > Did you run out and start buying their albums, or did some time go by before you began to > appreciate them? I did not buy the album (but then my financial situation restrictet album buying to about two a month and these were good times for music). However, when "Acquiring The Taste" came out, it completely knocked me out. I Immediately bought that, and quickly went back for their debut. > How old were you and what year was it when you 1st heard/bought GG? It was in 1970/71 (heard/bought) and I was 21/22. Sven ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Aug 1999 05:44:19 -0400 From: "David and Stacey Shur" Subject: Re: gg: New Mammiepoll (was: GG <-> Yes) > > << This discussion got me thinking. It's time for another mammiepoll! When > > you 1st heard GG, did you like them immediately? Yes. A friend of mine saw Tull and Giant during their Three Friends tour, and told me about them. He lent me the album, and told me that although the keyboardist was nothing to scream about (!!!) the rest of the band was great. I couldn't believe how interesting the music was, and became a fan. Actually, I was less impressed with Octopus, when I bought it upon release. I thought that Three Friends "cooked" more, and didn't like the "too concise" songs on Octopus. I was still interested enough to buy the back catalog, and was incredibly impressed with AtT, which is still one of my favorite GG albums. Of course, when Glass House came out (only available as an import over in America) I felt the group really hit a great balance between the diverse elements of the music. -David Eric ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Aug 1999 12:14:06 +0100 From: "Mark L. Potts" Subject: gg: Mammiepoll Mammiepoll: Kind of...I wasn't actually listening to it at the time and when I tuned in to what I was listening to, it didn't really register as something that I would instantly like...course...then "Wreck" came on and I instantly loved the song ;) Did you run out and start buying their albums, or did some time go by before you began to appreciate them? They were sitting in the study all that time! How old were you and what year was it when you 1st heard/bought GG? I was 14 and it was about 8 months ago :) Thorlina PS: ThunderDad says "Hi" ;) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Aug 1999 07:52:03 +0100 From: "Ant" Subject: gg: Mammie's new Poll Mammie asked about breaking your virGGinity. It was 1972, I was 16, first album. My friend had bought it cos he liked the cover and took a chance. I loved it, he hated it so I got it at a 2nd hand price. I then got Octopus, PtFand tPatG when they came out. Seemed to miss AtT, 3F, FH,IaGH, Interview and the rest immediately. Only picked them up much later. Hence they still aren't as familiar as the ones I bought early despite repeated playings. There is something to be said for listening to an album when you're young and your brain is still unfragmented shall we say. I did see IaGH about 76 in a shop and had a listen to it in the booth but I found it a bit difficult so didn't buy it, fool that I was. Ant ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Aug 1999 10:40:25 +0100 From: "Ant" Subject: Re: gg: Gier goes to GorGG - -----Original Message----- From: Jorunn Nome & Bert Vijn >Geir started a manual mailing list. He called it On-Reflection. He had between 20 >and 30 listmembers when he read Malcolm Smith's announcement. He contacted >Malcom and roughly said: "Hey, I've already got a list. It's called On-Reflection. You >wanna get it for free? Some 25 listmembers will follow with the deal! This is an >offer you can't refuse!" >The rest is history. I vaguely remember something about Geir's hand over at the beginning but I also remember that Malcolm did a poll of the people he collected from the newsgroups he trawled, myself included, that would decide what to call the list. Various GG song names were touted and On Reflection won the vote. Geir was on the list that I was on and that list was started by Malcolm. It must have been a coincidence that they both had the same name. Ant ------------------------------ End of on-reflection-digest V1 #1834 ************************************