[20:03]  Okay I am going to paste a few things 
[20:03] * submissive2 settles in close to Dom1^ 's leg and listens intently
[20:03]  Well that was a bit much at once 
[20:04]  :)
[20:04]  Essentially I want to lead in and tell a little storey
[20:04] * DOM10 scrolled, lol
[20:04]  then open it for discussion
[20:05]  and ask you all a few questions and work our way through this topic
[20:05] * moderator3 sits quietly and listens, waving to submissive9 and smiling
[20:05]  I ask that you do a ! and well will call on ya
[20:05] * submissive6 goes and curls up on her cushion, just watching quietly
[20:05]  I am not saying I have the right answers just a right answer
[20:05]  that sound fair
[20:06]  sounds good to me
[20:06]  lol...
[20:06] * MODERATOR1 smiles
[20:06]  okay I will not chuck so much out there all at once but let me give you a little storey
[20:06]  -Many submissive’s feel the need to be controlled and taste that bitter sweet of surrender. Sometimes they rush into situations that are not quite safe and if lucky they live to learn from their errors. I will not use names or locations and will not say if this is based on a true event even if you ask. 
[20:07] * moderator3 listens
[20:07]  Details the person who I will call Jill (the submissive
and will use the female Gender but either could apply) was in contact with Jack (The supposed Dominant – I use the male gender her but again either could apply, not I have added the term supposed on purpose here). This contact though online lasted off and on for a long period of time. Jill had felt the urge to take things to the next level for sometime and as time went on this urge became stronger.
They did the typical things that many do online and engaged in “play online” and had many discussions. Now Jack was smooth and articulate and made sure that Jill was aware that the only way to be a submissive or slave was to be broken in and converted to his will and ways. It was explained to her that she would need to have her will broken and fear of her Master and Owner.
Some details were discussed and talked about how this process would happen. Deep down Jill thought that some of that was probably false bravado and surely a person would not do all those things discussed.  Jack in his mind had a live one and felt he had one twisted almost all the way to his thinking and let things progress at their own pace. Besides Jack had several other prospects that he was harvesting so felt confident that one of them would eventually yield results he desired.  Now Jill on the other hand though not new to the concepts was only online and had no real life experience and limited contact with others in the kink scene. She had never been to a “Munch or scene event” but had read 
some so she had a few ideas beside the deep down feeling of need. 
[20:08] * DOM11 listens
[20:09] * Dom12 listens
[20:09] * submissive2 shivers
[20:10] * Dom8 is thinking this is sounding so very familiar
[20:10]  Okay so far that is like the background to set the storey
[20:10] * moderator3 nods softly and listens
 
[20:11]  Jill finally decided that she could no longer wait and 
wanted to experience things in real life and had been talking to Jack for so 
long and seemed to be the real thing and probably what she needed. She talked 
with a couple of friends and decided that she was going to take the plunge. 
She was sure that she had enough precautions in place and he would not harm
 her since he knew she had some safeties in effect. 
       Jill made arrangements for the care of her child and dog and got the 
Tickets to hopefully meet the Master of her dreams. She gave her friends 
a few tidbits of information just in case and told them she would call in 
2 days and before she flew home. Jill packed her bags a little uneasy but    
  Excited as well and hoped on the plane to Jacks city. Upon arrival Jill was
Greeted by her friend Susan at the airport and off she went to Jack house.
Jack was friendly but stern on her arrival and explained what would happen
To her while she was here to start the break in. He inquired about when she
Had to call her friends and seemed somewhat disturbed that it was so soon
But seemed okay with it. He took her rental car keys and phone and had her
Strip naked and took her to the “Play Room” in the basement. Once there she
Was called a few names and told to perform various sexual acts, when she 
Was slow to respond Jack would get rough and harsh. Eventually Jack said 
She was not responsive enough to his needs and need the first treatment.  
secured her to the post stretched out high and used various implements
on her entire back including a electric cord whip which brought several 
nice welts on her back. This treatment continued until he tired of it with 
little or no concern for her wellbeing. After all she deserved it and needed to
be broken by Jacks thinking. On the day that she was to be making her call
to her friends Jack poured on the concern and somewhat gentler treatment.
Jack made sure she understood that this was necessary to get her broke in 
Correctly and that she should respond to his wants and desires instantly and
Without hesitation. When Jack felt he had her convinced sufficiently to his 
Way of thinking her returned her things and keys. And treated her nicely to 
Insure her return and additional breaking in. Jill dazed and confused and not
Real sure if she knew what was happening to her wandered off body sore from
The mistreatment and mind in turmoil. She met her friend at the airport on the 
Way home and returned home. On talking to some of online friends she 
Realized that she had been used, repressing the feelings she was betraying
Her one true Master she came to realize that he was not a Master nor was he 
A dominant but a sadistic brutal abuser who had used her.
 [20:15]  Here is my first question
[20:15]   Okay tell me some things you think are wrong with this senerio?
[20:15]  !
[20:15]  Go ahead Dom2
[20:15] * sd_watching shudders a bit
[20:16]  !
[20:16]  !
[20:16]  first of all... the first thing that strikes me as wrong...
 is "breaking" a submissive to the dominants will
[20:16]  the lack of care for the submissives well being
[20:17]  the taking away of her "panic" buttons so to speak
[20:17]  how about the expectation of play at the first meet?
[20:17]  Most certainly.......
[20:17]  !
[20:17]  that to Dom14
[20:17]  all very very excellent points
[20:17]  submissive3
[20:18]  thank you Mod1....First off, Id like to point out the risks
 involved with meeting a Dominant on unfamiliar turf. I realize the same can be said 
for meeting a submissive. The issue is that as a female, especially one with submissive
 tendencies, it is soooo much safer to meet on her own ground. A first meet should be 
on the submissive's home turf.
[20:18]  Secondly, NEVER give up your cell phone and keys. You never 
know when they may be your lifeline!
[20:19]  the submissive was also a little more gungho and less worried about
 her own safety, wanting to experience without thought of the repercussions
[20:19]  end
[20:19]  Dom14, please use the ! to let DM know you wish to speak, 
itll keep things less confusing :)
[20:19]  submissive4 please
[20:19]  thank you Sir
[20:19]  well said submissive3
[20:19]  She didnt listen to what her perfect Master had told her in the
 first place. He had every intention of breaking her and told her that. She didnt
 question his methods of breaking her. 
[20:19]  She needed to call her saftey people every day and if her friend
 was in the same town, she should have made arrangements to meet her friend every day.
[20:20]  end
[20:20]  !
[20:20]  Dom5 please
[20:20]  Thank you MODERATOR1, the very fact jack was able to portray him self
 as a Dominant and get away with it to the point of playing with someone I see wrong
[20:21]  Yes I agree
[20:21]  thank you MODERATOR1
[20:21]  moderator3 please
[20:21] * moderator3 smiles to Mod1, honestly what i see as wrong is 1. her safe 
calls were *way* too far apart, 2. her safety net and her did not have code words
 set up if she felt she needed out
[20:22]  two days for a safe call is wayyyy too long to wait
[20:22]  !
[20:22]  i think most touched on the other stuff i was thinking
[20:22]  okay submissive6 please
[20:22]  i only want to comment......
[20:23]  !
[20:23]  !
[20:23]  this is all just as vital in "vanilla" situations as it is for bdsm
[20:23]  yes that is a fact
[20:23]  that's all i wanted to say
[20:23]  Chris please
[20:24]  ~waves to Master and points to the seat she saved Him~
[20:24] < Dom15> nods
[20:24]  Hello A/all
[20:24]  Welcome Dom15, Dom16, submissive7 and seductive`whispers if you 
would like to join the conversation please indicate with a !
[20:25]  My comments are my own only but in my opinion a first meet 
should be in public place it does not matter how long you have known them online
 you do not know a person untill you have spent reallife time with them and you 
need to trust your instinincs when you see the flags comming up
[20:25]  Most excellent points
[20:25]  each flag that something is wrong may not amount to much
 in itself but it should alert you to something is not wuiet right here
[20:25]  done
[20:25]  !
[20:26]  Moderator4please
[20:26]  I guess the point I wanted to add was to not only a compilation
 of the ones made but when your meeting for the first time as part of your safty
 net do not tell the hosting party what those safty things are thats your safty 
net if he knows them then to cover his own tracks he will make sure he makes 
those phone calls happen 
[20:26]  done 
[20:26]  yes very valid as well
[20:26]  submissive10 please
[20:26]  !
[20:27]  i think itsimportant to remember to think. so much of 
what we do is emotional for us that we forget to use our brains. spceially 
when it comes to meeting someone we have come to think of online as a friend.
[20:27]  thanks, DM thats all
[20:27]  !
[20:27]  !
[20:27]  moderator3 please
[20:27]  please folks build in a code word or phrase as you have 
no idea the temperment of the Dominate you are working with or what he might 
do if he knows you asked for help
[20:27] * moderator3 listens quietly
[20:27] * submissive7 finds an empty pillow and sits quietly
[20:27]  thats all
[20:27] < Dom1^ > !
[20:28]  Dom18 please
[20:28]  !
[20:28]  !
[20:28] * Mod5 listens...holding fire and keeping her safe with me :)
[20:28] * submissive2 tries to still her racing brain and just listen to the 
superb nuggets being shared by everyone
[20:28]  Ideally the safetey lines should be people that know you 
personally, not just from online.  People who know you well enough to tell 
if you sound like you've been drugged or ar "not in your right mind" at the moment.
[20:29]  done.
[20:29] * moderator3 smiles up at him, listening intently
[20:29]  good point Dom18
[20:29]  good one Sir
[20:29] <{submissive19}MODERATOR1> !
[20:29]  Dom19 pleas and damn right Dom18
[20:29]  Playing on the first or second meet just dosent make any 
common sense impo ...thank you MODERATOR1 ...done
[20:29] * Domme1 nods nods nods to Dom18
[20:30]  Oh yes real important thing there Dom19
[20:30]  Dom  please
[20:30]  Exactly Dom18, very good point.
[20:31] < Dom1^ > I agree with moderator3 totally....I am a very large man with
 very little experince in the lifestyle itself.   Sometimes I don't know My 
own strength and want to be DAMN sure If something happens...I want to know 
immediately If I am causing harm at all!!
[20:31] < Dom1^ > done
[20:31]  !
[20:32]  submissive3 please and yes sometimes you need to be aware
 of the impact of what you are doing
[20:32]  "submissive frenzies" are a very intense and very REAL
 response. Our bodies and our minds crave serving, crave feeling, whatever 
brought you to seek this lifestyle in the first place. We learn all the 
delicious things that can happen. We "think" we know what to expect 
because we have experienced them online or you have seen a scene describing 
such. Your heart can hurt, your stomach burn with insistance, but those feelings are f
[20:33]  you cut off hon
[20:33]  but those feelings are f
[20:33]  feelings are fleeting compared to the length of time you may be 
involved in this lifestyle. There is plenty of time to "safely and sanely" explore all 
those feelings. Do not turn a first meeting into your last chance to feel the submissive19s
 within this lifestyle. 
[20:34]  end
[20:34]  smiles well said
[20:34]  thank you submissive3 excellent point and oh so true
[20:34]  Dom2 please
[20:34]  Nods and smiles to submissive3
[20:34]  I'd like to comment that first.. I agree with all that's been said... and the
 same can be said about the dominants perspective
[20:35]  especially in regards to what submissive3 stated.
[20:35] * MODERATOR1 smiles yeah us old Dom/me's can get carried away especially the first time
[20:35]  yes, Dominants need the same protections
[20:35] * submissive4 smiles to her lil sis
[20:35] * Domme1 nods emphatically
[20:35] < Dom1^ > Thank You Dom2 excellent point
[20:35] * submissive14 smiles back
[20:36]  Yes a Dominant needs to have some of the same safe guards in place
[20:36] * submissive5 hugs Lady Domme1 gently.
[20:36]  !
[20:36]  Secondly... a big flag that often pops up in my mind when going to a first meet... 
is... if the submissive is pushing for "play" on the first or second meet.. that should raise a very 
big flag on the dominants board
[20:36] * Domme1 hugs Her boy and sighs softly
[20:36]  regardless of how long the person has been known online... or even outside of the lifestyle
[20:36]  nods to Dom2 that is a good good point 
[20:36]  {submissive19}MODERATOR1 please....and very much trye Dom2
[20:36]  true
[20:36] <{submissive19}MODERATOR1> thank You, Master.. just that the code word needs 
to be something 'generic' too... not obvious... not a call saying 12"i'm safe"1....
......... instead something like: 12"if when i call i mention what time of day it is...
 then there's trouble and i need your help"     14
[20:37]  that is an extremely important point since it could trigger wrong things otherwise
[20:37]  ok that worked
[20:37]  wb Dom20 Sir
[20:37]  Dom5 please
[20:37]  thank you again MODERATOR1
[20:37]  a few points if I may, first the people who you are worried about meeting, also have access
 to this information and kind of discussion, so its always best to let them know you use a system of safe
 calls etc, second it is a good idea to make sure the person taking your calls, knows what you sound like
 after sex or something intensly passionate, if you do play you wouldn't want them mistaking and endorphine
 rush 
[20:38]  !
[20:38]  thank you MODERATOR1
[20:39]  !
[20:39]  Welcome Dom20 we are having a discussion, please type a ! if you would like to comment or
 have a question.
[20:39]  Dom please...and I agree with Dom2
[20:39]  I have to agree with what  Dom1^  saod about the strength i know moderator3 can take
 a lot more then my girl can in reallife and in moments of passion it is easy to go back to the force i 
am used to so never  be afraid to tell your Dom he is pushing to hard he should/alwasy take your pain 
into consideration
[20:40]  wb Switch1...
[20:40]  welcome to the discussion submissive21 come sit with pam and i 
[20:40]  thank you Ms Domme
[20:40]  thank you, Sir  (:
[20:40]  Moderator4please and very good point Dom
[20:40]  Welcome submissive21, we are having a discussion, please type a ! if you would 
like to comment or have a question.
[20:40] * Mod5 waves a big hello to submissive21 ...welcome :)
[20:41]  I know subspace/Dom space can be very indepth to the sences but one thing I have 
found is no matter how deep you go you have the control inside you to know whats right and wrong 
DO NOT give out personal information ssan d/l number that kind of thing once a person has that 
they can litterally take control of every aspect of your life 
[20:41] * submissive7 curls up listening
[20:41]  end 
[20:41]  !
[20:42]  Yes that is extremely true......Dom18 please....and for clarity sake so I do
 not cut someone off say end when done with a thought
[20:42]  Dom18 please
[20:42]  I'd like to raise a point regarding "never give up the cell phone and keys".. 
If you're stripped naked and restrained in somebody's playroom, you already don't have them.  
It sounds nice, but by the time it gets to any actual play, it's become a moot point if the person
 is dangerous in bad ways.  They're probably with your street clothes.  Think on it.
[20:42]  done
[20:43]  good point
[20:43]  !
[20:43]  Yes why that first or second meet should be a non-play meet 
[20:43]  may i counter
[20:43]  sure Moderator2
[20:43]  nevermind 
[20:43]  !
[20:44]  this person was not tied the entire time she was there the first few days 
and if she had kept some contriool of her possesions she may have been able to make that call ir 
drive away when she was untied but she had no idea where her personal items were 
[20:44]  thank you for your time and an intresting discussion..good night everyone
[20:44]  done
[20:45]  !
[20:45]  submissive4 please
[20:45]  hello submissive31^, welcome, we are having a discussion, please type a ! if you 
would like to comment or have a question.
[20:45] * submissive31^ nods and smiles
[20:46]  i wanted to comment on Moderator4Sirs point. if the person you meet is 
intending on doing you harm and does it right away and no amount of safe points will help. wouldnt
 it be better if someone you trusted had his/her pesonal information like drivers license and sin number?
[20:46]  !
[20:46]  !
[20:47]  at least the authorities can track him down then.
[20:47]  end
[20:47]  Yes as much info as possible should be in the hands of your safe persons
[20:47]  submissive3 did you have a comment or not now
[20:47]  Dom20 please then
[20:47] * Switch1 is now known as Switch1
[20:47]  not now, Master DM
[20:48]  I would half to agree with MODERATOR1 there should be more of a discussionary
 basis when meeting the first meeting takeing the phone and keys should have been the first clue 
there should always be trust between the two
[20:48]  submissive2 please
[20:49]  Thank you, MODERATOR1, Sir
[20:49]  hello submissive22
[20:49]  The important thing to me is that Jill did not even realize that she needed 
to get out or that she needed her phone and keys, which points to two factors: 1. she seemed unable 
to recognize her own alarms in her head, which is dangerous, and 2. the whole scenario needed to be 
slowed down, to such an extent that the first few (or more meetings) be in public, without loss of 
control
[20:49]  End
[20:49]  g'evening, Everyone
[20:49]  submissive23 please and yes I agree with you and Dom20 submissive2
[20:50]  just something E/everyone should rember even if Y/you have ALL these safety nets 
in place .. The P.person still may not be safe .... even after meeting in a public place .. after all is
 said and done once your alone with the person the tables may still be turned .. 
[20:50]  done
[20:50]  hi LA Sir
[20:50] * moderator3 waves a welcome to those that have entered. we're doing a moderated safety 
discussion on first meetings, if you have a point youd like to add please type !
[20:50]  hiya submissive7 :)
[20:50] * sacrificial_devotion waves to LA Sir...
[20:50] * Dom30 waves back to 
[20:50]  yes oh so true nothing is 100% but you can at least minimize the risks
[20:51]  submissive10 please
[20:51]  in my local scene, we teach people to set up safe calls at certain times. 
and to tell the person you're meeting when those calls are. if you have the "panic word/code" set 
up, then if you have had your phone taken, the person will make sure you make your calls on time 
so there is no trouble percieved. but your safe call person will know and will respond accordingly.
[20:52]  may I counter?
[20:52]  yes you may Dom2
[20:52]  and anyone who knows how the scene works will completely understand. dont 
worry about hurting feelings. this is your life and safety.
[20:52]  !
[20:52] * submissive22 curls up quietly, listening
[20:53]  Welcome submissive30, we are having a discussion, please type a ! if you would 
like to comment or have a question.
[20:53]  I wouldn't recommend telling the person when the safe calls are, and I wouldn't say
 what the panic/code word was to the other person... BUT...
[20:53]  if the sub cannot recognize the alarms going off... things are going to be 
perceived okay anyway
[20:53]  I would recommend.. not only setting up safe calls.. BUT a meeting place as well
[20:54]  MODERATOR1, mind if i make a point?
[20:54]  even if it's something as simple as the person seeing that you are alright..
[20:54]  exactly
[20:54]  yes please sub10
[20:54] * submissive30 sits beside submissive10
[20:54]  ok, say you get to the point of play. things go badly. if the top knows 
when you're suppose to check in, they are going to make sure you do so.
[20:55] * Dom2 nods.
[20:55]  even if they are abusing you, they dont want the cops called on them, so 
the call will take place. thats why you tell them.
[20:55]  !
[20:55]  !
[20:55]  no you dont tell them the codes. but you do your best to ensure even in the
 worst case that those calls are made
[20:55]  end. thanks gang :)
[20:56]  okay no system is fool proof I have always been told to have both known 
scheduled and unscheduled calls to cover both senerios
[20:56]  that means the Dom/Top knows some will happen and that there will be others
[20:56] * submissive2 nods
[20:56]  but both situations 
[20:56]  !
[20:56]  Dom18 please
[20:56]  Moving to another point.. If you are somebody's safety line, remember that often the 
authorities will *not* move fast.  You call the police and tell them someone hasn't made a promised 
phone call and after 24 hrs, they'll tell you you can file a missing person's report.  Be ready to 
make some shit up.  "You were on the phone with them and you heard someone yelling in the threatening 
tone of voice, something that sounded like a gunsho
[20:57]  ohhhhh good point Dom18 Sir
[20:57]  You have to be willing to risk getting in a bit of trouble if necessary.
[20:57]  Good point, Dom18, Sir
[20:57]  Dom18...you dropped....
[20:57]  done.
[20:57]  sounded like a gunsho
[20:57]  Ok, where did it cut off?
[20:57]  gunshot and your friend crying out and the phone went dead" will be more likely to 
get it checked out. 
[20:57]  that sounded like a gunsho
[20:57]  [21:59]  ohhhhh good point Dom18 Sir
[20:57]  Now done.
[20:58]  yes a little emphasis to get the cops moving may be required... submissive3 please
[20:58]  I prefer that safe calls be done where your safe calls calls YOU....that way they 
can call at an unknown time. This is a lot better than a predetermined time. Preferably you should call 
as soon as you arrive, they should call at least once during the meeting, and you call when you leave 
AND when you get home. end.
[20:58] * submissive31^ sits back patiently waiting.
[20:58]  good point submissive3
[20:58] * Domme1 agrees with submissive3
[20:58]  so I think that the best thing is to have a system of calls in place that works 
for the situation
[20:59]  why the safe person should know the details of the meeting and you both agree
 what way is best
[20:59]  submissive22 please
[21:00]  If there is play to be involved, that opens all new issues and alarms. Simply 
put, meet in a fairly public area, and have the common sense to get a car license plate – and contact 
numbre for the party you are meeting, giving that to the safe call before MEETING them.
[21:00]  !
[21:00]  done
[21:00]  okay submissive31^ please
[21:00]  thank you
[21:00] < Dom1^ > need to reboot....brb
[21:01]  Calls, safe calls, times, license plates dont always work
[21:01]  !
[21:01]  I will tell you the truth on what happened with me
[21:01]  please let me .. 
[21:01] * submissive32 smiles in thanks.
[21:01]  i used every thing that was mentioned here, copy of the license, copy of 
the license plates, make model and all
[21:02]  even had home address, phone number and place of work.
[21:02]  We met in public.. we met in a town everyone knew me
[21:02]  But none of that stopped him from later finding me and raping me. Didn't 
rape me at my house. 
[21:02]  he followed me days later and grabbed me.
[21:03]  and to this day, he still isnt caught
[21:03]  he has warrents out for his arrest
[21:03]  !
[21:03] * Dom41 is now known as Dom41-afc
[21:03]  he has beatened raped, and stole from others...
[21:03]  yes true submissive31^ bad things can still happen no matter how safe 
you try to be but you can take steps to be safer and reduce the risk.
[21:03]  none of us were safe even with all the things we did
[21:04]  which is all you can do
[21:04] * moderator3 nods softly and agrees
[21:04]  submissive3 and then I would like to summerize
[21:04]  True, unfortunately it may make you safe the day OF the meeting , 
but not always after.
[21:04]  done
[21:04] * submissive31^ goes sits back quietly
[21:04] * moderator3 listens quietly
[21:04]  In this day and age we all need to be protective with our DL and
 SS numbers, as well as some may not be comfy giving out a license plate number either. 
I also would not give out my home address for a first meeting. 
[21:04]  The big thing is, make sure you have phone numbers...not just a cell 
phone...but their home number, and call to verify. Also their work number.  If you are meeting 
in a public place, arrive first...and leave last....that way the person you meet doesnt gain your 
vehicle information.
[21:04]  end
[21:04] * Domme1 applauds submissive31^.. that was very brave of you to share, thank you
[21:05] * submissive31^ nods with a smile
[21:05]  May i add one thing..
[21:05]  Okay some key points for all you and if I leave anything out please let me know
[21:05]  smiles, very proud of submissive31^
[21:05]  even though we had all that information. Turned out he had stolen identities.
 So when you checked it all turned out okay.
[21:06]  thanks submissive5
[21:06]  !
[21:06]  first thing......first or second meet should always be in a public place with 
safeties in place......and as submissive31^ just told us all even that is not 100% safe
[21:06]  those should be public places with no play done or planned to be done
[21:07]  Switch1 please go ahead
[21:08]  !
[21:08]  having seen some of the darker side of telemarketing i can tell you there is 
a lot of information stolen and out there, it is not hard to see how someone could get that information.. 
thats all i had to say
[21:08]  okay Dom18 please
[21:09]  If you are a safety line person, do NOT under any circumstances go and investigate 
yourself if your friend misses a check-in?  If the person is really dangerous, you *can* be eliminated 
or become "two for the price of one".. 
[21:09]  done.
[21:09]  !
[21:09]  submissive31^ please
[21:09]  When this guy did this to more than one woman, do you know what the police said.
[21:09]  !
[21:09] * submissive5 listens
[21:09]  you should have been more carefull there is nothing we really can do because 
we dont know who he is 
[21:10]  yes that is a sad fact submissive31^ submissive2 go ahead
[21:10]  a friend of mine had a friend disappear, took the police 3 days before 
they started a search.
[21:10] * Mod5 shakes my head
[21:10] * submissive31^ slips back.
[21:11]  That's just wrong.
[21:11]  just really wrong
[21:11]  what the frack is that kind of stuff? 
[21:11]  It has helped me that I insist on speaking to others who have met the person 
before me... and I tell any who want to meet me for a first time who are the ones who have done so 
already... and encourage an "investigation"... it helps everyone feel more safe... end
[21:11]  guys please
[21:11] * submissive31^ nods, the twist was it was a Dominant missing
[21:11]  if you have a comment please do !
[21:12]  do not make me modertate the room please
[21:12]  !
[21:12]  yes submissive3 
[21:12]  I do recommend speaking with ex's....but i caution that the partner 
you are meeting will probably only give out the names of those who will lie for him or he has not harmed.
[21:13]  !
[21:13]  !
[21:13]  submissive4 and then submissive14 and then I would like to move on to other things
[21:14] * submissive5 slips out quietly. Night A/all, and thank Y/you.
[21:14]  submissive4
[21:14]  ! just 1 more thing
[21:14]  These are all great points, but just remember these first meetings are just 
like any other date you had in your life. And im sure you didnt have all these safety nets in place. 
Do what you would do normally if you met someone you liked in real life. Use your head and common sense.
[21:15]  How many people have gone on a first date with someone who picked you up at your 
house and you got into the car with him.
[21:15]  Anything can happen anytime, anywhere. just be as safe as you can. end
[21:15]  agrees with submissive4
[21:15]  true in alot of aspects but normally a first date is not from miles away and 
someone you know, or known by someone you know submissive4
[21:16]  so that makes is slightly different in my opinion
[21:16]  im not saying be stupid Sir
[21:16]  hello
[21:16]  but if you were to go on a first date with someone. you sure as hell 
wouldnt head off to a hotel room.
[21:16] * moderator3 waves a welcome to those that have entered. we're doing a moderated safety 
discussion on first meetings, if you have a point youd like to add please type !
[21:16]  oh I agree with you submissive4 but in some ways it is differnt is all I am saying
[21:16] * submissive3 knows some who would
[21:17] * submissive2 giggles
[21:17]  okay submissive14 and then we will move on
[21:17]  7OK LETS MOVE TO THE SECOND QUESTION
[21:17]  I just want to agree with what subbmissive12 added point about how the partner
 being met will probably only give out the names of those that will lie for him and those he's not harmed.
 I see it frequently enough during regular life. How does one know they can trust the person speaking them 
about the partner to be met?
[21:18]  very true but it can be a data point for you on wheather you continue on with things
[21:18]  you do those things that make you feel comfortable and feel at least secure 
[21:19]  moving on :)
[21:19] * moderator3 listens quietly to Moderator1
[21:19]  Okay not to cut anyone off short can I say that the major points so far is to
 meet in a public place
[21:19]  hmm. end
[21:19]  get the feel for the person 
[21:19]  and do so safely
[21:20]  would you all thing leaving the mechanic out and not repeating ourselves that is true
[21:20]  think
[21:20]  yes
[21:20]  anyone mention safe calls?
[21:20]  yes submissive50
[21:20]  yes we have submissive50
[21:20]  ok, i came in late i guess  :)
[21:20]  okay how would you define a public place
[21:20] * [submissive51] smiles and waves hello
[21:21]  Timmy's!
[21:21]  !
[21:21] * moderator3 waves a welcome to those that have entered. we're doing a moderated safety 
discussion on first meetings, if you have a point youd like to add please type !
[21:21] <[submissive51]F> hi Mod5
[21:21]  submissive50sub please ! if you wish to be called on
[21:21]  !
[21:21]  !
[21:21]  okay submissive50 I think that was you asking to speak
[21:22]  !
[21:22]  okay then submissive3 please
[21:22]  i just said a public place is Timmy's, or MacDonald's, if you can stand 
to be in there
[21:22]  okay ...
[21:23]  personaly, i can't
[21:23]  !
[21:23]  My favorite place to meet someone in the lifestyle....is at the local bdsm play 
parties in Detroit. Not only is it public, but people there understand what to watch for. If i "choose" 
to play, someone I know is there to watch. I can also be walked in and walked out, or I can just ride 
with someone else. If you dont have a local venue for parties or munches, then a restaurant 
with a "well lit" parking lot.
[21:23] * submissive30 chuckles at "Timmys"
[21:23]  I would not meet at a mall there are too many people and you can get lost in 
the crowd to any security. 
[21:23] * submissive2 is so glad that her logging is on for this discussion
[21:23]  well doesn't everyone use Timmy's?
[21:24]  submissive50 please
[21:24] <[submissive51]F> !
[21:24] * submissive31^ has no idea what timmy's is
[21:24]  What I tell people online if they want to meet is that they can meet me at 
the party.....I send them the link and we go from there.
[21:24]  end
[21:24]  Tim Horton's coffee shop chain
[21:24]  in closing this segment of the conversation  summing up the points made ...the bottom 
line is your vulnerable and at the mercy of your partner but taking what weve discussed here tonight 
and applying just some of them can help being you back 
[21:24]  yes good places if they are available to you ....  but if they are good choice....
kareno`falla please
[21:24]  the discussion is fast enough if you have comments partaining to it please type !
 we dont want to moderate the rom
[21:25]  thank you moderator3 
[21:25] <[submissive51]F> i met a Dom at timmys once.....it was rooky training season.....how safe 
is that :-)
[21:25]  submissive3 already said restaurants, my only other thought for like where 
i am would be local atraction, museum or such
[21:25]  submissive51 im not asking again
[21:25] * Moderator2 sets mode: -v Dom20
[21:25]  this disucssion is not about timmy's
[21:26]  end ... sorry DM
[21:26]  6T14hank 6Y14ou
[21:26] * Dom2 needs to head out... but would just like to point out that everything has been said... 
and said well.. and would like to thank everyone for the welcome.. and the discussion
[21:26]  !
[21:27]  please continue MODERATOR1
[21:27] * southern^shell sets mode: +v MODERATOR1
[21:28]  Okay my definition of a good public place is a place where it is in public 
at a daylight hour with well lighted and secure parking nearby 
[21:29]  it should be a place where you are not necessarily known
[21:29]  Moderator4I believe you were next
[21:32]  okay [submissive51]F what is your idea of a public place
[21:32] * Moderator2 sets mode: +v [submissive51]F
[21:32]  sorry had to do a dad thing  I jumped the gun and stated my thought thank you 
[21:33] <[submissive51] > a place you are comfortable and familar with with people nearby during 
daylight hours
[21:33]  good points submissive51
[21:33] <[submissive51] > i've even taken a friend with me on a first meet
[21:33] <[submissive51] > ty
[21:33]  also a good point
[21:33] * submissive2 nods, having done that too
[21:34]  since you said a friend or safety, What should be the qualities of the safe person?
[21:34] * submissive31^ smiles wishing all a good evening and thanking them for taking the time to listne
[21:34] * submissive31^ good night
[21:34]  !
[21:34]  !
[21:34] <[submissive51] > they should be someone you have a longstanding relationship with aka friendship
[21:34]  good point Mod2 please
[21:35] * moderator3 waves a welcome to those that have entered. we're doing a moderated safety
 discussion on first meetings, if you have a point youd like to add please type !
[21:35]  Some one you know in real  life would be a good start since you do not know
 the online friends any better then you do the online Dom/me
[21:35]  done
[21:36]  yes defnately
[21:36]  !
[21:36] * submissive3 wonders if they missed my ! in the devoicing
[21:36]  moderator3 please
[21:36]  I might have I will ask you nest submissive3
[21:36]  next
[21:37]  Dom pretty much said it, it *has* to be someone you trust, that knows you
 well enough to pick up on inflections or glances if theyre with you. OE and i go one step farther, 
hes with me for all meets and we have codes set up to state my comfort level
[21:37] * MODERATOR1 smiles
[21:37]  excellent moderator3
[21:38]  ty
[21:38]  submissive3 since I missed ya
[21:38]  end sorry
[21:38]  keep forgetting that
[21:38]  We all need to think when setting up a public meeting. Think about if 
anyone would care or even notice if you were grabbed and gagged and thrown into a car. Carnivals, 
Amusement Parks, Malls, etc are never good choices. Museums normally have a long walk from the car
 to the building, and anything can happen during that time. Be careful to choose a place with a 
close and well lit parking spot. Park toward the entrance and not in 
[21:38]  yes very good points as well submissive3 moderator3 please
[21:39]  Park toward the entrance and not in back.
[21:39]  but not right in front either
[21:39]  a short safe distance
[21:39]  sometimes there are some of us that dont know of our lifestyle choices and 
maynot have a person friend or person in real life as a contact and in that case i offer to be a 
persons safe call if needbe online is better than nothing
[21:40]  !
[21:40]  !
[21:40]  yes also true and a very viable option
[21:40]  Dom please
[21:40] < Dom1^ > please pardon me...I must go for a few minutes
[21:40]  k
[21:41]  very good point i know none of my wife and my real life friends know of or 
life style choices so you do use what  you have available and we at the house of music will be 
your safe call if you have no one else please contact the managment to make that connection if 
you need it 
[21:41]  done
[21:41]  submissive55 please
[21:42] < submissive55> I also am with moderator3 and so is Ms Domme1, we are available as a choice 
for you to make a safe call and use 
[21:42]  and then I think we need to close the disucssion and leave it to an open forum...
I will paste a few resources for you and have a topic for next time to finish this out sorta
[21:42]  Moderator4please
[21:43]  thank you ladies and gentelman for your time and input your opnions and sugesstions 
are very welcomed  at this time we will end this session of open forum in the D/s parlor until next 
week at the same time  from 9Pm untill 11pm .....thank you all again for your time and we look forward 
to seeing you all next week for ...open forum
[21:43] * Dom41-afc is now known as Dom41
[21:43]  That closes the discussion folks I know we covered alot 
[21:43]  ty DM and everyone
[21:43]  and I have links if you want them
[21:43]  thanks for comming and for your input every one
[21:43] < submissive55> yes please
[21:43]  well done MODERATOR1 
[21:43]  thank you MODERATOR1 Sir, that was very well done
[21:43]  Thank you, MODERATOR1, Sir and everyone else for a wonderful discussion!
[21:43]  i'd like those links please, Moderator1
[21:43]  yes please post Moderator1
[21:44]  very well done Moderator1 :}}}
[21:44]  http://www.castlerealm.com/
[21:44]  -----> finding kinky folks in my area http://www.castlerealm.com/library/contact.shtml
[21:44] * {submissive19}MODERATOR1 smiles softly
[21:44]  exceprt 
[21:44]  Safety 
[21:44]  I recommend reading the chapter, "Finding Partners," in Jay Wiseman's SM101. 
He covers a good 
[21:44]  number of safety tips. If you are a woman, be especially careful: don't give 
out your 
[21:44]  home phone or address to an unknown contact and don't meet in private unless a 
trusted friend 
[21:44]  knows where you are and will check on you. http://castlerealm.com/library/kink3.shtml
[21:44]  Abuse: A Common Link  http://castlerealm.com/library/march98art.shtml
[21:44]       http://www.steel-door.com/Chamber.html
[21:44]       http://www.steel-door.com/Finding_Your_Dominant.html
[21:44]       http://www.steel-door.com/predators_and_fakir.htm
[21:44]       http://www.steel-door.com/Abusers.html
[21:44]       http://www.steel-door.com/Damage_Control.html
[21:44]       http://www.submissiveloving.com/
[21:44]       http://www.iron-rose.com/
[21:44]       http://www.iron-rose.com/IR/docs/acidtest.htm
[21:44]       http://www.iron-rose.com/IR/docs/how_to_find_and_keep_a_dominant.htm
[21:44]       http://www.iron-rose.com/IR/docs/how_to_seek_others.htm
[21:44]       http://members.aol.com/lolitassc/abuse.html
[21:44]       http://www.iron-rose.com/IR/docs/vrtorl.htm
[21:44]       http://www.iron-rose.com/IR/docs/meetingIRL.htm
[21:44]  they will also be availble on at www.houseofmusiclive.com tomarrow  as well 
[21:44]       BDSM Locator ----> http://www.darkheart.com/usalist.html
[21:44]       http://www.bdsmcafe.com/resource/
[21:44]       http://www.bdsmcafe.com/resource/safety/safetyx.html
[21:44]  Jack Rinella's resources links
[21:44]       http://www.leatherviews.com/resources.htm
[21:45]       http://latches.webslaves.com/content.htm
[21:45]       http://latches.webslaves.com/bdsm_or_abuse.htm
[21:45]       http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/englishroissy/
[21:45]       http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/englishroissy/safe_sm_guidelines.htm
[21:45]       http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/englishroissy/safe_calls.htm
[21:45]       http://www.submissiveloving.com/femsub.html
[21:45]       http://www.leathernroses.com/
[21:45]  that is all I have folks thank you
[21:45]  12same with our webiste as well, tomorrow nite for ours
[21:45] * submissive2 is trying to write faster!!!
[21:45]  ty much  Moderator1
[21:45] * submissive3 fills up her url catcher
[21:45] * Switch1 too
[21:45] * submissive22 slips out
[21:45]  it will be on the website folks....you can get it there :)
[21:45] * submissive2 suddenly wishes she knew what a URL catcher is
[21:45] * submissive3 is also a local safe call for those in Michigan, bt I am willing to call 
for anyone in the US.....
[21:46]  may i ask the url to the website Mod5?
[21:46]  thanks very much MODERATOR1
[21:46]  !web
[21:46]  submissive2 and submissive3 look tomorrow on www.houseofmusiclive.com
[21:46]  Thnanks, moderator3
[21:46]  the links will be availaible ther
[21:46]  Thanks even
[21:46]  you can visit here or TSC anytime and type !web to get it :)
[21:46]  huh?
[21:46]  for what?
[21:46]  LOL
[21:46]  <-----is one tired puppy
[21:47]  our website subbie
[21:47] * submissive3 caught em all
[21:47] * Mod5 chuckles
[21:47]  ok MODERATOR1 would you like to let them know next weeks topic
[21:47]  get some rest Moderator1 
[21:47]  yeah 
[21:47]  i'm out
[21:47] * submissive6 waves
[21:47]  For what it's worth... I have met now 64 people from online... 
and I have never had a bad experience... so if anyone wants to pick my brain, they are welcome to
[21:47]  What should you do if you do have problems and are abused?
[21:47]  thank You Aall
[21:48]  by guys :}}
[21:48]  Night all
Session Close: Sun Apr 02 21:48:33 2006

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