| Author |
Subject |
vlcgirl
Registered User
(8/12/00 12:24:41 am)
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Haydn
DM Cello Concerto
What's your favorite edition of the
Haydn D-Major Concerto?
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zambocello
Registered User
(8/12/00 5:43:47 am)
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haydn
D
I think all the various editions are
valuable for their ideas on bowings and fingerings, as well as the
different cadenzas. A must, though is the Henle urtext edition, so
one relizes what is from Haydn and what is from the editor.
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vlcgirl
Registered User
(8/13/00 12:48:14 am)
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Re:
Haydn DM Cello Concerto
Thanks for the input, Z!
The
reason I started this thread, actually, is I am/was supposed to be
learning the Haydn DM this summer...well, I have been slaving away
in vain, I realized, because I recently sat down with my part in
hand, listened to three recordings of the work (Rostropovich, Ma and
someone else whose name escapes me) and -- MY EDITION IS ALL
WRONG!!! It's by International Music Company/Gevaert/Rose Ed. I
can't believe it. The first movement especially was totally
spliced/altered. However, I rather liked the cadenza.
Does
the Urtext edition seem to represent the most commonly heard
interpretations? Do you have any other recommendations for me, other
than to unmemorize the Rose mess? (I hope I'm not offending anyone
here, I am just discouraged at the moment.)
Thanks
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G
M Stucka
Registered User
(8/13/00 8:00:38 am)
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Re:
Haydn DM Cello Concerto
Don't be too harsh with Mr. Rose.
The chief culprit in the International Edition is Mr. Gevaert. He's
the one responsible for that particular "arrangement" which seems to
have been the preferred version by many (except Feuermann) for many
years. The best part of that edition is that you have before you the
fabulous "Feuermann" cadenza. (that's the longer of the 2 cadenzas
in that edition.)
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zambocello
Registered User
(8/13/00 1:53:39 pm)
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You
haven't been slaving away in vain.......
........there's just more material
to learn than you thought. (The Gevaert edition just cuts out the
boring parts.  )
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OyOy
Registered User
(8/14/00 8:05:41 am)
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Re:
Haydn DM Cello Concerto
Don't sweat it. Haydn didn't write
it anyway. Nothing wrong with the Gaveart; tightens the piece up a
little. And, as Gary points out, it contains some cool cadenzas.
Just enjoy the ride, it's a concerto we all play and love, whatever
edition you might use.
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David
Sanders 
Registered User
(8/14/00 12:43:59 pm)
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Re:
Haydn DM Cello Concerto
Sorry OyOy, I have to
disagree.
I'm not arguing whether Haydn wrote it or not, but if
you are going to play it, don't play the Gaveart edition. Play the
full version, and use the Feuermann cadenza.
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zambocello
Registered User
(8/14/00 5:09:33 pm)
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Kraft
was a good composer.............
...........but the Kraft Sonatas I
have on the shelf are not by the same composer who wrote the D Major
Concerto, ifyanowhudamean. The cello writing is similar -- Kraft no
doubt showed Haydn what the cello could do -- but, IMHO, the music
of the authentic Kraft works is much shallower than that of the D
Major Concerto.
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dennisw
Registered User
(8/14/00 6:07:32 pm)
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Re:
Haydn DM Cello Concerto
Is there a way to authenticate
the
author of this music??? Or is it
just speculation &
rumor that the
piece was written by Kraft???
Who published
the manuscript??? Who
was the named author of the piece
when
it was published???
Is it not possible that Haydn
"borrowed"
some ideas from Kraft and incorporated
them into
his own piece, which he then
published under his own
name???
Or are you saying that Haydn flat-out
pirated the
music which was written
by Kraft??
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Laura
Wichers
Registered
User
(8/14/00 9:00:40 pm)
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Oh no,
not this again!
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Tracie
Price 
Registered User
(8/15/00 12:14:41 am)
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Re:
Haydn DM Cello Concerto
I know, we've been through it
before.
But I heard that they actually found a manuscript in
Haydn's handwriting. Is that untrue?
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OyOy
Registered User
(8/15/00 8:28:53 am)
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Haydn
Redux
I know we've been through this
before, and have no wish to annoy Laura by restarting the whole
debate. Like the political threads we were recently subjected to,
some topics don't lend themselves to resolution or consensus.
But just to quickly recap the situation with the "Haydn" D
major concerto, we're caught between the Scylla of the authentic
manuscript in Haydn's hand and the Charybdis of the complete
impossibility that the music came from Haydn's mind. Both of these
points are unanswerable. I certainly have no competent opinion as to
who DID compose the concerto, I only know that Haydn couldn't have.
What he was doing writing/copying it out is one of music's great
unsolved mysteries.
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Tim
Janof
Registered
User
(8/15/00 9:45:20 am)
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Re:
Haydn DM Cello Concerto
For a summary of our past
discussion, there are some excerpts from Cello Chat in the
September/October 1999 newsletter.
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dennisw
Registered User
(8/15/00 2:27:59 pm)
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Re:
Haydn Redux
I think you mean to say "I believe
that Haydn
couldn't have." You really don't know that
Haydn
didn't compose the music.
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OyOy
Registered User
(8/15/00 3:02:31 pm)
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Re:
Haydn Redux
Oh, but I do.
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Toscha
Registered User
(8/16/00 12:08:19 pm)
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Re:
Haydn DM Cello Concerto
I may be behind the time, but I
thought the D major concerto was written by Haydn and NOT Kraft. Has
the table turned again? (I remember the dispute from reading some
years back, but I thought it was settled). What about the C major
concerto?
I have not played the concerto myself yet, but I
have about a dozen of recording of it and was wondering why everyone
is doing their own things in the first movement. It is not
noticeable in the other two, but first movement is noticeably
different on each versions I have.
I own Suggia, Casals
(first two movements only), Feuermann, Cassado, Fournier (two
versions, Munchinger and Baumgartner), de Machura, Gendron, Shafran,
du Pre, Janigro, Walevska and Tania Tetzlaff. Most of the cellists
from older generations (Suggia, Casals, Feuermann and Janigro) seem
to use the same edition, but there are some variants. Newer ones are
using various different editions. Is it because of playability? Or
is there more than one manuscript?? It is certainly intriguing
indeed...
Toscha 
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vlcgirl
Registered User
(8/16/00 9:45:51 pm)
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Re: to
toscha
Thank you so much for your reply! I
have been waiting for someone to give me some real feedback on my
original question  , which was
regarding which edition people preferred using (not who wrote the
blasted thing). I am, upon recommendation, going to check out the
Urtext (which I am sure =$$$). Thanks to all for the interesting
responses!
Edited by vlcgirl
at: 8/16/00 9:45:51 pm
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Carocello
Registered
User
(8/17/00 4:16:07 pm)
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Haydn
in D
I like very much the Gendron
edition. The cover of the partition is silver. The cadenza is
amazing but not too difficult. It is from Gendron too.
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