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Paul
Tseng ICS Staff 
Administrator
(8/3/00 12:26:14 pm)
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Popper
etudes
Tonight I decided to go back and
review the Popper Etudes that for years (back in the mid 80's) were
drilled into me week after week, lesson after lesson. I could not
start a lesson with out scales, arpeggios and an etude. Boy, those
were the days!
It's been years since I've worked on them
intensely and I've found a new respect for them as well as the hard
work that was put into them in my early college years.
What a
great way to solidify your technique! OK, so they aren't the most
inspiring pieces, but they sure do help.
I worked on Popper
13 tonight and started to recall all the things I was taught about
this one. It's a good reality check for how solid your left hand
technique is after years of being away from them (great for
intonation work!) with all the Octaves, thirds and sixths (as well
as trilled double-stops... actually measured 64th
notes)
What's your favorite Popper Etude and why? What do
you find it helpful for?
Paul Tseng, Cello Chat Administrator
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The San Diego
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susan
Registered User
(7/13/00 11:51:48 am)
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Re:
Popper etudes
I love my popper etudes, but I have
a hard time with favorites, because which ever one I'm working on
generally becomes my favorite while I'm figuring it out. I think
that no. 7 is near the top, as well as 18, I think... it's that nice
dramatic one with the double stops. I'm hoping to learn that one
about 6 months from now, if all goes well.
One of the things that
I really like about these etudes is that they're really good for
practicing gratuitous musicality-- you can play them with a humorous
flourish and get away with exageration. In fact, that's one of the
things about them-- they're not musical masterpieces, but every
phrase teaches to both a technical problem and a musical problem, so
you have a really good oppertunity to combine your technique with
your music early on. Some technical exersises are SO unmusical that
it's hard to apply them once I'm trying to focus on a musical idea.
I could go on an' on about etudes, that is, when I'm not
currently practicing, because then of course I just want to go
practice.
Some of my most satisfying learning comes from the
focused hours I spend on etudes and scales. They're really
refreshing in that they make my physical machinery feel all nicely
toned and flexible, and they clear my mind out so I can focus
better.
To piggy back on your scales & warm ups thread, I
find that the more regularely I spend time getting well warmed up
and practicing the technical exersises, the better I get at getting
into the groove-- I warm up faster, learn them faster, and generally
end up spending less time getting more done on them. Two hours can
easily end up fitting into a half hour or so. Then when I move on to
the actual music the effect of the warm-ups translates over, and I
find that I spend more time on the music and less on the technique.
It does lead me to wonder, though, about when you get out of
school and go into the teaching or performing business, whether it
still works that way.
I definitely don't have my technique
solidified in a perminant way yet, so that I can depend on knowing
how to do a long-range shift no matter what.
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dennisw
Registered User
(7/13/00 2:53:10 pm)
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Re:
Popper etudes
Let's see here... Off the top of my
head I would say
that #1 & #19 are good for spiccato and
string crossings,
#6 & (I think #26 or #27) also good for
spiccato/sautille,
#5 & (I think #30) are good because they
are in F#major
and G-flat major respectively and it's good to
practice
in those keys (especially thumb position) for sharpening
relative pitch. The mordent one is annoying and a pain
for me,
but also useful. #9 is good for parallel thirds.
#17 (I think
it's 17) in c minor is good for parallel sixths. Then there are a
number that are left-hand
oriented for general thumb position
practice and shifting
like #8,#12,#18,#24 (getting the lay of the
fingerboard).
I would say you can't beat Popper for
etudes.
I also like Duport because the harmony is so clear
and
18th century-oriented. It's easy to hear the keys and
it
helps to sharpen intonation. Most of them follow a
common formula
of techniques, but I like that many are
written in less commonly
used keys, d-flat major, e-flat minor, a-flat major etc. I find that
Duport is a pretty
good preparation for Haydn.
In fact,
the only etudes I've run across that I can't
say that much for
are those of Joseph Merk. I don't
know what it is about them, but
they don't seem to be
well written for the cello. Some of the
harmonic transitions are odd, his suggested fingerings I
frequently
ignor, they are corny to the max, and I'm just not
sure
how useful they are to spend the time learning them.
Does
anyone else feel this way??? Maybe I'm missing
something about
their usefulness...
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lankyn
Registered User
(7/13/00 10:12:04 pm)
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Re:
Popper etudes
After my third go-around through the
Popper High School of Cello Playing (studying seriously all the
etudes each time), I got a little tired of them. So I took a break
and presently only play them when I want to go back to something
familiar. Some day I will get serious about them again. They are
great technique builders!
My present "hot" books are the
Dotzauer 113 Studies Books II and III. The only etude book I really
did NOT ever like is Grutzmacher Etudes Vol. 2, especially starting
at etude #17 and finishing out the book. I found it quite painful
and on the overkill side to developing solid cello technique.
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STaylor
Registered User
(7/16/00 6:14:03 pm)
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I Love
Popper
I know that most people think I am
nuts when I start talking about this, but I am spending a lot of my
summer time going back to the High School of Cello Playing too. I
did most of them when I was in high school. At that time I just
thought of them as medicine. I have a much different attitude now,
though, at age 38. I find them interesting musically and I just like
playing them. No, it is not like Bach (what is?), but they are
wonderful little pieces for cello alone. As of today #7 is my
favorite. What is it good for? I don't care about that!
I
urgue you all to look at these etudes in a similar way that pianists
view their own etudes. If you convince yourself that there is no
music there, there definitely won't be. If you seek out the music,
you'll find it and bring it out. It is the musical content of a
piece that brings out the most demand for technique. Technique is
meaningless in a vacuum.
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matthias24
Registered
User
(7/16/00 9:20:49 pm)
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Re: I
Love Popper
your comments about technique and
musicality working together, reminds me of a piece that we played
last year (in band. no orchestra at my school) in Wind Ensemble (the
GOOD one, that i was in  ) we played
"Mass" from "La Fiesta Mexicana." (anyone heard of it?) if you just
look at the music, which is nothing more than whole notes through
eighth notes (except for the millions of 8th note triplets in the
right hand, and steady 8th notes in the left on the chime part,
which i had the privelige of playing, ) it look
VERY easy. one of our freshman girls, who is pretty clueless
musically, commented that even the middle school bands could play
that. little did she know, that every single part is so exposed,
that playing together musically was a huge challenge. (however, we
DID pull it off with straight 1's at all our contests, winning
sweepstakes award for our band program)
so technically, the
piece looked easy, but musically, it was EXTREMELY difficult (for a
high school anyway. ) just
thought i should comment, even though i'm sure no one cares.
~ aaron ~
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Lissey
Registered
User
(8/2/00 9:00:30 am)
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Wanted:
Advice of wise old cellists
OK, I know I'm reopening a topic
discussed a while back. I just started studying the Popper etudes -
up to now, my technique books were the Dotzauer exercises. Those of
you who have studied both - how do they compare? Is Popper more
advanced or are they both equally useful? Considering my study time
is somewhat limited, what would you suggest - going on with
Dotzauer, or starting some of the easier Popper etudes?
I
haven't gotten far with Popper yet - as I said I just started. If
any of you can offer any words of wisdom regarding the first couple
of studies, I would be mui
grateful. As nice as
they are, the etudes can be pretty intimidating for a newbie! No. 2,
especially - I just can't get the hang of the bowing; I always run
out of bow before the phrase is finished! Any tips, anyone?
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Cellochick
Registered User
(8/2/00 9:15:11 am)
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Tips
for No.2
I remember that it helped me to
practice w/o the left hand for a while, just concentrating on how
much bow to use. It's a delicate matter. Try practicing what I call
the "overkill" method, using the least amount of bow possible for
each 16-note run. Then use more bow - it will feel so much better!
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Stefan79
Registered User
(8/2/00 12:06:53 pm)
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Popper
No. 2
I played this etude at
my Guildhall audition last December, it's really very, very strange
that I got in when I think about it... Popper didn't
sound good at all...so...maybe you shouldn't listen to me...
When I
started to practice on it I did exactly the things that you
shouldn't do! I tried to play it as it's written without actually
practicing it instead of taking it slow.
Think about your left
hand, does it really know what notes to play all the time? I started
by setting the metronome at 60 and playing 2 notes a bow, that way I
could focus on my left hand. Then I just played it and played it and
finally the metronome was at 100. Then I played 4 notes a bow and
once again set the metronome on 60. Then I played 8 notes a bow and
so on...until you can play it as its written. It's just a matter of
practicing in the right way. Don't forget to practice only the
string crossings with the bow.
And make sure that you bow close
to the bridge, that way you don't need to use that much bow to get a
good tone.
At my audition I played it way to fast as well. Just
because I was afraid I'd run out of bow at the end of a phrase.  If I'd worked
on it instead of playing with it from the beginning that wouldn't
have happened...
Good luck, it's a great study!
-
Stefan
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dennisw
Registered User
(8/2/00 1:05:54 pm)
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Re:
Wanted: Advice of wise old cellists
I find that if the left hand is
solid, then it's easier to get all those notes
in 1 bow. I
practice it 2 bows to the measure until I can work up
to
somewhere around quarter note=84bpm, then I switch to 1 bow
per measure.
If the left hand is solid you can concentrate on
the right as you play.
The point of this etude is to develop
the ability maintaining a steady up and
down bow with string
crossings over lots of notes
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Laura
Wichers
Registered
User
(8/2/00 1:07:24 pm)
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Re:
Wanted: Advice of wise old cellists
One of the problems that I had with
this etude was using WAY too much bow whenever my left hand shifted.
The high C in the 4th or 5th line was the main roadblock. I think
this etude is mainly for right hand technique, specifically bow
distribution, so don't get too hung up on the
fingering.
Before trying the printed bowing, make sure your
left hand is absolutely secure with the notes. I practiced 4
notes/bow, using exactly 1/4 of the bow for each note, going all the
way from the frog to the tip. Then I learned 6 notes/bow, 8 notes,
10, etc, not continuing until I was secure with the current bowing.
I think the key is using the same amount of bow for each note -
don't use more bow when you shift, or when you change bow direction,
or between string crossings.
Also, think of the etude as a
melody... it's a bit similar to the Bach G maj prelude (use your
imagination!). For me, doing a bit of phrasing made the bowing
happen *almost* automatically. And, I think the whole thing is
marked "p", so don't worry about getting tons of volume. Concentrate
on getting a uniform good tone throughout the
etude.
-Laura
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Stefan79
Registered User
(8/2/00 3:34:38 pm)
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Re:
Popper etudes
My favorite Popper etude is
No. 20, Appassionato, Allegro. I like it because it's really fun to
play, I really like the ending of it! It's great
for your intonation, it has a lot of octaves...
Other etudes that
I like are:
#2 - Great bowing exercise!
#9 - Great for getting
you double stops in tune!
#11 - Good for string crossings.
#12
- I see this as a bowing exercise, it also has some arpeggios and
octaves.
#13 - As you already said, this is so great for
practicing double stops and intonation.
#18 - It was this etude
that really opened my eyes to what technique is, I had never
realized that there are so many different position to play in...
#22 - I
really like the high D on the second page!
#33 -
This is very good if you want to practice arpeggios!
#38 - Great
for learning how to play really fast!
#40 - This one is really
fun to play, a bit boring though...
- Stefan
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Lissey
Registered
User
(8/3/00 2:26:12 am)
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One
more thing
Forgot to ask one other thing - do
you think I should study the etudes in order (1,2,3 etc.)? Does the
diffculty increase gradually, or are some of the later etudes easier
than some of the early ones?
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Stefan79
Registered User
(8/3/00 6:57:20 am)
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Re. One
more thing
No, I don't think you
should study them in order. I think you should begin with
these:
#1 - to learn playing in different positions, always
knowing where you have your first finger, string crossings with the
bow
#2 - bowing exercise...you already know this one...
#5 -
also a great way to learn how to do clean shifts between positions.
#6 - keep those fingers on the fingerboard...
#11 -
this is for string crossings, a bow exercise
#16 - be sure you
see all the accidentals...
#19 - "Lohengrin Study", a good
spiccato exercise, and also a nice work out for the left hand
#34
- double stops, make sure they're in tune
#36 - I think that this
is the easiest study in the whole Op. 73, it's really fun to play, a
friend of mine used it for a recital...he's quite a practice
Other people will probably tell you to start with other
studies, this is just my opinion...I'm not a teacher...
Good
luck!
- Stefan
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