Cloud - 11/30/98 02:54:41
My Email:cloudthegreat@hotmail.com

Comments:
Most of the content of this website is partially true. "Partially", huh..... If you translate this website into Chinese and let a ordinary Chinese watch it, they may agree many of the content, but surely disagree with one thing: the tone of this website. [GCM Editors' Response: The tone is sarcastic humor. If that did not come through, then maybe you need to improve your English or we need to improve our writing skills.] The webmaster seems hate most of the Chinese(although he has to put the words such as "not every Chinese is like that", "there is some Chinese we haven't met", so do many westerner who leave their words here. Surely I can tell you that the difficulties you meet in China TODAY is due to the unfamiliar with Chinese customs and prejudice. [GCM Editors' Response: The classic Chinese defense, "You do not understand China." Whenever you hear this in China, run the other way, because you are about to hear some crazy story that doesn't make sense. Usually in a business setting, it is an attempt to hide some sort of scam whereby the person speaking is getting a kickback or red envelope for doing something that is not in your company's best interest.] And I can tell you one thing that most Chinese people look at the westerner as friends except when encounter someone like the webmaster of this page. I can say that bec use I live in mainland China as ordinary people, I understand and know the things you westerners don't. I think when people read this website, they should clearly divid the "bad" things described in this website into at least two categories: the things you think bad or not right merely because of your are unfamiliar with the Chinese customs, and the bad t ings that no single human in the world would tolerate and to be improved. For example, about the office room. The webmaster describe the office rooms in very bad quralty, which is true only for less and less the cases. In fact, more and more office roo s in China, at least in big cities has the same or even the better quarlity as the office rooms in USA. This is an not an issue that characterize China, and the downside of it is improving. There is no reason to be hateful of it. [GCM Editors' Response: Did anyone every tell you that you are too sensitive?] This website, in my opinion,is not a good site, not because it list the dark sides of China(which every Chinese will like to hear and like to discuss), but because it's attitude toward China and Chinese people. This kind of attitude cannot led to the s ccess of a western businessman in China or improve China in any aspect, but to provoke the hostile mood of Young Chinese people toward Western countries, which may make most of your impression that Chinese people is trying to revenge westerners comes true Anyway, appreciate that the webmaster has created this site, and let me know that one stream of thought about China and Chinese people of some western people. But to the webmaster, may I tell you one thing: freedom of speech doesn't necessary lead an individual to the truth, if he only care about what he says but does not think careful and constantly that if there is something wrong, or something can be chang d in his idea. [GCM Editors' Response: What are you so afraid of? Us pointing out that China is not perfect? It's high time that Chinese stop congratulating themsleves on their great culture and make some efforts to improve on this culture. A little less lying would be a nice start. Isn't this the same argument that has been going on for the last 200 years or so? Sun Yat Sen must be doing the Cha Cha in his grave.]

- 11/30/98 02:06:08

Comments:

[GCM Editors' Response: These are the wisest comments yet.]

Xiao Liu - 11/30/98 01:31:10
My Email:liu@alphalink.com.au

Comments:
As a Chinese people I feel shamed to say, yes, some phenomenon like you metioned in this page do exist in China. Thank you for pointing out these backward sights of China - hence we know what to do to improve our reputation. As a western journalist you've done pretty a good job, revealing only the dark side in China, and exaggerate it artistically to form a site that westerners are glad to see. [GCM Editors' Response: Yes, so far you have gotten the point exactly. Thanks]. I'm sorry for you, as you did a pretty hopeless job as a businessman that the people you employed, you dealt with, and the banquets you attended are of such a low-level. In comparison to those successful businessman who are earning big money and having th elites of Chinese as their employees, you are a loser. [GCM Editors' Response: Now you are just trying to make us feel bad. Boo hoo!] There's a Chinese proverb that describes you: "the grapes must be soul, the fox reckons because he cannot reach them." About 50% of the contents in this site is true, I think, and if you are not prejudicial, you don't need to tease about things you've rarely seen in the western society, such as Karaoke and drinking. [GCM Editors' Response: Just joking. Lighten up, dude!]

Macross - 11/28/98 23:16:23

Comments:
For last message, I wonder there are still such people who haven't thought about yourselves who also always did/do/are doing the same bad things as some bad(2%) Chinese people did/do/are doing? How a frog is ever only in the cave and has never seen the w rld ! So silly, you are just like the little kids and never grew up to see the whole world. So if there are a lot of western people like you, then the western countries will become more and more losers in the 21st century! However, Chinese people never say such incorrect things because these things are not proved by full knowledge. And they never say such bad-ugly-dirty-western-people's things to others because this would affect what others think about them and because tho e bad, ugly, dirty things are just some of the western people did/do/are doing, like you who are doing them now, even they are more than 50% of the western people. This is because "most"(be careful of your arguments) Chinese people are the gentlements an have peace who only spread the peaceful messages all over the world. Therefore, you can do a research that most of the people in the world like Chinese people more than others. You know which countries have most of their colonies all over the world, th n you would know how they liked to invade others. You can't argue that this is just the history. It reveals the bad parts of their cultures and their actual bad aggression in their hearts even they can't(maybe they still can do because they are like the cruel tribes or uncivilized people) do them anymore now. And because all countries are actually not allowed to invade others today, you should know why. So you can't compare today's situation with the past's. You won't have argument at this point because you are obviously doing the certain absolutely, totally wrong things in this website. In the 21st century, more laws on internet, you will be put in jail if you will still do such things on your website! Don't know/think you are wrong? Think about it deeply. Actually don't need to think that hard. But it depends how smart you are, uncivilized specy. And I won't be put jail. Don't know why? Think about it if you are smart(actually easy but since you re just not smart and so that you did/do/are doing such bad-ugly-dirty-wrong things here) enough. Again, if you want to challenge me by debate or whatever, I will see how you have done enough research to make me feel less garbage/waste of your words or arguments and at least a little worthy to respond such the frog in the cave. [GCM Editors' Response: Pooooiiiiintless!]

- 11/28/98 23:15:45

Comments:
For last message, I wonder there are still such people who haven't thought about yourselves who also always did/do/are doing the same bad things as some bad(2%) Chinese people did/do/are doing? How a frog is ever only in the cave and has never seen the w rld ! So silly, you are just like the little kids and never grew up to see the whole world. So if there are a lot of western people like you, then the western countries will become more and more losers in the 21st century! However, Chinese people never say such incorrect things because these things are not proved by full knowledge. And they never say such bad-ugly-dirty-western-people's things to others because this would affect what others think about them and because tho e bad, ugly, dirty things are just some of the western people did/do/are doing, like you who. [GCM Editors' Response: Oh yeah? Well, your mother wears army boots!..... We now declare ourselves the winner of this debate.]

Macross - 11/28/98 22:17:13

Comments:
Shame of you as some of the western people who judge things which you have not found enough research on them that caused other western people misunderstand Chinese people. [GCM Editors' Response: We have lived in China for 18 years and speak fluent Chinese. Nuf said.] As you have mentioned the things in your website are only about 2% of the people in China do such things. But you only said, these are what the "Chinese people" do. If you can do that, well, there are a lot of shameful ugly things and even happen in the western people and what they do/did! And their ugly dirty immoral actions are at least half of the western do, especially the young western people. You are so unfortunate since I found this website. If I have time to tell you your ugly things in detail and keep debating with you. You all must become the losers! I never failed in debate. But you first must find enough research to order to make me feel worthy to debate with you. If not, all your words or arguments are just the garbages which no need to debate with you at all. [GCM Editors' Response: Pointless debate style. No wonder you always win. Wrongs by westerners do not excuse wrongs by Chinese. Westerners need to improve and so do Chinese.]

J. Xie - 11/24/98 05:09:54
My Email:jx6683@my-dejanews.com

Comments:
Really funny site. Keep up the good work! I'll definitely come back. One thing I can't get over is, how the hell you guys learned all the drinking scams which took me years to perfect. What is so bad about boy babies in China? [GCM Editors' Response: It is not the boy babies themselves, but the 2 parents, and 4 grandparents surrounding the baby and giving it too much attention i.e. creating a monster. See above comments by "A Chinese" for an example of what happens when this occurs. Scary!] Yup, girl babies are cute and all that, and boy babies are obnoxious and loud. But ain't that pretty much true for babies all around the world? The biggest complaint I have is the de-myth of "we Chinese are all Kong Fu masters" part. Hey, I need to use that to gain some respects from those uninformed gullible gwei lo (guilao in Pinyin). You are telling me now I have to tell them the truth that can only bench press 300+ lbs but can't do no Kong Fu? -Peace, love & binary- [GCM Editors' Response: You were bench pressing 300 pounds once and then suddenly the alarm clock woke you from your dreams. On the other hand, if you really can bench press 300 pounds, then we sincerely apoligize for the above comment and bow down to your glorious biceps. By the way, do us a favor and please contact some of the other readers above who do not seem to have understood the point, tone, or specific meaning of this site.]

kanibaal - 10/27/98 05:06:58
My Email:yeah right!!!

Comments:
Hey, chin up lads. Don't let the overly sensitive, politically-correct-only-for-those-who-spew-the-same-bile USENET crowd get you down. I've found the same sort of response to my less than PC opinionated rantings in many other such "open-minded" forums. U fortunately, most of the bone-headed imbicilic neanderthals forget that "racism" is by definition a systematic form of pradjudice and discrimination driven by social or political institutions... so you could engage in racist behavior in support of a gover mental system; but you could not be racist unless you were a dedicated pice of the system in question. Am I being too analytical here? I think they mean to call you prejudiced. *sigh* I guess I'm going to have to call the grammer police and travel into th dank and filthy confines of the USENET in order to knock some heads together and kick some serious butt. Why'd you guys have to go and get me all riled up like this...? Let's just hope it doesn't get bloody! ;-D

Fred - 10/26/98 18:36:04
My URL:http://members.aol.com/lumabner/china.htm

Comments:
Cool, entertaining, and educational site! A sense of humor and a thick skin are essential for "gwei lo" survival in China. Visit my "Living and Teaching in China" site for a teacher's view of China life. [GMC Editors' Response: Visited your site and enjoyed it very much. Thanks.]

John Mezzano - 10/18/98 21:17:59
My Email:mezzano@bccom.com

Comments:
very interesting reading. i will come back to see future updates. John Mezzano NY, NY

AJB - 10/16/98 16:49:51
My Email:ajbesq2@yahoo.com

Comments:
Hilarious site! Comprehensive and biting. [GCM Editors' Response: Here's a reader who gets the point. Halleluyah!]

Third world Traveller - 10/06/98 01:30:59

Comments:
I could take your web page and change it to "Western Guerillas in the XXXXX Mist" where XXXXX can be replaced with any poor developing country, you think China is bad, try doing business in India or Russia! Most of your complaints would be equally applicable in any number of developing countries If the chinese people are so irredeemably backward, how come singapore and hongkong are ahead of western countries like the UK (hong kong's former colonial master) or France in income, competitiveness, incorruptibility, etc.? The bottom line is: Don't blame the chinese, blame the poverty. [GCM Editors' Response: Don't agree but thats for the input.]

JOHN MARSH - 10/03/98 16:23:07
My Email:zen99@aol.com

Comments:
I made film in China in '97 - first 'western' film with american script shot entirely with chinese crew and director (Sherwood Hu.) We shot in Hainan and Shanghai, making film with Shanghai Film Studio personnel for most part. Your site would have been i valuable.

Kanada - 10/03/98 04:35:42

Comments:
you sure do hate the Chinese. you stereotype. you think that you are being funny...but it is all hate and contempt. you have been living too long in China. you should go back from where you came from. but then you would be out of a job and everyone will call you a loser. why don't you take a look in the mirror. if you are thinking all these nasty things about the Chinese, I wonder what the people around you think of you. They are thinking that you are just another foreigner who wants to take advantage and exploit the Chinese. The saddest day in history is the day the Chinese met the white man. [GCM Editors' Response: Could China have dug themselves out of their economic distaster without our help?]

Angel - 10/03/98 04:09:30

Comments:
Myth #10: Humans are humble and polite Reality: Humans suck! Humans are stupid Humans are ignorant Humans are insensitive Humans are arrogant Humans are bisexual Humans are selfish Humans are greedy Humans are violent Humans are indifferent to human suffering. Humans are hypocrites. Humans are sex addicts. Humans are complainers and whiners. Humans deserve to die. If there is a god-then how come god doesn't destroy the despicable human species? [GCM Editors' Response: Psycho.]

Dean Polizzotto - 09/27/98 12:12:54
My URL:http://www.jpinstruments.com
My Email:jpinst@earthlink.net

Comments:
After spending years in China, both working and studying, I can say that I find your analysis quite accurate. Almost too accurate. its very nice to see that one isn't alone out there. [GCM Editors' Response: Our feeling exactly.]

Western Guerillas - 09/26/98 13:40:31
My Email:xifang_houzi@hotmail.com

Comments:
Thanks to all the folks that have been sending us emails. We have posted some of these on this bulletin board page below. Western Guerilla Editors.

Jack S. by email
My Email:email via Western Guerillas

Comments:
I wondering are you Mr. Paul Yip or are you related to him? [GCM Editors' Response: What exactly do we win if we admit we are Paul Yip? If it is a cash prize, then the answer is yes, we are Paul Yip. Otherwise the answer is no.]

Anon by email
My Email:email via Western Guerillas

Comments:
My wife is 1/2 Chinese and grew up with her mother's (Chinese) relatives for the most part. We spent about half an hour reading your pages yesterday. By the end she was nodding in agreement with almost everything you wrote. I think her comment was "These guys are bitter as hell, but it looks like they know what they're talking about." I asked her if those attitudes were really that prevalent. She said "Think of everything you hate about Japan and Japanese culture and remember that the Chinese have been at it longer." Good stuff. I hope the "coming soon" part comes soon. [GCM Editors' Response: First we are accused of being racist against Chinese. Now you are going to get us in more trouble with your comment about the Japanese. Thanks a lot!]

scotty by email
My Email:email via Western Guerillas

Comments:
Just read your drinking in china page. so true ! however, as some western hotheads (myself included - see below...) may read this and take it seriously, i.e., look forward to drinkin' them under the table and boosting their own egos, maybe you should include the example of my first experience with a chinese company boss as an indication of how to avoid losing business even when you drank with them.... once upon a time down in thailand, a native scottish salesman (yours truly) thought he had made a deal with his expatriate taiwanese factory owner when hands were shaken and dinner was offered. no chance ! upon finishing the substantial first course of roasted peanuts in the centre of the table, taiwanese boss remembered the nationality of his host and out came a set of BIG brandy glasses and a humungous bottle of Chivas Regal. no ice, no water....."mixer" is a swear word i believe. great hospitality thought i. after the first couple of gan beis of halfpint beer glass dimensions it started to get serious. he was on the attack and thoroughly enjoying it....in fact, so was i, while desperately filling my belly with as much rice as possible. however, after the first bottle (straight), i thought attacking with counterganbeis was the best form of defence......unfortunately, patriotism seeped through also.....the phrase "no damn foreigner's going to beat me at my national drink !!" did come to mind. needless to say, i stayed for dessert having inherited his initial "thorough enjoyment", poor old factory owner was carried to the factory outhouse to sleep it off well before the sweet rice soup. it goes without saying that i lost the deal because he lost face (his female thai factory cook carried him to that outhouse in full view of his labour force). no letter of credit and none of my calls answered since ! moral of the story.....drink with them, let them respect your drinking prowess, but let them really, truly believe they can take their alcohol better than you by acting totally, humungously, shamefully p****d in their presence and begging them to stop but carrying on all the same......... next edition - "involuntarily stripping in front of your drunken hosts and escorts in a hualien karaoke club. east taiwan"....coming soon on an email near you. cheers ! [GCM Editors' Response: What a terrible story. Not funny at all and very boring. We have much better drinking stories that could easily top this one. Unfortunately for some reason we can not remember any of them at this point in time. Re "involuntarily stripping": Is that similar to "spontaneous combustion"? Looking forward to your future comments especially about the drunken escorts.....Watch how upset people will get about any comment about attractive women and/or sexual relations. This is really a sensitive topic on the USENET newsgroups. We have come to the conclusion that being attracted to a beautiful women is no longer acceptable in cyberspace society. Fortunately not many people in China are hooked up on the Internet yet.]

Anon by email
My Email:email via Western Guerillas

Comments:
* I remember the american cartoons where I sang to the bouncing ball on of them was Casper the Friendly ghost!... * I think the karaoke owner might choose a less popular hostess girls because 1. she needs the work. 2. she is more likely to be available 3. you asked him to pick the girl so you must not be picky about women! [GMC Editors' Response: Good points. But understanding this does not make the girl any better looking to us. That is why we opt not for cultural understanding of the karaoke owner's reasoning, but instead prefer to use our patented western guerilla tactics to ensure we get a good looking girl.] * some chinese are talking about VCD laser disk karaoke (using a 5"inch CD-ROM-XA format, MPEG-1 video compression) * Success - if u get drunk before you sing nobody will blame you for singing badly. * joking about lung cancer is not funny - especially if you know people who have died from it. [GMC Editors' Response: Sorry about that.] * I agree that speaking chinese really does get u brownie points with PRC chinese. but singing well in chinese will probably give you name recognition! :-P Getting contracts usually means connecting up with people control the money and convincing them you have what they want to buy. I think your primary focus should be how to ask questions and get answers from tight lipped chinese bureaucrates. Does alcohol make the tongue wag? [GCM Editors' Response: It is impossible for us to reach any conclusion without proper research. Please send us a six-pack of beer, and we will call you on the phone after finishing it off.]

Anon by email
My Email:email via Western Guerillas

Comments:
i hate sea cucumber - it has a very fishy bitter taste ugh. some chinese don't like you to make noise when you eat (maybe that's why you are not closing any contracts?) [GCM Editors' Response: Actually you may find that western guerilla tactics work extremely well in closing contracts in China. Whereas bowing and fawning over the Chinese will get you lots of smiles but not much business or respect. It is hard for some people to understand this but it really is true based on our experience.] my dad was like that - I had to eat quietly.. . that's really hard for a naturally slurping chinese! mandarin noodles w/ a peanut like sauce = dan-dan noodles , good stuff. [GCM Editors' Response: We prefer Taiwan-style cold noodles (liang mian) to Shanghai style dan-dan mian. But we have once eaten a great bowl of dan-dan mian at a Chinese place in California. So we guess it depends on the cook.]

Anon by email
My Email:email via Western Guerillas

Comments:
Greetings, My wife is from Taiwan [GCM Editors' Response: Gun bo yia shee dai wan lang; li tia wu bo?]; we now live near Baltimore, Maryland. I enjoy visiting Taiwan, and have good things to say about many Taiwanese. Many of the older generation from Taiwan void your statement: Chinese people are polite and humble. My in-laws are among the finest people you could ever hope to meet. They take the polite and humble issue very seriously. [GCM Editors' Response: Maybe we should rephrase our statement. All Chinese people have a soft and thick outer coating of politeness and humbleness. It is the crunchy inside that tends to break your teeth if your are not prepared for it. This is not to say that this statement applies to every single Chinese person on the face of the earth. We have not met all of them yet.] In addition, I've successfully done business with about 4 different Taiwanese on a long-term basis (I'm a financial adviser and asset manager). I concur with your remarks about Mainland Chinese. But cheer up by going to Taipei. All sorts of fun, food, and entertainment await. I'll be there at Christmas with my family. I'll be reading more of what you wrote. Feel free to contact me if I can help you in any way. Best wishes

Anon by email
My Email:email via Western Guerillas

Comments:
Sounds like you would like Bo Yang as well. [GCM Editors' Response: We are going to add a page of quotes from Bo Yang soon. Great stuff.]

Anon by email
My Email:email via Western Guerillas

Comments:
you are disgusting-get out of china if you don't like it. what is worse than being arrogant- a hypocrite! you insult the chinese-so you better get your stupid ass out of china. [GCM Editors' Response: Actually in our opinion being a hypocrite is worse than being arrogant. But that is really beside the point. As for your request that we "love China or leave it": this tactic did not work in the USA during the sixties, and it will not work on us now. Dui bu qi! We have every right to express our opinions about China. Furthermore, our ass is not stupid at all, it is our brain that is the problem.]

Anon by email
My Email:email via Western Guerillas

Comments:
Just wanted to say how much I enjoyed your site. I've lived in Taiwan for four years now, and could relate to some of your stuff. Having never lived or done business in China, I've been spared some of the more annoying things you mention. You've probably been surprised by the amount of hostile emails you've gotten - isn't it amazing how the most nationalistic of the Chinese have internet access and live in the states? Anyway, had a bloody good laugh. The KTV part was spot on. I couldn't believe you chose the "House of the Rising Sun" too. i'll remember the one about sitting in the corner...... All the best [GCM Editors' Response: Actually we have only received two negative emails versus droves of positive ones. But we have received many negative comments on the USENET newsgroups where the thought police attack us with their favorite power word "racist." Once they have whipped out their power word, there is absolutely no way to intelligently discuss anything with them. We find it very disappointing to see this backwards movement in freedom on the Internet.]

Beryl Gorbman - 09/24/98 02:20:56
My URL:http://www.int-life.com
My Email:berylg@nwrain.com

Comments:
Very funny and informative website. What you say mirrors the experience I had a few years ago when I accompanied my sister to China to adopt a baby. We were extorted, watched, and had unpleasant experiences in hospitals (for the kid) and restaurants. I was particularly charmed by the dining custom involving tossing your chewed up chicken bones over your shoulder onto the restaurant floor. And how about that congee? [GCM Editors' Response: Exactly. Plus we hate their habit of blowing their nose mucus into a soft piece of paper and carrying it around in their pocket all day. Sometimes they even take it out hours later and reuse it. Disgusting!....Oops, maybe we are a little confused today.]

Dan Z. - 09/22/98 20:41:26
My Email:z1000@hotmail.com

Comments:
I found the comments refreshingly funny, some of the stereotypes were true, some were off the mark, though I'm Chinese I didn't feel these comments were made in a mean-spirited way. Beyond the satire, it's sobering to examine the social ills in China in opes of changing it for the better. [GCM Editors' Response: It brings tears of joy to our guerilla eyes to hear you summarize our website so succinctly and accurately after all the crap we have heard on the USENET newsgroups from people who absolutely refuse to understand. Thanks very much.]

Edmund Murphy - 09/22/98 00:47:19
My URL:http://www3.sympatico.ca/edmund.murphy2/Homepage.htm
My Email:edmund.murphy2@sympatico.ca

Comments:
Hi, I read all the articles in your website. I thought it was really interesting, and very funny in some parts too. I just finished working for 1 year in Chengdu, Sichuan province (July 97 to July 98). I was a teacher at small tech. college in the city. [GCM Editors' Response: You sound like just another greedy westerner making a financial killing in China. Shame on you!] First of all, in order to truly appreciate the humour of your web page, I really think you would need to live in China for awhile. A lot of it really hits the mark. I hope I can figure out some way to send this file to the foreigners living in Chengdu. [GCM Editors' Response: We don't know any foreigners there. But go ahead and forward links to anyone you want. Guerillas appreciate any free publicity they can get.] Obviously, you have had some tough times in China. I remember that there were some days when I was really pissed off at the country and everyone who lived in it. I could tell you some stories (and I might do that in another letter to you). [GCM Editors' Response: We smell a new website section idea: "Letters to the Western Guerilla Editors"] I lived there for 1 year, and that is enough for me. Still, I am happy I went there; it was quite an adventure and I learned a lot about the country and made some good friends (and met some cute babes too) [GCM Editors' Response: Zhe zhong "cute" de "babe" de gushi, women zui gan xingqu! Gan kuai xie!]. I'm not really angry at China now; mostly I feel pity for a lot of the people who live there. OK, that's my 2 cents worth for now. I really look forward to seeing more articles on your site. I will write to you again later. By the way, I have added a link to your site from my homepage. Regards, Edmund Murphy [GCM Editors' Response: Thanks for the feedback and support. By the way, isn't it annoying how this comments page makes the written sections very narrow sometimes. If we were not lazy guerillas, we would fix this bug. Anybody up for a banana marguerita?]