16th May, 2000.

You have just entered room "panta98 Chat51."
ScnWrt has entered the room.
iiiiriiiis has entered the room.
frogmobile has entered the room.
iiiiriiiis:Hello Franz, Carl and Khalid!
ScnWrt: Hi, Iris and franz. Please invite Khalid
iiiiriiiis:Franz, will Jutta join?
frogmobile: Hello Guys, I am here
ScnWrt: Hi, folks.
ScnWrt: I will message Steve on ICQ
frogmobile:Hi Iris
iiiiriiiis:Please do so, Carl
frogmobile:Hi Franz
iiiiriiiis:Hello, Khalid!
panta98:Hi! Folks!! Iris, Jutta can't attend today. Busy
correcting  and printing my Africa lecture.
iiiiriiiis:Franz!
panta98:Awaiting, Steve!
frogmobile:Hello! Hello! Hola! Hola!
frogmobile:Como esta Iris?
frogmobile:Franz are you there?
iiiiriiiis:gracias, Khalid, muy bien!
panta98:Steve is on ICQ, inviting him now!
frogmobile:Okay Franz
plasticsmith has entered the room.
ScnWrt: I've been inviting Steve on ICQ
frogmobile:Carl, How is the weather in N.J?
panta98:Hi! Steve! Now we are nearly all there!
iiiiriiiis:Hello Steve!
plasticsmith: Hi all
frogmobile:Hi Steve
plasticsmith:Hi frog
ScnWrt:Khalid: Weather is great in NJ.
plasticsmith:Hi Iris
panta98:Firstly, please all try to save the Chat, in case, I'm thrown offline!
ScnWrt:Hi, Steve
ScnWrt:OK, Franz
frogmobile:Froggy is here "croaking" Steve...!
iiiiriiiis:Ok Franz!
panta98:Can we begin? We've a very long session.
plasticsmith:Who is froggy?
iiiiriiiis:Yes, please Franz!
panta98:Khalid, steve!
plasticsmith:carry on.
panta98:Folks, I'll synthesize our Chat-Topic today as follows: The Natural, Social
and Historic Basis and Relations of Emancipation (Part I).
ScnWrt:Proceed
frogmobile:Yes! its me Khalid
panta98:Now, please do not get scared of this seemingly scholarly title. We're
discussing this theme, of us, for us, and by us. We all can contribute according to
our understanding of the theme. In fact, we need two or three sessions, to discuss
this theme thoroughly. Today I'll just introduce the topic in a general way.
panta98:I'll introduce the flow of the exposition slowly, will await comments, will
reply, and, when we have finished, I'll continue with the explanations, until the end of
this part, then we can set in with the general discussion. Also, what follows is just
a humble contribution, not an "absolute" gospel truth.
panta98:Any comments, any questions, as yet?
frogmobile:proceed
iiiiriiiis:not as yet, Franz...
panta98:All in all, I need 15 to 20 minutes to illustrate everything for today. Please
it is not a profesoral lecture, it's a simple, friendly, typical Franz-Chat appetizer
and tantalizer.No tranquilizers are necessary.
ScnWrt:Continue
plasticsmith:I'm not frightened off
panta98:Yes, Steve, I know that you are"brave".
ScnWrt:Proceed
panta98:All is not yet new; what follows now, is yesteryear's New. Our Original
Cognac will come next time. It still needs some careful preparation, caring
"maturation".
panta98:Prost! Iris!
iiiiriiiis:agreed!
panta98:Khalid, A Polar Beer?
panta98:Our topic is a simple, straightforward matter. It formulates essential
questions, near and dear to us. For example, what really is Nature, Society, History
or Emancipation. We'll start with Physical Work, with Menial Labour.
iiiiriiiis:ok
frogmobile:Already had a Budweiser.
panta98:Steve, still brave? I know that our topic is very delicate, because it touches
sensitive issues. This logically pertains to the liberating transcendence of
emancipation.
ScnWrt:Had Matte.
panta98:Excellent, Carl!
plasticsmith:what is menial labor and who decides what is menial?
iiiiriiiis:manual labour...
panta98:Nevertheless, Safety First! However, nothing which I will expound is
personal, is intended to offend or hurt anybody's feelings. Please, bear this in mind
as we "march on", while the labour drama unfolds.
ScnWrt:Everyone does some manual labor.
panta98:Furthermore, what follows has no reference whatsoever to any specific
human being, alive or dead; it's all fictional. Any resemblance to, or reflection about
anybody, dead or alive, is purely unintentional and coincidential.
iiiiriiiis:FranzFranzFranz...!!! What is coming now???
panta98:Simple things, Iris!
plasticsmith: Stop being so careful Franz. ... we can take it.
frogmobile:Proceed
iiiiriiiis: this from me
ScnWrt:Franz, we are el Guapo (tough ones).
panta98:So, there we go, and, please, don't ask me: How did he know all that about
me? It's all part of the game. The sky is the limit. Enjoy the intellectual fun!
iiiiriiiis:We are doing so already!!
frogmobile:No strikes as yet, Franz
panta98:Across our lives, we heard about concepts like Labour, like Work, like a
Relation; we read about them, we even used them in speech or writing. What did
we really understand, what did we talk about? Did it ever occur to us to
ask such questions? If so, why? If not, why not?
panta98:Any comments?
plasticsmith:So .... what is manual labor and how can I do less of it?
panta98: Patience, Plasticsmith, it has to do with the Smiths, Steve Smith, Jutta
Schmidt!
ScnWrt:Manual labor is work which does not require much thinking.
panta98:Correction: Jutta Schmitt. ...
panta98:Did these topics, these terms, not interest us? Are they not fundamental
for everyday living? Are they not concrete enough, not practical enough? We were
so busy working, labouring.
panta98:We could not find time for such things. we leave them to students of
philosophy, to the ivory tower elites. Were we not copy-cats, copy-anti-communists? Copy-pro-democrats? How could we hate Hegel & Marx, when we did not even read or understand Capital or the Phenomenology?
plasticsmith:my name makes me a laborer. I am a smith in the purest sense.
panta98:Truly so, Carl. Later in the debate, we'll return to this issue.
ScnWrt:My name makes me a carpenter, the trade of Jesus and Joseph.
panta98:it comes from the days of medieval masonry, Steve.
ScnWrt:Zimmerman (German)=Carpenter (English)
panta98:Schmitt, Schmid, Schmidt, Mueller, Schneider (taylor), Koch(cook), all come from medieval physical labour.
frogmobile:Wow! Guys.
panta98:Even Zimmerman.
plasticsmith:I learned something of that last night
panta98:Iris, give some more German surnames!
frogmobile:What of Buehler and Ali?
iiiiriiiis:(I'm listening...please proceed. ...)
ScnWrt:Agreed. My mother's maiden name Melnickov=Miller in Ukrainian
iiiiriiiis:Metzger... (butcher)
panta98:Even Buehler, but that's another story.
frogmobile:And Lee, my mum's is Bacchus
panta98:For Ali, I've to study Arabic and Hindi.
plasticsmith:So we are all laborers...
iiiiriiiis: Yes, Buehler, the one who is coming from the hill... something like that, if  I recall correctly...
panta98 :Bacchus -- that's wine-brewing, physical labour.
panta98:I work on the leeward side of the mountain, of the ship of fortune.
ScnWrt:Ali=Allah? God also does physical labor.
panta98:Yes, Khalid, he worked with clay, producing the wonderful Adam. But, let's proceed.
plasticsmith:Is labor determined by whether or not we are paid for our efforts?
panta98:Yes, Steve. Why do we trust secondary literature? Political street-gossip and washer(wo)men small talk? Why not try to read and understand something about
"communism" all of, by and for ourselves? Will the Marx virus infect us, if we do
so?
panta98:After all, something in our cranium is still functioning, some brains are still
left. Too busy? Too lazy? No Time, too much work? Not necessary? Any other
lame excuse?
panta98:Any intermediate comments?
iiiiriiiis:proceed, please...
ScnWrt:Marx et al may be perceived as self-serving.
panta98:D'accord, Carl. Fine, Iris.
frogmobile:What is it and does it relate to the debate?
panta98:We did not study, not study philosophy as a major subject; we are no
intellectuals, no academicians, so why bother about thinking, about thought?
panta98:Why do we "think" like this? Is it natural? Is it social? Why are we just
working, working, labouring, labouring?
ScnWrt:In order to evolve, we need to continue to learn how to think.
panta98:Marx was the bourgeois democratic expert of the capitalist revolution,
explaining what labour is, how to understand it in the mid-19th century.
ScnWrt:Thinking is everything-natural, social, etc.
panta98:Brilliant, Carl. Who taught us, who told us to "think" like this? Did we ourselves come to this conclusion? The problem is now that suddenly "thinking", the "intellect" has entered "big business". Who does not have "intellectual labour power" to offer, and the "correct" one, is unemployed.
panta98:Khalid, you are the expert. Why this turn of events? Why Intellect, why
Intellectual Labour, why Intellectual Property, why Intellectual Property Rights?
panta98:So far the detective, detecting, inquisitive, inquisitory introduction. So far
the sensory warming-up of the motory nerves, of our nervous brain, of our thinking
motor, our "think-tank", now let's get down to "thought business".
ScnWrt:Intellectual labor is mind control. We want to think independently.
panta98:Carl, I totally agree with you.
plasticsmith:I also agree.
frogmobile:Intellectual Labor is geared to the production of a product.
ScnWrt:Who owns the Property Rights? Not the intellectual workers?
panta98:Now let us get down to something more near, dear and warm. Relation?
What's this? What's that? A love relation? An "I Love You" Relation? That's
dangerous! A Father-Son relation? A Virgen Mary of Fatima relation?
frogmobile:I mean in the Ecomonic sense...!
plasticsmith: Franz, "thinking motor", as lyrical as ever!
panta98:Thing relations, Money relations, the intercommunication with our
relatives, with our step-mother, with our mother-in-law?
ScnWrt: Khalid, not the intellectual workers?
frogmobile:No they do not, Carl.  It is the owners of the "means of intellectual production"
ScnWrt:The relations of the owners and means of production.
panta98:They "own" it, but it has only selling value, exchange value.  To own it as property, it must be bought, must be thrown on the market, Carl.
frogmobile:Correct, Franz.
panta98:Well, Steve, now we get to your query. For sure, the best relation which we
know, which we practise everyday as an adult, is our Labour relation, our Work
relation. When we work physically, when we labour manually, we relate in a certain way within our world system.
plasticsmith:when you buy it  ... is it consumed?
ScnWrt:When you buy it, you make the owner wealthier.
plasticsmith:rightly so?
panta98:Yes, Steve, and it is distributed, then consumed, then capital is realized,
and profits jump out of the magician's hat. Guys, you are brilliant. The best students I ever had!
panta98:How do we relate? We have a specific connection, a unique way of
"changing" our natural environment and our social habitat. And, why do we
work? For fun? Do we love to work? No, to earn money, a wage, a salary, to make
more money, to enjoy a better life. Excellent!!!
plasticsmith:but intellectual labor is never consumed.
iiiiriiiis: How do we "relate", Franz?
panta98:Yes, Steve it is consumed, consummated. Just now, I'll explain this. Iris, in this labour environment, we relate in a perverted fashion, the explanation will follow later.
iiiiriiiis:ok!
plasticsmith:please do
panta98:We work to fulfil our needs, our "human" needs, to survive, to have
leisure, pleasure, to eat, to drink, to build shelter, to breed, to reprocreate, to
marry, to build a family, a house;  one day, some day, to pay for a decent coffin, to
be buried in a beautiful cemetery, etc.
panta98:Do we work for ourselves, do we get a wage from ourselves? Certainly not,
well, then we work for a boss. He pays us. For what? For working so hard for him,
because we are so nice?  Certainly not.
ScnWrt:Does that really happen, Franz? I doubt it.
plasticsmith: working for the golden years
panta98:He's a business man. He buys and sells. what did he buy from me? What
did I sell to him? Did he offer me a just price? Did I have any say in the price?
panta98:Yes, Carl. Like that it "works". "Believe" it or not. Afterwards,
please ask me again.
panta98:Well, I am selling my physical labour power, and he offers the market
price, regulated by supply, demand and profit interests. It's an unequal exchange.
That's why I have a trade union, why I go on strike. Also, why the state sends the
police to defend the private property of the boss, and to chase me away with
tear-gas, with death, if necessary.
plasticsmith: Isn't this just a barter system with money as tokens of labor?
panta98: Steve, it used to be like that, meanwhile things "changed".
frogmobile:And this also introduces the topic of Alienation which means ‘making
something foreign’, and was used by Marx.
frogmobile: in the context of the labour process to refer to products of labour.
panta98: yes, Khalid. I have no other way to survive. Gone are the golden days,
the golden cave days. no more natural ants, locusts, plants and fruits to enjoy. Only Tomatoes filled with Ritalin and Vaccines!!! Nature is concrete, concrete walls, is cement. Even my thoughts are concrete, cemented. I love the concrete; I want to be concrete, a concrete monolithic block.
iiiiriiiis:What you are explaining is, if I'm not mistaken, a certain level of
"relation", Franz, a non-relation in the end?
ScnWrt:This is all mind control. Capital owns and manipulates the whole bloody
scene.
ScnWrt: Iris, it's a non-relation, causing alienation and misery.
panta98:Yes, Iris, this is the relation in our World System. Next time, I'll explain
emancipatory relations.
panta98:I must buy the things to satisfy my needs with money. Money is the nexus,
the relation of my survival. In exchange for money, which is my wage, which is the
price of my Physical Labour Power, I now satisfy all my daily needs.
iiiiriiiis:please proceed...
panta98:I buy a car, a handsome man, intelligence, beauty creams, love, ....
panta98:Now I know what is a relation, my main relation. I don't like this relation. I
prefer relations that are less arduous and strenuous; for example, relations with no
responsibilities, holiday relations, Catholic Mardi Gras relations, carnival
relations, madonna relations, religious relations, where Our Father never appears.
frogmobile:The market entails the alienation of all commodities since they are the
property of the employer and pass from hand to hand in the process of exchange.
plasticsmith:Do you even know what your daily needs are without someone telling
you?
frogmobile:The worker thus ‘makes a rod for her own back’
panta98:Now, please note: What I explained till now, for many is just obsolete
"bull-shit". It has nothing to do with contemporary reality. It's true. I've said
nothing new, as yet. It is pure Marxian Political Economy, as explained in Capital,
Volume I, 1859, at the time of the good old laissez-faire liberal capitalism.
panta98:Poor me! Capitalist World: Now, please, please, don't call me a Marx-ist, a
Social-ist, a Commun-ist, I am allergic to all "-isms". I am no "-ist", it's nothing
new, it's nothing original and authentic; it's not even real or true.
frogmobile:Also to add to the debate it should be noted, that as a by-product of this
labor process Alienation is also used in reference to mental or ideal products which
take on the appearance of objective, natural things.
panta98:Yes, Khalid, Alienation is the clue!
plasticsmith:I think it's just a natural flow of events. The more people make things
the more we need those things...funny I never knew I needed it until I saw it on TV.
panta98: True, Steve, propaganda creates artificial needs. - Even if capitalist ideologues do call us an "-ist", that's old, stinking, "Cold War" ideological "mind-control" brew. There exists no Pandemonism, no Pandemonists.
iiiiriiiis:true, Franz, agreed!!
panta98:This is very important. I want us to note this. I'm no Socialist, no
Communist!
ScnWrt:Ism=Tyranny
panta98:No Marxist, No Marxist-Leninist, no Trotskyist.
plasticsmith:Not me. I still carry the circle A on the front of my van!
iiiiriiiis:I think reading what you have been published till now, Franz, everybody will
notice that!
panta98: Let's proceed. .... talking about more "pleasant" things. ... From the 12th
century till the end of the Second Millennium, this was the natural, physical, menial,
quantitative, global, capitalist blood-sucking, generated from Lisboa, Madrid,
Amsterdam, Rome, Bruxelles, London, Berlin, Washington D.C., etc.
panta98:It was not an exclusive Illuminati, Fascist or Nazi hobby! The latter are
just the true, hidden, ugly "democratic" faces of the whole global system of economic
exploitation, of the international conspiracy of every single, individual capitalist,
of every business, company or multi-national enterprise.
panta98:Any comments? Agreements? Disagreements? Additions? Carl, please!
plasticsmith: except me!
panta98:Of course, Steve, you not. You are a "survivor" of all these atrocities.
plasticsmith:I am a strange mix of anarchist and capitalist
plasticsmith:I can live with the contradiction
panta98:yes, Steve, and with much more.
ScnWrt:I think there are managers in some global corporations who want to end
this exploitative system-They're capitalist-anarchists. So am I.
panta98:What I just explained is stale stuff, it's really old stuff, it should be left in
the cellar or the flea-market. But, let's advance to the current age or merging
multi-nationals, of the concentration of capital in the hands of a giga-global
company. The progressive pauperization of billions of physical workers on a
global scale.
plasticsmith:Who taught us to all want the same things?
frogmobile:Interesting comment, Carl.
panta98:Please return this question to me, later, Steve.
panta98:S.O.S. Oh, no. This is obsolete stuff again: Illuminati Prophecies of
Nostradamus, Marx (Capital) and Lenin (Imperialism, The Highest Stage of
Capitalism).
ScnWrt:They view all people worldwide as contributing demographics, not useless
eaters.
panta98:We really have a tough time to think new, anew, to find something original,
something really and truly innovative.
panta98:Well, that's what thinking is all about. Not a window-shopping spree. Not
lying on the beach in Mallorca. Not cutting wheat, not digging for gold, not working
in a Coca Cola factory yesteryear, in the days of Charlie Chaplin. It's Hard Work,
Hard Labour, Intellectual Labour. It's modern, it's cool, it's in!
plasticsmith:not so hard..that is what we are
panta98:Certainly, Steve.
panta98:Khalid, Carl & Steve, now we come to your remarks before.
panta98:Again, there we go. Labour, the Relation, Work, can be bought, can be
sold. In fact, this is what Labour is all about. It is something which you can buy,
which you can sell. It produces an abstract, an intellectual relation, an exchange
relation, money, capital, wealth, power.
frogmobile:What time is it there Iris?
panta98:It's the stuff, the relation, of which male and female prostitutes are made;
its economic prostitution on a global scale. We call it economic exploitation.
iiiiriiiis:(02.30am, Khalid)
frogmobile:wow!
panta98:In the same way as the physical body, human nature, can be exploited
economically by work, by labouring, the mind, the spiritual entity, the intellectual,
social existence can economically be exploited, be dominated, be controlled, be
canalized towards producing, reproducing profits, wealth and power.
ScnWrt:We need a system in which work is done that benefits all humanity
worldwide, such as the use of Tesla technology to provide free energy for all.
panta98:Wake Up! Iris! Khalid, Time is Money!
iiiiriiiis:I'm listening Franz...
ScnWrt:Franz, but time doesn't exist. It's motion.
plasticsmith:Ah..but who's time is who's money??!!
panta98: In this case, intellectual labour, abstract labour, is amplified to produce
more, higher forms of abstract money, capital, profits and power.
ScnWrt:Humankind must control it's motion.
frogmobile:Hegel actually describes the mode of labour characteristic of modern
commodity production. Indeed, he comes close to the Marxian doctrine of abstract
and universal labour.
frogmobile:Interesting, Carl.
panta98:Khalid, he even had a better explanation than Marx. He called Labour
simply Alienation.
frogmobile:Yes
plasticsmith:still things are better in the coal mines than they were at the turn of the
century.
panta98:Let me continue with the explanation. ...Now, please do not make the
mistake to think that abstract is nothing, is empty space, is non-existent; on the
contrary, Intellect, Abstraction is Existence, is Society.
ScnWrt:Agreed, Franz.
panta98:In our miserable education, we were taught to sense, to sense-perceive, a
prerequisite for physical labour. And even our sense-perception was
under-nourished, was deliberately limited to agricultural and concrete industrial
production. Our Acts, our Actions, are all underdeveloped, like all under-developed
countries.
ScnWrt:Abstraction is Nature.
panta98:Steve, please note, I'm explaining your question raised earlier.
panta98:Our brains were neglected, their time did not come as yet. Their
exploitation was not yet on the order of the day in previous millennia. Now, the hour
of qualitative mind-sucking has come.
plasticsmith: yes I see
panta98:Carl, for us, Cosmos, Nature, is concrete, more of this later. Now, let's pause here for today, and reflect about the aforesaid. Next, week, we'll continue to discuss the relation, Nature - Society, as it appears in the Fatherland, as Intellectual Labour.
frogmobile:A proper understanding of what is meant by “abstract” and “concrete”
is vital to making sense of dialectics.
panta98:Now, I'm prepared to answer any questions, and to read your reflections
and comments.
panta98:Yes, Khalid, please elaborate your point.
panta98:Carl, could you please repeat some of the questions which you raised
before?
panta98:Steve, please do likewise.
frogmobile:A concrete concept is the combination of many abstractions.
panta98:Iris, any Haribo-Sweets for me!
iiiiriiiis:Franz, I'm reading back ...  give me a moment...
frogmobile:I think I am in a different ball park ... just kidding, I am just throwing some "Vollies".
panta98:Yes Khalid, but the abstract is also the relations of many concrete things or appearances; the latter form the abstract, the intellectual reflections, the essence of Intellectual Labour,which can be bought and sold, which produces Giga-Profits.
ScnWrt:I think my previous questions were answered
panta98:Thanks, Carl. For nothing in the world, I would wish to miss your questions
and comments. They are too valuable, have giga-use-value.
panta98:And use-value is emancipatory value. Exchange Value produces
Exploitation, Domination, Discrimination and Zombism.
frogmobile:Obviously
frogmobile:I agree
plasticsmith:What comes first, the labor to produce "things" or the need for things?
Aren't we just aquisitive monkies, who need more and more to keep us from
becoming sane?
panta98: Steve, both of them "come first".  In fact, labour and need are the two sides of the same perverted non-relation which brought about the whole labour and capitalist system.
frogmobile:Capitalism and the market create your new needs every day Steve.
ScnWrt: Does the current stunted thinking allow the power elites to cause the
current deadly situation in Sierra Leone with impunity?
panta98:I think so, Carl.
plasticsmith:I'd rather live in a tree
frogmobile:Its all about the controllof the production of minerals in Sierra Leone.
panta98:One must be ossified, totally estranged, brutalized, in order to carry
through the heinous crimes in Sierra Leone.
plasticsmith: and diamonds.
frogmobile:yes
panta98:Yes, Steve, Diamonds are Forever!!!
frogmobile:The rebel leader is reported to have over $500 million in his bank
account.
ScnWrt:The TV news portrays the British armed forces as heroes in SierraLeone.
panta98:But, even this phase of agricultural and mining exploitation will fade away
in Africa.
plasticsmith: They are just rocks after all. ... Imagine, that if you were from another planet, watching them kill a country over rocks!
panta98:The days of Africa are counted.
frogmobile:He operates with impunity from Charles Taylor of Liberia.
panta98:Africa had sacrificed already 210 millions in slavery and brutal domination.
ScnWrt:Franz, the Africans are tough people. They can buy technology.
frogmobile:Sorry I meant to say with the help of Charles Taylor of Liberia
ScnWrt:Africa has some friends in the globals.
plasticsmith:As I said. Evolution began and will end in Africa.
panta98:The African Holocaust continues. The Pope did not even think of begging for pardon for the Spanish and Portuguese Catholic crimes committed against what they considered "animals".
ScnWrt:I think evolution will prevail in Africa.
plasticsmith: F...orget about  the Pope!
panta98: D'accord, Steve!!! Also, the Virgen of Fatima and all their holy spooks!!!
plasticsmith:That would cast a bit of doubt on the whole virgin thing...
panta98:Nobody asks for "reparation". It would cost capitalism an estimated $US
777 trillion to repair the damage caused.
panta98:That was the price to construct the world market, globalism of today.
ScnWrt:Prehistoric human skulls with African features were found in former Soviet
Georgia.
frogmobile:Guys I have to leave, I have to take my niece to her mum in about 5
minutes.
ScnWrt:Did Stalin have African ancestry?
panta98:Khalid, when the party is getting exciting, you get cold feet.
panta98:Please, guy, put on your tango shoes.
ScnWrt:The point I'm making is, that Africa isn't that simple.
panta98:I don't think so, Carl.
frogmobile:I have been baby sitting my niece. She's is 7 years old and is now crying.
panta98:The Africans were not military megalomaniacs, not in Ancient Egypt, not in
the African Empires, in Bakongo, Zimbabwe, Ngola, Mali ....
frogmobile: Good night Guys.
iiiiriiiis:Ok Khalid, see you next time!
frogmobile:Bye folks.
ScnWrt:Till next time, Khalid.
frogmobile has left the room.
panta98:Not even during European colonialism or even American neocolonialism;
they have never succeeded in building up an African military Empire, an African NATO. ...
panta98:No, they don't have Stalin features, rather a Christ complex.
ScnWrt:Franz, I'm sure that Stalin was influenced by Attilia and Ghengiz Khan, not
the Africans.
panta98:OK. Khalid, bye.
panta98:Will send you the Ms. after this chat. ....
plasticsmith:by frog
panta98:By Jove, Steve!
plasticsmith:by who?
plasticsmith: ah, I meant: bye, frog.
panta98:Agreed.
ScnWrt:The point I was making is, that the Africans migrated as far as Soviet
Georgia. They were tough people.
panta98:Probably also by Fu Manchu, by Dr. Mabuse. ...
ScnWrt:Also, Dr. Doom (Marvel Comics)
panta98:Well, they are the root-stock of humanity. ... Now, the thing is
degenerated, very weak, white, pale and skinny. ....
plasticsmith: If you go back far enough I think you'l see they migrated all over the
world.
ScnWrt:They will prevail.
ScnWrt:Agreed, Steve.
panta98:Yes, Steve. Probably the continents were even linked.
ScnWrt:Yes, indeed.
panta98:it all depends what is determined as Homo Sapiens.
panta98:Homo Neanderthal was not African, so they say, "He" was German,
Aryan.
ScnWrt:Linked can be an emancipatory term.
panta98:Well, as long as there is no "missing link".
ScnWrt:Missing link=mind control. We're all linked.
plasticsmith:we are the missing link between what was and what should never be.
panta98: Steve, I can see clearly now: you are the philosopher of the missing link!
iiiiriiiis:Carl and Steve, what has the introduction of Franz to do with Steve's
"case"-- I understand that it has been interlinked with this "topic", what do you
think? But how? Or has there been no interrelation whatsoever?
panta98: Iris, we will deal with this next time.
panta98: And the "missing link" between Homo Kenyapithecus and Homo Sapiens
is precisely Labour. This I'll also explain next time.
plasticsmith:Gotta go folks..it was a slice!
iiiiriiiis:ok
ScnWrt:Ok, Steve, till next time.
panta98: Me too. It was a great pleasure. I have the complete ms. I'll send it to all of
you. Not much to correct this time.
panta98: Well, Carl & Iris, it was fun. I "hope" you enjoyed it, while it lasted. My line is very unstable. Love, Iris!!!!
ScnWrt:Franz, regarding Lady of Fatima, all of my Catholic neighbors including
nuns and priests don't believe it. Call it hocus-pocus.
panta98:Excellent, conscious neighbours you have, Carl.
ScnWrt:Think it's a device of reactionaries in the Church.
panta98:Imagine the level of religious lies, today still. Does the Vatican have no limits?
iiiiriiiis:I enjoyed the chat, Franz - still enjoying!
ScnWrt:It's in all religions today. The Vatican is divided on this issue.
panta98:It is so criminal what they do, but as the Caribbeans say: Wotta man say!!!!
ScnWrt:Watch out for the cuda (baaicuda), mon.
panta98:Carl, tomorrow I have a lecture on Africa, must still do the finishing
touches. I am happy that, as always, you attended. Good-Night, Iris & Carl.

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