QUOTATIONS FROM CHAIRMAN LES

"A man who has done for American Theater
what Alfred Hitchcock did for...showers. "

An authority on things Marxist (just ask him), Les Marsden is a world renowned (well...some parts of the world anyway) actor, musician, producer, director and peanut vendor. In the course of his career he has appeared in many Marx Brothers Revivals and has become well acquainted with members of the Marx Family. I had the great pleasure of seeing him perform as Harpo in "Animal Crackers" at the Goodspeed Opera House in East Haddam, Connecticut and can say, without reservation, that he can really play the harp. (He also claims to be able to speak but I can't vouch for that).

LES LINKS
(In fact, if there were any less, there would be none at all)

A Day At Universal Studios.

MAX The MIRACLE BABY
Press Release
Story

PHOTOS

SHAMELESS HYPE

Although no longer a subscriber, Les has graciously given me permission to post excerpts from his posts to the Marx Brothers Mailing List for the general edification of mankind (or to get some other fool to write the book he hasn't got around to yet.) All such excerpts are © Les Marsden, 1998 and may not be copied without his permission. You may however scribble in the margins, color the pictures or, best of all, join the Marx Brothers Mailing List and be insulted by the best in the business (or me, if you have the chutzpah) in person.

A note on formatting: For those not familiar with Mailing Lists, most of these posts are the results of specific questions or comments by other list members. In many cases the responses are in several parts with the relevant portion of the question quoted prior to the response.

Query: The basis of my initial post began back in 1989 or so when I had the privilege of seeing your performance at the GeVa Theater in Rochester, NY. Then, several years passed, and I found myself getting married this August, so I began cleaning out years and years worth of accumulus, and lo, I found my "Revue" playbill which I have been doggedly searching for ever since I lost it, and I started the dragnet of looking for Mister Marsden.

First, thanks for your kind words about my performance in 'Groucho: A Life in Revue.' I've always had a soft spot in my head (if not heart) for Rochester, and specifically, GeVa Theatre. I returned a couple of years ago to play the lead (Max Prince) in the regional theatre premiere of Neil Simon's 'Laughter on the 23rd Floor.' Were you still around? Incidentally, you may not have realized it at the time, but when you saw 'Groucho', the harp solo was faked (because I was playing the title role) by a wonderful actor named Jonathan Brody in my old dual role of Harpo AND Chico. A beautiful prop harp was built to exacting veracity with rubber strings and a speaker inside, and yes, I played the harp solo you heard (on tape,) as Jonathan (with careful coaching and untold grueling hours of viewing a closeup of my hands playing the piece) accurately faked it onstage. So! You never knew that Groucho played the harp, didja? Did you ever post a reward for the successful capture of Les Marsden? Technically, if there was one, I'd like to collect.

Query continued: That being said, I am very glad to have the opportunity to hound you for details about "A Night At Harpo's" --- As I understand things, this is a performance piece developed by you with the support/encouragement of Mrs. Marx and their children. As a genuine devotee of Harpo's, I'd love to know how a modestly employed (i.e., not yet independently wealthy) Rochesterian might see this performed. Is it on video/audio or in print anywhere? Also... what was Mrs. Marx's reaction when you approached her? Does she get tired of the focus on her husband, or is she pleased that he is so widely beloved?

This may be an obvious question, but what was the inspiration for the work? Seems as though (at least judging by the title) the piece singled out one of Them, no? Do I detect an affinity, or merely an opportunity? (...Not to worry, I am in the process of finding my Freedonia Gazette mailer form so that I can add #9 to my collection... and maybe then I'll be able to lay off the questions for awhile. If you'd like, you can bombard me with inane questions, and for enough coffee, I'll be glad to oblige.)

As if this e-mail hasn't already become strikingly interminable, I'll try to put the story of 'A Night at Harpo's' into some sort of palatable form:

You have absolutely no business knowing my age, and I won't tell you. In 1978 when I was a 21-year-old graduating senior (theatre) at California State University, Fresno (stop sniggering...it's got a great theatre program) I decided that Harpo's true-life story was too good not to share. I mean, as all we Marxists know, he had a pretty amazing life and one which is completely unknown to the general public. The most common questions I was (formerly) asked were: 'He really was a deaf-mute, wasn't he?' and 'They weren't really brothers, were they?' (A digression {one of many} but once when I played the show in a theatre in Monterey, CA, I had large posters with me as Harpo out front. A couple of old ladies walked by and one commented to the other, 'Harpo Marx? I thought he was dead...' and then they continued on their way. Well, dammit, you old bags, does that mean that if he WAS alive {a state THEY barely resembled} and playing this theatre right in front out you, you wouldn't consider buying tickets to go in and see him?!?!?!?!) I was upset because since Groucho's death, it seemed that the Boys had begun to suffer a decline in popularity. I had been fortunate to be invited to Groucho's house and spend some amazing time with him in 1976 almost exactly a year before he died (I had already begun playing the brothers in high school and had achieved a certain level of notoriety as well as press coverage) and Groucho gave me his imprimatur. After I carefully wiped it clean and packed it in a zip-loc bag, (and flash-forwarded back to 1978. Boy, what a stream-of-consciousness rambling writer I've become...) I decided that a one-man show on Harpo in and out of character would be just the thing. However, I didn't wish to do it without the permission and full interaction of Harpo's family. I managed to locate Susan's phone number and gave her a call. I explained what I wished to do, and she immediately told this young whippersnapper that nothing like that had ever been allowed, it never would be, and that was that, good-bye. I then wrote her a long letter and told her exactly what I wished to do, that I wouldn't do it without her help, and asked her not to say 'no' until we at least had the chance to meet face-to-face. Several months went by, and because I didn't want to hound her, I had pretty much nearly given up on a Harpo project. (I had already contacted Eleanor Keaton, widow of Buster, whose work I ALSO worship with the idea of a show on HIM...) One day, a letter arrived from Susan, still saying 'NO,' but inviting me down to Rancho Mirage to visit her. We set up a date and after the five-hour drive from my home to hers (and a rollicking series of Mr-Toad-like adventures,) I finally wound up on her 110-degree July-scorched wilting front steps, clutching a rapidly-withering bouquet. I was also an hour late due to an insane woman hit-and-running into my parked car at a gas station in Encino. I rang the bell, expecting this cranky old broad who had been so curt on the phone and in her letter, and was delighted when a sweet 70-year-old white-haired little angel answered the door. 'You must be Les! Come in! Would you like some lemonade? I was just going to make some....it's some much better with limes, don't you think?' 'Well, really...please don't go to any trouble for me...' 'Oh, it's no trouble...I was gonna make some anyway. I'm going next door to the neighbor's for some limes; just make yourself at home and have a look around the house...' After my initial shock, and wide-eyed amazement at finding myself in Valhalla, I browsed the items you've all come to recognize from pictures in 'Harpo Speaks!' such as the John Decker oils of Harpo as the 'Laughing Cavalier' and the Marx Brothers Rembrandt, as well as Harpo's own self-portraits, the Dali, and TONS more I never knew existed! I'm sure you can all imagine exactly how I felt, suddenly plunked in this Harpo paradise. (Much as I had felt when the front door of Groucho's house had first shut behind me and I had come face-to-face with that ancient God himself, but that's another story...) Anyway, Susan returned, and the first thing out of her mouth was, 'well, you can do anything you want with the show; I feel I can trust you...' Well, THAT was over!!!! Our first visit that day lasted about six hours, (I taped several hours of her reminiscences and answers to tons of my questions.) She insisted that I meet with all the kids. I eventually did: Alex in Valleys, Minnie in Orange, Jim in San Luis Obispo, and most important, Master William Woollcott Marx in Pacific Palisades, a pal who has remained close through these past 20 years as has his sprightly (and now proudly 90-year-old) mother. Anyway, after months of research, many begun-and-then-torn-up initial drafts, and an impending deadline (I had performances slated for December, 1978 at CSUF) one night in October I suddenly awoke with the whole damn thing laid out in my mind. I got up and began typing and within a couple of days, I had the script which has basically remained with only minor changes to this day. It's a two-act, two-hour show which begins with the 'Monkey-Doodle-Doo' blaring from house speakers as a black and white film of me as Harpo, shot beautifully in period style in a 20's house plays on a huge screen. I chase a couple of girls, eventually they duck into an alcove and the onscreen Harpo runs offscreen as I run onstage from behind the screen in a fluid move. The girls taunt me from the movie, I eventually get an idea and run back onscreen, ending up by gookieing them, and stripping off their dresses. I then triumphantly walk offscreen, matched by me walking onstage from the film, snap my fingers, and the film disappears. Without missing a beat, I spot a woman in the front row of the audience (preferably with a bald man nearby) and leap into the audience, covering the woman with kisses as my right hand (through sleight-of-hand) pulls her bra off. The bald man comes in handy as a dome to polish with the bra, and then I return to the stage. My voice is heard in voiceover, saying 'That's not me. That's not the real Harpo Marx. If you want to see who I really am, just wait until I sit down at the harp...' A light comes up on the harp, I walk over and admire it, sit down, try to play, eventually discovering a problem and unscrewing my left hand (you've seen THAT bit before...) I leave the harp and the mood is shifted by a series of slides of New York in the late 1880's/early 90's onscreen accompanied by a tape of Chico playing 'Gypsy Love Song' in a melancholy manner. I slowly take off the overcoat, shirt, tie and replace them with a little white shirt and cardigan. The final slide (a ladder-stack pose of the five brothers) remains on the screen, the music fades to silence as I walk downstage center, isolated in a key spot on an otherwise dark and silent stage. I open my mouth to speak, but can't. I try again, and then realize why: I slowly remove the wig, fold it and place it in my pocket - and only then, after becoming Adolph Marx can I SPEAK, and the play begins. And I speak in his VOICE: I have heard it and actually possess tapes of Harpo speaking (as well as a great many other items too amazing to mention. People through the years who know of my work have given me items such as this; the show has been seen by a great many friends/relatives and writers of the boys; all have been extraordinarily generous with their input and physical assistance.) It's basically a chronologic retelling of his career and life, with me continually shifting from Adolph to Harpo...I might be in the middle of a story when a tape of my voice seamlessly picks up in mid sentence, I quickly change into the Harpo costume and act out or against what my voiceover is saying. There are four films of me as Harpo, a lengthy clip from 'Monkey Business,' nearly one hundred slides from Harpo's own photo album and other sources, many of them never seen by the public outside the show; I play a piano solo version of 'Love Me and the World is Mine' in Harpo's PIANO style, two robust harp solos from me (I have an extensive background as a musically-precocious brat and am classically trained on nearly all instruments; credentialed to teach the piano at 11, wrote my first symphony at 13, and taught myself the harp by borrowing the instrument from college;) I've now played the harp for nearly 25 years and actually own the Lyon & Healy instrument (a beautiful model #17 made in 1921) upon which Harpo studied with Mildred Dilling in the 1920's during the Cocoanuts and Animal Crackers Broadway runs...Susan has stated that when I play the harp, I'm indistinguishable from Harpo himself; she lies. In Act II, there is the addition of (taped) voice-overs from an actress portraying the voice of Susan; while there is a level of oblique interaction, her references to him are in the past tense and the actress whose voice is used is Ann Nelson, who may be familiar as the sweet little old lady in the movie 'Airplane' who hangs herself after hearing Robert Hayes' boring story (as I'm sure some of you are ready to do the same...) The show moves through Harpo's entire life and concludes just before his death, but with his own uplifting message 'you're only young forever,' and restoration of the man to his death-less character.

Whew! (I said this was the short version?) I performed the show for many years directly from college throughout the professional theatre world in this country and abroad. I deliberately retired the show in 1985 and have only had two special productions since: for Burt Reynold's (now-defunct) theatre in Jupiter, Florida and for Lucille Lortel (Queen of off-Broadway)'s theatre on the grounds of her Westport, CT estate. I've known the now-in-her-nineties Lucille for many years (in fact since the '86-87 off-Broadway run of 'Groucho: A Life...' at her theatre IN Manhattan; she truly IS Margaret Dumont, albeit a little older than Maggie ever achieved.) 'Harpo's' remains unpublished out of deference to Susan's wishes; she prefers that this material be made public only through my performances of the show. Likewise, there are no videos available due to the strict rules of Actors' Equity forbidding such tapings. I really have no future plans to perform the show, but I'm not averse to doing so; if you can convince any professional Equity theatre, I'd be willing to consider digging the mothballs out for a production...

And to address your final area of questioning ('about time, too, you long-winded son-of-a---') Susan's feelings have moderated over the years. She used to wonder why anybody would have any interest in this long-dead comedy team, and especially about her. I've often given her reams of reasons, and she finally seems to have achieved the distance to see the light. She's now more accepting of the cult-like status they've fostered (I would not, however, encourage anyone to try to contact her...the years are catching up at last) and understands why people feel the way they do. After all, remember this: Harpo and Susan REALLY first met not in 1932 in Hollywood but on the street in Manhattan in 1928 when he was a big star and she was a Ziegfeld girl. In spite of that, she told me that she didn't even know who the Marxes were and that he didn't impress her at all; she found him to be quite goofy ('I was too busy being Susan Fleming: Showgirl of New York.') So she never saw them from the outside as we do; she always knew him as the man first, and I don't feel she ever really understood the effect their style had on true believers. She adored him and thought he was adorable; on the other hand, she was one of the few people who consistently had the balls to tell Groucho, 'Grouch--that's not funny...why don't you just shut up?' And Groucho took it from her and really respected her for it. (Years after Harpo died and Groucho had divorced Eden, he asked Susan to marry him. She refused, but I've always felt that she was exactly the woman who would have attacked all Grouch's neuroses and ultimately could have made him a happy man. He unfortunately never could have had the self-knowledge as a younger man to seek out a strong, independent woman, which is what he needed (another digression.)

Query: One of my kids asked me if Harpo played the same harp in all his movies. How many harps did Harpo have? ( It's not only a question, but a tongue twister.)

Harpo rarely played the same harp twice in a movie, and in some moviesdidn't play a harp at all (Go West harp is actually a loom, At the Races is the dismantled frame of a grand piano, and Duck Soup....well, we all know about that one.) They were usually his own harps but he changed models a lot, particularly in the early years. Eventually, he owned two Lyon & Healy Gold-Gilt Concert Grands, model #24. He had those two harps for years and shortly after his death, Susan was asked to judge a harp competition in Israel. She insisted that Bill come along as well because she knew nothing about the mechanics of harpistry. They both decided to take the two harps along and donate them to two university harp departments in Israel, with the only proviso being that they were not to go in glass cases, but instead were to be used. Upon arrival in Israel, the customs agents demanded a 100% duty payment from Susan and she said 'what? I'm trying to donate these harps to you!' and was ready (as she told me) to get back on the plane and take the damn harps back home when a governmental official broke through and announced that they'd be happy to take the harps for free! I've heard from other sources that the harps were marked as Harpo's with small plaques but that they indeed were (and hopefully still are) used as Susan intended.

Harps don't last forever---they're not like fine violins which improve with age. The very design of a harp places great stress on them from the time they're assembled and they need to be rebuilt every few years as the sounding board, neck and column begin to twist and pull apart. I hope that answers your questions! Now please put Daddy back on line.

Query: It has been said that Harpo also had a small "practice" harp which he carried about with him to practice on any available occasions. Any idea where he might have got it? what was it like? what happened to it? I'm interested in Harpo's harps, since I (try to) play the harp myself. (I play a Celtic harp, not the pedal harp) What I lack in natural ability, I tend to make up for in enthusiasm. I have also stolen his name.

The practice harp was homemade (though by whom, I'm not sure. Bill now has it; I've plucked it myself. It was made to keep his fingers in shape for, as you may know, a harp isn't always the easiest instrument to drag around. The practice instrument is only a couple of feet long and is esentially some strings strung between a couple of boards, as I recall, though refined to look nicer than I've described.

Query: Miss Binkie/Les, I was wondering if you had ever brought your Marx Brothers tribute shows into the South (That's Dixie, Ya'll)? If you did, how did they fare?

And now a related question for anyone to answer...
Did the Marx Brothers ever perform at venues in the South? I kinda doubt it because of the fear of an anti-semitic reaction by the fanatics in the local populace. However they may have been able to appear in larger cities such as New Orleans, Memphis or Atlanta with less worries.

Well, let's see...I've done 'Animal Crackers' at the Alliance Theatre in Atlanta...the show went over well, as I recall. But then, Atlanta has become so cosmopolitan that it hardly qualifies as the South...

'Groucho: A Life...' and 'A Night at Harpo's' both at Burt Reynolds' Jupiter (Florida) Theatre...same thing. The population is more representative of New Jersey emigres than any sort of native strata...

'Groucho: A Life...' at Theatre Three in Dallas, Texas...you know, the thing that I'm beginning to see here is that theatre goers are the same everywhere...if they go to the theatre on a regular basis, they're (usually) at least semi-hip and I have yet to see any sort of ugly overt anti-Semitism raise its head anywhere.

As to your second question, may I say one word....Nacogdoches? The Boys played the Southern vaudeville circuits in their earlier years and while they encountered elements of anti-Semitism, they dealt with them in a less-than serious manner and (I guess because they didn't grow up with any SERIOUSLY SCARY anti-Semitic prejudices levelled against them on a constant basis) found such attitudes amusing...USUALLY. I suppose they (and we) were lucky they didn't end up REALLY incurring the wrath of any real old-fashioned Klansmen...

Query: Were you involved in the "Animal Crackers" revival that played the Goodspeed Opera House in Haddam, CT a few years back? (I was the guy in the audience they didn't through the peanuts at).

Yes, that was me at Goodspeed. I was Harpo. And if I'd have known you were in the house, we would have made it Brazil nuts and lug nuts.

Query (con't) Not necessary...there were more than enough nuts in that audience already. Maybe you can answer a question for me. In the performance I saw there was a guy in the balcony box that Groucho swapped adlibs with all through the show. Was that genuine or was he a ringer? Some of the funniest bits were in that business...if it wasn't deliberate it should have been. I only ask since, as we all know, Groucho was never one to deviate from a prepared script. ;)

The answer to your question is yes and no: the guy wasn't planted, but the situation is prepared for and actually developed...at times we'll hector or goad particular audience members into unwittingly participating (usually based on their appearance or our observation that they're enjoying the show) and as soon as they step into the trap, we bombard them with seemingly ad-libbed lines, etc. I actually enjoy the opportunity for REAL ad-libbed interaction of the sort which simply cannot be prepared for and have some sort of small talent for such situations.

Query: You say you're a convincing Harpo, eh? Can you play the clarinet?

Of course! As anyone who's seen me in 'Animal Crackers' can attest. I have a particularly haunting chalumeau register, baby! The man who hand-fabricated Harpo's soap-bubble-playing bell for his clarinet and I have spent many a jolly hour discussing his customizing work for Harpo.

And yes, I even picked up the tenor sax in about an hour's worth of practice so that Max Prince's (scripted) offstage solo at the end of 'Laughter on the 23rd Floor' could be performed in full audience view instead of only being heard on a tape...

Query: I'm still wondering where to find the following Groucho quote: "Outside of a book, dog is man's best friend. Inside of a dog it's too dark to read." I haven't been able to find the source for that.

...that's one of those great mystery quotes. Nobody has been able to conclusively attribute it to Groucho. Of course, it can be found on a couple of t-shirts I've been sent (Brookline (MA) Booksmith and another bookstore in Santa Cruz.) Another great mystery quote is:
'That's the most ridiculous thing I ever heard'
It's presumed to have happened on You Bet Your Life but none of the extant kinescopes contain it.

Query: I've read a hundred times (Holy hyperbole Batman!...secret woid-no?) that Frenchy Marx can be seen in Monkey Business both on shore and waving from the ship. I've been scouring my videotape (recorded off an American Movie Classics Marx Bros. marathon) and can only find Frenchy siiting on the dock wearing a snappy white hat , sitting between two ladies, waving. Where is he on the ship?

To the best of my memory, I believe that Frenchie's onboard shots were cut from the final release print, so all you can see is the shot of him sitting on the trunk on the dock, waving his hankie between two women.

One of the scenes that I've always been dying to know about is the one in which (during the onboard chase sequence) Harpo appears dressed as a nurse with Billy Barty. There are production shots of the scene, but it, also was cut before the general release. Many years ago I met Billy Barty, and finally thought I'd get to the bottom of it. I asked what happened in the scene and he told me that it was a big deal for him as a kid (believe it or not, he was about 20 years old at the time - most biographical sources list his birth year at circa 1910) because he was a big Marx Brothers fan, as were all his friends back home (wherever THAT was.) He told all his friends that he was in the new Marx Brothers picture and everybody was excited. When the movie came out Barty went to see it and was disappointed to see that he'd been excised. His friends wouldn't believe that he had actually been in a Marx Brothers movie and wouldn't speak to him. I then asked him, 'okay, but now for the really big question that I've wanted an answer to for a long time: what happened IN the scene?' He said, 'that was sixty years ago! Damned if I can remember!'

And try as he did, he couldn't.

Query: I asked this question before, but maybe some of the newer Listers with a research bent know:
Besides "Henry", what were the middle names of the remaining Marx Brothers? (Speculation is that Harpo's full name was Adolph Arthur Marx, but this is not confirmed).

Julius was the only one to officially receive a middle name, as you've noted. Adolph was given only this single name; he changed it himself during the first World War to get rid of the Germanic connotation, becoming Arthur. And that's it. At some rare times Zeppo gave his real name as Herbert Manfred Marx, but aside from seeming to be some sort of tribute to his long-dead brother I would think it was more of an inside joke.

Query: I'm not a soap opera watcher, so I am at a disadvantage when someone recently told me that "Gummo's grandson Gregg was on Days of Our Lives back in the early 80s!" So, dumbly enough, I looked up some of the old credits via "Daytime TV" magazine, and sure, there was a Gregg Marx. But this wasn't one of Their descendents, right?

Was DOOL's Gregg Marx a grandchild of the great Gummo?

Yup, he was, and still is. Nice guy, especially 'cause he came to see 'Groucho: A Life In Revue' in New York.

Query: (Edited to remove personal references) This weekend I read most of the "Cherchez la Fleming" chapter of "Harpo Speaks" to give a little inspiration. Ah, to be as good a wife as Susan Fleming Marx! Then I reflected on their family, and the happiness that appeared to surround them all. The only glimpse of their children I have had really came from interviews I have seen with Bill --- and, of course, his touching tribute to his father at the end of the book. So, How would you describe Bill's personality? "Witty", "friendly", "serious", "reserved", "pleasant", "jovial", etc. For that matter the same question regarding Bill's siblings?

There's not enough time, but I'll try: Bill is one of the sweetest, most laid-back, generous, genuinely caring, talented, greatest people I've ever known. While adopted, his personality seems to have been endowed upon him by his father, and Susan feels the same way. She tries to be equitable with the four kids, but I do see a slight edge given to Bill. In a nutshell, Alex (in my experience) is quiet, a loving family man...my favorite memory of him is when he first saw my Harpo show and came backstage, unable to say a word. He just hugged me and had tears in his eyes. He's a big bear of a guy, and he couldn't speak a word until I went to his house the next day. Irregardless of my show, he's the quiet type. Jim is at best, elusive...I've had the least contact with him. He strikes me as shy, and perhaps slightly uncomfortable with the position he holds as son of Harpo. Minnie is outgoing, warm, a loving mother and grandmother. She's much more youthful than her years and prematurely gray hair would warrant. I hope that gives you some idea.

Query: This question has probably been addressed here before, but if so, I don't remember...Apart from his personality, what has Bill been doing all these years? Has he been working as a musician/composer, or did he end up having to go into some other line of work (which would be a shame)?

For that matter, now I think of it...did Alex ever come to own a business called Lou's Garage? Did Minnie marry a man who raises horses? Is Jimmy able to say to anyone who asks, "Yes, as a matter of fact, I *AM* a rocket scientist?" Call me...curious.

Dear Curious:

Just got off the phone with Bill, because I wanted to absolutely verify the current (as of today) activities of the Marx Brothers and Sister:

1. Minnie: nothing new. She DIDN'T marry a man who raises horses; she loved animals as a kid and wanted to be a veterinarian when she grew up. Her husband, Jim Eagle, was the well-to-do son of the owner of some successful business, as I recall...she's enjoying motherhood and grandmotherhood.

2. Alex recently retired from his career as a submarine mechanic with the military. He and his wife Carol and two stepdaughters still live in Vallejo. She's really cool and perfect for him; they've been together about 20 years as I recall. He never owned a place called Lou's Garage...

3. Jim. Many years ago, he owned a pottery shop and separate studio in San Luis Obispo. The shop was called 'Mudslingers,' and I still have a plaque with a Groucho quote ('Military Intelligence is a contradiction in terms) which he gave to me MANY years ago. He lost the store in a divorce about 1980 or so and is now happily remarried (different wife) and works at the San Onofre Nuclear Plant in security. And no, you smirking wisenheimer, he's never WORKED as a rocket scientist...I'll make no judgments about the implication of your comment...

Bill: He was playing just a couple of nights a week in the Palm Springs area (he moved there a few years ago from Pacific Palisades) because that's all he WANTED to play; he's now stopped playing altogether (at least in public.) He's currently writing a musical review which takes as its subject matter Palm Springs; he's also revising the two-hander touring act he played a few years ago with harpist Carrol McLaughlin as a SOLO act. Since 1995, happily married to Barbara. He checks in on Susan constantly, who, by the way, still drives herself and is quite the independent little nonagenarian.

Query: We all know that the first inspiration for Adolph Arthur Marx as a musician was his Grandmother, Fannie Shoenberg, who was a harpist. Grandpa Shoenberg kept the Harp as a memorial after Grandma Shoenberg died, Harpo recalled that he was fascinated by it as a kid. Does anyone happen to know of any discriptions of the harp, what it was like, and what happened to it?

The harp was described as having no strings, and it was the mystery of how a harp sounded which compelled Harpo in his later interest. Of the harp itself, I would doubt that it was a concert grand. More likely it was a folk or troubador-type model, as, according to Harpo's reminiscences, the Schoenbergs travelled in Germany as itinerant entertainers. Lafe would perform magic tricks (foreshadowing Harpo's fascination with prop sleight-of-hand?) and Fanny played the harp 'while people danced.' A pedal harp probably would have been financially out of reach of the couple, and would have been difficult to transport. As to its eventual disposition, no one knows. No one has ever left written remembrances of the instrument other than Harpo's, which give no details. I'll call Maxine and see if she knows anything. Of the Brothers' kids, Maxine, as eldest knew Minnie the best (she was 11 when her grandmother died) and also actually lived with Minnie and Sam for extended periods of time. She does a great imitation of Minnie, by the way. I would almost guess that by the time of their move from 179 93rd Street, the harp might have been sold to a junkstore.

From Les: (I hate to start recycling, but this was my response to an off-list e-mail from a lister who had seen me in performance and wanted to know a little about my learning to play the harp and so on. Not wanting to identify the interrogator or post the original query was, I thought, the right thing to do in light of the fact that they arrived to me off-list. I thought my response, however, might be of some small interest):

I've played the harp for almost 25 years and taught myself, for the most part. It's a damnably difficult instrument (there are 44 - 46 strings, depending on the model, as well as 7 foot-pedals which are out of sight of the player.) Each pedal controls ALL the strings of that particular note: i.e. all C's, or all A's, etc for each of the seven notes of the natural C scale. Each pedal has three positions: sharp, flat or natural. As the harp sits there in its natural position, it's in the key of C. If you wish to play an F#, for example, you lower the F pedal one notch; this sharpens ALL the F strings. You can return the pedal to the central position and the F's are now all natural, or you can lift the pedal up a notch and now all F's become F-flats. Ridiculous, eh? You're right. You can't see what position the pedals are in at any time, pedalling must happen at exactly the right moment or you're done for, and of course you are limited by the possible arrangements dictated by the pedals. Harpo was a brilliant talent for being able to teach himself how it worked and then to realize the full potential of the instrument. There's no truth to the stories of him playing the harp over the wrong shoulder after seeing a picture of an angel in a dime-store window; it's really not physically possible to play it that way. The only difference is in the tone he produced and the way he used his hands: most harpists have really calloused fingers and can produce a very sharp tone; Harpo's tone was wonderfully gentle and light. Most harpists close the hand after plucking a chord; Harpo didn't. Bill claims that Harpo's fingers weren't calloused but I find it impossible for him to have practiced even fifteen minutes a day (he claimed he played for hours) without ending up with harpist's fingers. Whenever I get into practice, within a few days' time my fingers have become quite calloused but I can still produce that gentle 'Harpo' tone. What was your question? I've observed and listened to his playing over and over to try to produce as close as possible the sound and style of Harpo; I arranged 'Why Am I So Romantic' as you heard it at the Huntington. As a sidebar, in that production I had a (good-natured) fight with choreographer Baayork Lee; she insisted upon the silly Professor's Dream > ballet interlude in the middle of the harp solo and director Larry Carpenter tried to placate us both. We did the same production in Atlanta at the Alliance Theatre. A few years ago when the show was once again revived at the Goodspeed Opera House (East Haddam, CT) and the Papermill Playhouse (Millburn, NJ) and once again 'Broadway-Bound' (-and gagged) director Charlie Repole wisely allowed me to get rid of the damn ballet and consequently that moment became strictly an accurate harp-solo with orchestral accompaniment. This allowed for me to make a longer solo arrangement for greater and more truthful homage to Harpo's original moment. Which comes full circle to your question: I believe that if you're going to have the balls to recreate Harpo, Groucho or Chico, you have absolutely no right to do so professionally UNLESS you can resemble them physically and vocally PRECISELY, and do justice to their talents in toto; thus, as Chico I shoot the keys and have arranged (among other solos) 'The Woodpecker Song' from Go West exactly as he played it (okay...maybe I take it even quicker...) to the point where Maxine refers to me as 'Daddy' (even though she's twice my age, dammit...) I've already bored you with my harpism stories, but Groucho, too must be able to sing and dance EXACTLY as Groucho did.

What I've most wanted to do is to allow people such as we who were denied the opportunity of seeing them perform live to at least suspend disbelief briefly and imagine what it must have been like to see them on the stage. When I (formerly) played the dual Harpo AND Chico role in 'Groucho: A Life in Revue,' critics (and audience members) swore there had to be TWO people playing the roles, likewise some people still think I faked the piano and harp solos!! Some nights, I'd deliberately throw in a clinker or two if I suspected a doubter in the crowd!

Query: Over the years, I've seen quite a few "impersonations" of the brothers...some better than others. From seeing these, plus my own weak attempts (Halloween and such) it seems to me that Harpo is the toughest to reproduce.(I've never seen a good "Harpo" yet...of course, I've never had the pleasure of seeing your "Harpo", Les.) So which brother gave you the most trouble? Also (I could be using up my quota of questions here.) I wouldn't mind hearing if there are any other things you had to do for each one. Or are these "trade secrets"? You could make my Halloween easier this year!

Now that IS a question. Errrr questions. This one actually requires me to think, so pardon me while I pour myself a fresh cuppa joe...

I'm back now. This will unfortunately take a trip through the land of actory-crap, so bear with me. It'll also require a meandering, disorganized stream-of-consciousness, but here goes:

I'll skip over the obvious stuff like getting the costumes, wigs, makeup and all that stuff exactly right. Believe it or not, it is a large part of the internal workings. Many actors work from the inside out...that is, they'll create the way a character's mind works as well as his personality and gradually end up with all that stuff informing their choices of the externals like what he'd wear and how he'd walk. Others work from the outside IN (Olivier certainly did) and I'm inclined to work more that way as well....and certainly in the case of impersonating known personalities you MUST work this way...more on this below. But if you get the Harpo wig and coat just so, and the Chico coat cut exactly right, you'll notice that when you put them on and look in the mirror, they'll spark your brain to make your body move in ways that your memory recalls the characters did while wearing those costumes. The more accurate, the better...

A lot also depends on WHEN. When are you playing Harpo? It's only two years' difference in time, but it's a world of difference to play the Duck Soup Harpo and the ANATO Harpo.

Dimension. Most people paint on the moustache, part their hair (if any) in the middle, say, 'that's the most ridiculous thing I eveh hoid!' and think they're Groucho. To play the brothers (and indeed any role) requires an ability to capture multiple dimensions, to observe physicality that the brothers all had in different ways, to be able to train your voice to match pitch, timbre, inflection, dialect, timing. There's more, but let's start with dimension.

When I play Chico, for example, (and here's a trade secret:) I'm actually playing Lennie PLAYING Chico: you can't help but notice his upper-East side accent come through the (bad) Italian. Maxine loved to hang around a shoot or radio show just to say, 'psssst: Daddy -- your accent's showing!' And that's an important part of Chico. But there are many important little things to notice about him. For example, his wrists. Ever notice that his wrists, even at repose, flare his hands out away from his body? His sleeves are always too short? He drinks and deals cards with a pinkie out? His shoulders are never tense, but are always relaxed? He leads his body with his nose? That's usually the sign of someone who is an overt sexual prowler. (Most people do so with their chin or forehead.) His upper lip is thick all the way to the corners of his mouth. That can be accomplished with make-up. All the brothers were great characters, but beneath the characters were these four men who had had many life experiences which, for good or bad, showed themselves through their disguises. I think it's crucial to know as much about the real men's lives, likes, dislikes, relationships as possible because that stuff always colors who we are, even when we're doing something as simple as telling a joke onstage. A truly great actor is able to take all this research, process it and then discard it. What sticks is the internal memory of salient details. Any time your own personality or idiosyncracies poke through, even for a moment, you've failed.

It's interesting, but the more dimension you can feel, the more real the portrayal becomes. A lot depends, also, upon what the audience is bringing to it. For example, I've had Maxine and Kitty (Carlisle) Hart see me at the same performance (as Chico.) They came backstage independent of each other; Kitty complimented me for perfectly capturing Chico's stupidity; Maxine said that nobody has ever been able to capture his wisdom in the way I did. Go figure. I guess the best affirmation of being on the right track is the approval of family members. Maxine cries when I do Harpo, particularly during my harp playing (she adored him) and swears that I capture his naive sweetness, inventive venom and physicality as no one but HE could; however, she's always disappointed if I'm not playing 'Daddy.' Sorry! Can't play 'em all at the same time! I've already related what Groucho's kids have said about my performances as their dad. They're the most extraordinarily tough critics and if you can pull all the parts together to please them, you've accomplished something. What this all goes to say is that you DON'T just throw on the costumes and walk funny; you sweat every single detail and when you think you've finished, you dig deeper.

I've discussed elsewhere the importance (at least in my own mind) of doing everything they did...including musical abilities...if you're going to truly do them justice so I won't go into that here, but just reemphasize the point by its inclusion. I realize that's a near-impossible accomplishment in the case of any one of them and that I'm personally a freak of nature for being able to recreate the musical talents of them all...but it was a quirk of early interests and 35 years' worth of practice in my case.

These days, it's much different for me than in the earlier years. Now, for me, it IS simply a matter of throwing the costumes, etc, on and a sort of magic takes over...the boys come out to play. I guess that's the level to shoot for: everything becomes absolutely second nature and thus pretty damn connected, honest and natural. Oh, and you must absolutely, unquestioningly love them. If you don't it'll show....Of course it's only taken the better part of my lifetime, but there you have it.

Then there's all the intangible stuff which I wish I could explain. For example, about 20 years ago I went to a psychic on a complete whim. I don't believe in any of that stuff, but was in a strange town and went to humor a friend. I had only just begun to start researching my Harpo show and had not really made any sort of a mark yet. The psychic knew absolutely nothing of me and was giving me a reading of all the easy stuff and I was thinking, 'yeah, right...' when he stopped and said, 'I must tell you this, but all through this reading I've noticed you have a being, or an essence with you...' "What?' 'Well, he's a few inches tall; he was sitting on your knee -- now he's on your shoulder...' 'Well, what does he look like?' And then this guy described HARPO!!!! He knew nothing of my work, my background----nothing at all. And the friend who accompanied me was a recent acquaintance who really didn't know about my Marx connection, either. But this psychic described this little blond, curly-haired silent imp who, as the guy told me, is always with me...and protects me at all times. Very odd, and I've never quite known what to make of it. I definitely do feel some sort of presence WITH me onstage, however, and usually when I'm playing the harp. Odd. At the risk of sounding like a COMPLETE nutball, it also happens when I'm playing Groucho - GROUCHO: A LIFE IN REVUE is written so that I play him from the age of 15 to 86. The last 10 minutes or so take place when he's 86 and I always feel a presence in the scene, after the actress interviewing me has left the stage and I'm alone onstage for the rest of the play. I have eulogies to Harpo and Chico and I swear, I always feel that someone (Groucho) is there right behind me. It's kind of strange to be playing Groucho at the age I actually knew him and people are sobbing in the audience and there's this odd abstract feeling of an approving SOMETHING there with me. I reiterate: I've never gone in for the spiritual or unexplainable, but I can't ignore this strange phenomenon...

To answer your other questions, Chico is the toughest for me to play because for me he had the most elusive out-of-character personality in terms of where his mind was centered; also...in spite of what you might think, and despite his love of mathematics and his canny mind for calculating a deal, he's the least cerebral out of character. Harpo had the most innate, though unschooled, intellect; we all know about Groucho's mind. Chico operated instinctually for the most part and that's just a tricky thing for me. Also, you can manufacture any sort of quality onstage; one of the most difficult, however, is personal charm. I have absolutely NO charm whatsoever and don't really care if I don't; Chico was a person fueled by, made of, and defined by his personal charm. That's a very difficult thing to pull off.

Harpo and Groucho are, for me, a delight to play. Chico is a delight but also a hell of a lot of work so the seams don't show. It's wonderful to play them all...very cathartic to be able to submerge into these wonderful characters they created and in so doing, be granted a blanket license to do all the things we'd love to do if we were allowed...

Query: In reference to Granny Schoenberg's harp, Groucho also refers to it in "Groucho and Me" and claims that Harpo had it restrung and learned to play it. In "The Marx Brothers Scrapbook" he further claims that this harp had no pedals, so Harpo could not play sharps or flats, thus severely limiting his repetoire. Since these stories don't seem to be supported anywhere else, I suspect Groucho is in error regarding this -- obviously the insturment was not that important to him. (In the "Scrapbook" he even claims that when attending screenings of their films, he would retreat to the lobby during the harp solos.)

More interesting, in reference to Les' wondering about how Harpo could have avoided calloused hands (and perhaps in terms of some of the differences between Harpo's playing at that of other harpists), is Gummo's claim, also in the "Scrapbook," that Harpo not only had to teach himself to play the harp, but also to tune it -- that he simply started with one basic note and tuned it from there, and that he wound up with a harp with far less tension on the strings than is "normal," and kept playing it that way his whole life. This might explain why so many harpists were amazed at his playing.

Love 'em all, but Groucho's and Gummo's memories on this subject aren't very credible. First, they ALL had lousy memories. HARPO SPEAKS is filled with wonderful stories; some are actually true! I've been told by family members that most of their stories were embellished or altered via personal telling through the years; Chico and Harpo always swapped stories: Chico would claim something happened to him, and yet you read the same exact story in HARPO SPEAKS in which Harpo claims it as his own. Apparently the whole tone of Harpo's tales and structure of the book are more Rowland Barber's than Harpo's; at least that's what Bill and Susan have told me in the past. They also own up to everyone not recalling things truthfully but interestingly...I've always wondered about that because Groucho's mind for details, especially as an old man, seems extraordinarily sharp....dates, places, names, etc. Amazing recall. That said:

It's impossible to mistune a harp, structurally speaking...the tension of the strings is actually part of what holds the thing together. And it would have been virtually impossible to play his solos with the stage orchestral accompaniment if he was in some other, undefined key. Harpo was far too good a musician for that, and also, he played by ear. A harp 'A' string only sounds correct tuned at 'A,' it'll buzz if tuned too far off. All harpists tune their own instruments; they must be tuned and retuned DAILY. Humidity, heat, temperature changes etc, affect the overall tune of the instrument and even if I tune my harp just before the show, I have to re-tune it during the intermission if I have a second-act solo. And trust me, when I hear Harpo playing on film, the sound I hear is correct for the string I see!

Incidentally, playing by ear was a small problem, but Bill had a large problem in the fifties. Bill did a lot to open up Harpo's playing in different styles. He even arranged some of Harpo's playing and accompaniments. When they recorded one of the albums, Bill had the accompaniment track laid down first. Then, they recorded Harpo. Harpo didn't have a strong sense of tempo, however, and just didn't play along with the pre-recorded accompaniment. In theatre, of course, the conductor would follow Harpo, not vice-versa. Bill decided to conduct his dad, but Harpo would only focus on his own hands and couldn't watch Bill. Finally, Bill had to lie down on the floor so he'd be in Harpo's eyeline and conduct in that position. They were successful at last.

Query: I haven't seen him lately, but I always thought that Rober Hegyes (Juan Luis Pedro Phillipo de Huevos Epstein from "Welcome Back Kotter") would make a good Chico.

Right on! What an amazing call! Because Bobby HAS PLAYED CHICO!!! And he was pretty damn good! In a single production of the original version of 'Groucho' at the Westwood Playhouse back in about '83, Gabe Kaplan played Groucho and Bobby Hegyes played Chico. (I was unavailable to be in it at the time.) No Harpo in the show. The critics pretty well dismissed Gabe (rightfully) and liked Bobby (rightfully.) I was the (unbilled) Groucho consultant on the production.

A year or two later he directed me in a film that was SO terrible it was never (to my knowledge) released with Cleavon Little, Chuck McCann, Carol Wayne and many others. He has (for years) been working on a screenplay for a 'missing' Marx Brothers movie in which he'd play Chico and I'd play G or H. I'd say the odds of it getting made are about nil.

Still, an amazing call on your part.

Query: Hey, if whatshername can play both girls in "The Parent Trap",. why not? It might be amusing (and not that expensive) to test this by having you do both parts of a Groucho/Chico scene, say, on a split screen sometime...

There's actually a play in which one actor plays all three brothers. It's called 'The Last of the Marx Brothers' Writers' and was produced over 20 years ago at the Mark Taper Forum in L.A. Victor Buono played the title role and an actor named Sandy McCollum played the brothers (in widely-spaced scenes, of course.) I don't know much more than that about the thing. I don't know who wrote it, and I've never heard of it being produced elsewhere, although it's certainly possible. Sandy told me about this show many years later when we worked together briefly; the fact that it's never been produced otherwise (that I know of) would make it seem as though it's probably not a great play.

Query: Did you feelings for Groucho change after you meet him? I always felt that I was a bit warped because most of the people I looked up to were dead beore I was born.

Nope, the way I felt about Groucho wasn't changed at all. After all, I knew I wasn't going to meet Rufus Firefly/Captain Spaulding/Wagstaff; I knew he was presently an 85-year-old man in failing health whose voice was shot and who had suffered heart attacks and strokes. If anything at all, however, my feelings for the brothers were deepened and cemented firmly in place because *I had now made physical contact with the legend; I had been to his house and I had shaken his hand.* But all of that will be in my eventual tale of the actual meeting. It's always meant a great deal to me in the years since to have had that opportunity, but I don't think it has changed the path my life might have taken -- it only served to enrichen my life.

I've always looked up to the dead but I think it has something to do with my constantly ending up drunk in cemetaries.

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