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This is what you might call a replacement editorial, mostly because getting any sort of answer out of Yahoo! often takes a great deal of time and patience. In this instance, we were not looking for a definitive answer of any sort. We were just asking them to confirm what they had themselves said. A week later and the newsletter definitely overdue, we're not even sure the information we requested is worth the wait--if we ever do get an answer, you can look forward to a supplemental to this newsletter. So stay tuned.What was our inquiry about? The topic concerned the Yahoo!-eGroup merged product, which eGroup users will begin seeing in the next few days. They get to go first because, as Yahoo! puts it, they currently have the more stable product. eGroups has fewer glitches. The fact that they do is what made them an attractive acquisition to Yahoo! in the first place. It's something they don't want to lose in the revamping of eGroups and Yahoo! clubs into the new Yahoo! Groups. And as soon as they are sure they have managed to convert eGroups to Yahoo! Groups sans glitches, they're coming after us.
Glitches! There are some we have come to know and recognize, familiar as the slowdown on your own home computer when you run a system back-up or a virus check. It's a nuisance, but a necessary one if you are going to have the protection you require on your pc, if you are going to enjoy new features in Yahoo!. The situation is temporary; they will go away.
And then there are those persistent glitches that don't go away. The larger clubs know some of these only too well. For example: some where around your two thousandth member, the year of your start date suddenly becomes 1969 and your founder list disappears. The only remedy Yahoo! has found so far is to offer the chief founder's profile address for contact in place of the usual club caption--at least we think Yahoo! did that.
There are other glitches, however, and some more deadly and threatening to a club's well-being. Recently, during a spat of the normal sort of glitches in December, the messages on the eGroup YahooClubs offered up numerous comments from the users from the Yahoo! side. And, I couldn't help putting in my own two cents. I wrote:
The glitch that really bothers me is when an active member of our club is suddenly deleted from membership. I am one of those people that try to maintain some individual contact with the members of my club. I send them a "welcome" letter, describing our club and features we offer that differ from other clubs in our category--the automatic letter Yahoo! sends just doesn't do the job. And, when members depart, I send a letter asking them if they have any parting advice for us and letting them know they are welcome to return. In between, of course, there is a lot of list maintenance and individual contact specific to the member.Periodically, there are one or two members who disappear from the Members list who had no intention of leaving. Most will rejoin once they are informed of the problem. Sometimes, however, no matter how carefully I word the letter, they misinterpret what I am telling them and think that I removed them. It requires some patience to respond pleasantly.
That is not the point...the question is why are they being removed in the first place? Please note, the fact that they can rejoin is indicator that they were not removed by myself or other founders in our club; administrative deletion from a club is permanent to the ID. And, I am not so naive as to believe that some of these disappearances are not mistakes on the part of members in editing their own ID list of clubs joined. Mistakes do happen, and/or it may be a test to see if I am paying attention. However, the number of these occurrences and the fact that they usually correspond to Yahoo! system edits suggests that some few such disappearances reflect an instability in the Yahoo! system.
I can live with club statistics that disappear. I can live with a slow message board or one that doesn't update for a half day. I can live with periodic notice that my club no longer exists when I am in the middle of a post. When these happen, you know something good may be coming your way and they do not affect your relationship with your members. We endure these things together. But, the glitch that removes people from the Members list does affect our relationship, is disruptive and potentially harmful and really does need to be addressed.
The reply startled me, partly because I was half expecting a denial and partly because it came as personal e-mail rather than a posting to the eGroup list. I don't think other members of the eGroup saw either my complaint or the reply to it. The pertainent reply was:
Hi Angel,[...] I think we've finally solved this bug, please let me know if you're still seeing it. Yes, this was a by-product of the corruption problems we had throughout clubs, but we made some back end tweaks to stop all of the odd bugs that were going around.
Thanks,
WarrenPlease do not construe this as an indicator that I have any sort of relationship with the chief programmer for Yahoo! Clubs. I assure you, I do not. The personal reply may have had more to do with his desire to deliberately avoid the issues I was talking about and hide the list of problems that affect Yahoo! clubs from the eGroups people. And the sad facts are that most founders probably do not know that members periodically blink off their Member lists unless the member complains and that most members probably don't know when it happens and think they somehow made an error when they do notice.
But has the problem really gone away? I continue to write departing members. Among the four founders departing over the last four weeks (four in four weeks is definitely not bad): one was hacked to smitherines (doesn't really count), one left because he didn't feel he could be active here, one was a nickname change (doesn't really count), and one was uncomfortable with our attention to detail (you can't please everyone). All four accounted for and none I can attribute to the glitch. So, maybe they have fixed it.
AngelPie_Mouse (aka clubfoundersclub)
[Co-Founder]
Over the next sixteen (16) weeks, we expect to have several chat sessions as the new Yahoo! Groups features come on-line. We're pretty sure it will not be one per week and, right now, because Yahoo! has not been forthcoming with anything approaching a time table, it is difficult to predict when they will be. They will definitely be as required and a notice of our intention to hold a chat session will be posted to the message board and sent out with at least 24-hour notice in founder mail. These will definitely be Q&A sessions as well as an opportunity to complain.Otherwise, you may expect at least one chat session on or about Friday, February 2, 2001, which is ArrylT's second favorite holiday, Ground Hog Day (I think his favorite is Valentines').
Topic: "Did the computer geek see his shadow? or Projects for Valentines."
We had only one chat session since our last reporting.
Friday, December 15th at 9:30 pm ESTAnnounced topic: "Merry Christmas!"
Members in attendence: mistybunny, AngelPie_Mouse, lynne64070 (heather), Nowaywins, amonij, sharonlower.
This chat session was our second annual Christmas party during which members stopped by to share some cyber-eggnog and some casual conversation. We talked about projects we had going on in our own clubs, about Christmas shopping, about the southern California energy crisis, and other diverse and sundry issues of little consequence. In other words, we had fun. For those who missed this get-together (and those who want to see their words immortalized), a transcript is available on our homepage at http://www.oocities.org/clubfoundersclub/chat/chat12152000-part1.html.
Other past chat session transcripts from 2000 may be accessed from http://www.oocities.org/clubfoundersclub/chat.html.
The term "thread" comes from the days of EBBs and Usenet/Newsnet. It refers to a series of posts, which may or may not be on topic but begin with the same subject heading. "Re:" on our message board can either be taken as "regarding" or "replying to," for example. Pointing to the beginning of a thread, you can sometimes gleen important bits of discussion pro and con on an issue, allowing you to make a more informed decision. We use the term a little more loosely in Yahoo! clubs, where a response can often be as much off topic as on.The main concern of this digest is to point to beginnings of threads or significant entries concerning them or important postings that you might want to visit again. We do not bring you the entire post--a complete repost would take far too much space. However, we do offer the entry number, the subject line, name of member posting, date, some overview of the content, and a list of related posts (if any) over a 30 day period (+/-) in the listing below.
Posts to the Message Board 12/01/2000 - 12/31/2000
- 2938 -- Re: Spam -- damsel_in_ddk -- 11/28/00 10:21 pm
Yahoo! Expert a cheat.
-- also see 2953 -- Re: Spam -- kate99_9 -- 12/1/00 3:11 pm
- 2951 -- Adult Club Banner Ads! -- AngelPie_Mouse -- 11/30/00 9:19 pm
468x60 banners advertising X-rated sites
-- also see 2952 -- Re: Adult Club Banner Ads! -- damsel_in_ddk -- 12/1/00 2:56 pm
-- also see 2956 -- Re: Adult Club Banner Ads! -- ineedablowjob2 -- 12/1/00 6:04 pm
-- also see 2957 -- Re: Adult Club Banner Ads! -- AngelPie_Mouse -- 12/1/00 6:18 pm
-- also see 3020 -- Adult Banner Ads Update -- clubfoundersclub -- 12/6/00 5:30 am
-- also see 3021 -- Adult Banner Ads Update 2 -- clubfoundersclub -- 12/6/00 5:31 am
-- also see 3026 -- Re: Adult Banner Ads Update 2 -- t_h_e_l_i_o_n_e_s_s -- 12/6/00 8:07 pm
- 2954 -- Re: One more month! -- ineedablowjob2 -- 12/1/00 5:43 pm
What he got for Christmas.
-- also see 2955 -- Re: One more month! -- AngelPie_Mouse -- 12/1/00 6:03 pm
-- also see 2959 -- Re: One more month!/BJ -- alska_du -- 12/1/00 8:00 pm
-- also see 2960 -- Alska_Du: Print Shop or Paint Shop Pro? -- AngelPie_Mouse -- 12/1/00 9:27 pm
Print Shop Deluxe is a product of Broderbund, a subsidiary of MattelInteractive
http://www.mattelinteractive.com/store/SubCategory.asp?CID=117
Paint Shop Pro is by Jasc. Inc., Version 7
http://www.jasc.com
-- also see 2976 -- Re: AngelPie :) -- arizona_kate -- 12/2/00 11:05 pm
List of PSP Tutorials Online http://flybynight.homestead.com
-- also see 2978 -- The Whole World Can Wait...LOL -- AngelPie_Mouse -- 12/3/00 1:54 am
What she got for Christmas http://www.oocities.org/angelpie_mouse/yahoo/12012000me.jpg
- 2970 -- Prize For Post #3000 -- ArrylT -- 12/2/00 1:11 pm
-- also see 2972 -- Re: 3K MB Post Coming Soon! -- AngelPie_Mouse -- 12/2/00 2:19 pm
- 2971 -- 200th Member -- ArrylT -- 12/2/00 1:31 pm
Policy on CFC Membership Milestones
- 2974 -- Stats -- kate99_9 -- 12/2/00 5:14 pm
Stats not updating.
-- also see 2975 -- Re: Stats -- magoo_ns -- 12/2/00 6:20 pm
How to force the update.
- 2983 -- My Yahoo Question -- damsel_in_ddk -- 12/3/00 2:50 pm
Changing the greeting name.
-- also see 2984 -- Re: My Yahoo Question -- Mistybunny -- 12/3/00 5:13 pm
goto the My Yahoo page, click on OPTIONS then the COLOR tab. At the bottom of the page the place is there for you to change your name.
- 2996 -- CHAT PLANNED - DECEMBER 15th -- Mistybunny -- 12/4/00 10:44 pm
http://www2.bluemountain.com/cards/box8663h/4xud5tm9ezsuax.html
CFC Christmas Party Chat
- 3000 -- Christmas Bookmark Project Winners! -- clubfoundersclub -- 12/5/00 7:23 am
First Place = Mistybunny (30 pts)
Second Place = Damsel_in_DDK (28 pts)
Third Place = Sharonlower (2 pts)
- 3001 -- December Newsletter Now Online -- AngelPie_Mouse -- 12/5/00 7:38 am
- *3007 -- No 19th Wedding Anniversary!!!! -- alska_du -- 12/5/00 11:39 am
Post #3000 Winner!
- 3019 -- new member, how to get that pretty back -- dream_flower -- 12/6/00 3:31 am
Club changed from usual background to blue snowflakes.
-- also see 3022 -- Re: new member, how to get that pretty b -- clubfoundersclub -- 12/6/00 5:52 am
Backgrounds, art, and the Member Club Listing (Links)
-- also see 3029 -- Are Backgrounds Back? -- sharonlower -- 12/7/00 1:44 am
-- also see 3031 -- Re: Are Backgrounds Back? -- dream_flower -- 12/7/00 5:20 am
-- also see 3032 -- Are Backgrounds Back? -- Mistybunny -- 12/7/00 8:06 am
http://www.oocities.org/clubmasterz/colour_codes.html
http://www.oocities.org/SiliconValley/Cable/1415/newsletter/v1i6-page1.html
-- also see 3040 -- Question? -- celticgreen_00 -- 12/7/00 8:21 pm
How do u make a back gound in your clubs?
-- also see 3055 -- Re: Question? -- AngelPie_Mouse -- 12/9/00 2:31 pm
- 3025 -- Christmas Song Puzzle -- sharonlower -- 12/6/00 7:32 pm
Match the song title to the acronymn of the first line.
-- also see 3041 Christmas Song Puzzle Answers -- sharonlower -- 12/7/00 8:42 pm
- 3033 -- Yahoo messenger (Re: Newest Member) -- mfhoekstra -- 12/7/00 10:42 am
Who's on line?
-- also see 3037 -- Re: Yahoo messenger (Re: Newest Member) -- Mistybunny -- 12/7/00 8:12 pm
- 3036 -- Questions re: Calendars -- capebretonlassie -- 12/7/00 7:06 pm
Changing the Calendar Section icons.
-- also see 3038 -- Re: Questions re: Calendars -- Mistybunny -- 12/7/00 8:14 pm
- 3045 -- did anyone get the email? -- damsel_in_ddk -- 12/8/00 1:17 am
Yahoo! Clubs/eGroup Merger = Yahoo! Groups
-- also see 3046 -- Re: did anyone get the email? -- AngelPie_Mouse -- 12/8/00 2:52 am
-- also see 3047 -- Re: did anyone get the email? -- AngelPie_Mouse -- 12/8/00 4:33 am
The actual letter and CFC_Experimental
- 3048 -- Warning: Possible Disruption of Service -- AngelPie_Mouse -- 12/8/00 6:16 am
Electrical service problems in southern California may affect Yahoo!
- 3054 -- Re: Are Backgrounds Back? -- AngelPie_Mouse -- 12/9/00 2:00 pm
Club logos, club featuring, backgrounds.
-- also see 3065 -- logo's -- dream_flower -- 12/11/00 11:58 am
-- also see 3076 -- Re: logo's -- AngelPie_Mouse -- 12/12/00 8:58 pm
- 3068 -- My club -- dream_flower -- 12/11/00 10:06 pm
Question: where to list club info
-- also see 3070 -- Re: My club. -- cfc_founders -- 12/12/00 12:05 am
how to edit your comment line
- 3071 -- Re: New Member Welcome -- angel_mommy2 -- 12/12/00 4:55 am
choosing co-founders
-- also see 3072 -- Re: New Member Welcome -- Mistybunny -- 12/12/00 7:37 am
-- also see 3083 -- I need help :( -- alska_du -- 12/13/00 4:41 am
- 3082 -- Christmas Trivia! sharonlower -- 12/13/00 3:08 am
-- also see 3087 -- Heres The Christmas Trivia Answers -- sharonlower -- 12/13/00 7:03 pm
- 3088 -- Founders: -- sharonlower -- 12/13/00 9:35 pm
Happily Addicted To The Web (lyric paraphrase sung to the tune of Winter Wonderland)
- 3092 -- Duplicate Founder Emails -- sharonlower -- 12/15/00 3:10 am
-- also see 3103 -- Re: Duplicate Founder Emails -- AngelPie_Mouse -- 12/16/00 9:15 pm
- 3109 -- Charges for YAHOO! ?? -- amonij -- 12/17/00 5:29 pm
rumor concerning Yahoo! charging for club use
-- also see 3110 -- Re: Charges for YAHOO! ?? -- Mistybunny -- 12/17/00 8:50 pm
-- also see 3111 -- Re: Charges for YAHOO! ?? -- AngelPie_Mouse -- 12/17/00 9:17 pm
-- also see 3112 -- Re: Charges for YAHOO! ?? -- amonij -- 12/18/00 12:09 am
- 3115 -- Hi to all -- blsrfhs -- 12/19/00 9:09 am
Inquiry: How do you send an e-greeting to all your members?
-- also see 3116 -- Re: Hi to all -- Mistybunny -- 12/19/00 9:29 am
- 3126 -- Club house? -- Mistybunny -- 12/20/00 8:57 am
What is the Club House???
-- also see 3127 -- Re: Club house? -- jroka_lle -- 12/20/00 12:11 pm
-- also see 3189 -- Re: Club house? -- AngelPie_Mouse -- 12/29/00 2:35 pm
- 3130 -- Christmas Virus and Tips -- sharonlower -- 12/21/00 1:20 am
- 3138 -- yet another glitch.... -- FreedomDeep -- 12/21/00 10:52 pm
"edit my comments" and it opened up another member's comments
- 3139 -- Re: AngelPie (And All) -- sharonlower -- 12/22/00 12:23 am
Inquiry: whats Paint Pro?
-- also see 3192 -- Re: AngelPie (And All) -- AngelPie_Mouse -- 12/29/00 3:09 pm
- 3140 -- club colors -- FreedomDeep -- 12/22/00 2:49 am
Request for assistance with colors.
-- also see 3143 -- Re: club colors -- debbiepittman -- 12/22/00 2:23 pm
Recommendation of the LadyFounders2 colors tools.
-- also see Message 3144 -- NEW Color Charts -- sharonlower -- 12/22/00 5:29 pm
Recommended links:
- http://www.oocities.org/clubmasterz/colour_codes.html
- COLORCOP: http://www.datastic.com/tools/colorcop.html#download
- Download site for a software tool for identifying colors in use.
- http://www.hypersolutions.org/rgb.html
- We highly recommend Doug Johnson's charts, which present non-dithering colors.
- 3149 -- Full Of Questions! -- slaskatratt -- 12/23/00 6:49 pm
backgrounds and changing club categories
-- also see 3150 -- Re: Full Of Questions! -- friendotv -- 12/23/00 9:50 pm
- 3168 -- Re: WOW!! -- butterfly_chick_44 -- 12/26/00 10:38 pm
Recruiting and Logos -- also see 3170 -- Re: WOW!! -- Mistybunny -- 12/26/00 10:45 pm
-- also see 3181 -- Re: WOW!! -- friendotv -- 12/27/00 11:48 am
http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/a1logos -- also see 3183 -- Re: WOW!! -- AngelPie_Mouse -- 12/27/00 1:35 pm
-- also see 3188 -- Apology to Members! -- AngelPie_Mouse -- 12/29/00 2:12 pm
Email address correction for featuring requests.
- 3169 -- eGroups/Yahoo merge FAQ -- NOWAYWINS -- 12/26/00 10:42 pm
http://www.egroups.com/group/CFC_EXPERIMENTAL
-- also see 3173 -- Re: eGroups/Yahoo merge FAQ -- Mistybunny -- 12/26/00 11:45 pm
more links to help with the merger:-- also see 3174 -- More on eGroup/Yahoo! Merger -- Mistybunny -- 12/27/00 12:04 am
- http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/info
- http://www.egroups.com/local/news.html
- http://www.egroups.com/message/eGroups-Member-News/34
New Yahoo! Logo and hint of things to come: http://add.yahoo.com/fast/help/us/egroups/cgi_feedback
-- also see 3177 -- Re: eGroups/Yahoo merge FAQ -- NOWAYWINS -- 12/27/00 1:50 am
http://www.egroups.com/group/yahooclubs We represent you, but if you would like to ask for yourself use this URL.
-- also see 3180 -- questions about the merge -- NOWAYWINS -- 12/27/00 2:22 am
the best place to find answers to your questions is at http://www.wins.ch/valerie/yahooclubs/index2.html
- 3172 -- DEC 27 - HAPPY BIRTHDAY ARRYLT -- Mistybunny -- 12/26/00 10:51 pm
Chief Founder of CFC celebrates another year! Yeah!
- 3179 -- changing category of your club -- NOWAYWINS -- 12/27/00 2:15 am
you can find the answer on how to change the category of your club by clicking on http://www.oocities.org/clubfoundersclub/faqs.html#categories
- 3194 -- deleting links -- Lilla_19 -- 12/30/00 5:21 am
Important URLs:
MattelInteractive
Makers of Print Shop Deluxe is a product of Broderbund [http://www.mattelinteractive.com/store/SubCategory.asp?CID=117]
Jasc. Inc.
Makers of Paint Shop Pro, Version 7 (PSP) [http://www.jasc.com]
PSP Tutorials Online
A site listing tutorial offerings. [http://flybynight.homestead.com]
clubs-abuse@yahoo-inc.com
To report harrassment and abuse in clubs.
Yahoo! Club Founders' Club Webring
http://www.oocities.org/clubfoundersclub/webring.html
http://www.egroups.com/group/CFC_EXPERIMENTAL
eGroup Test Club for CFC members.
cfc_founders@yahoo.com
E-mail address for the founders of Yahoo! Club Founders' Club
Yahoo! Clubs-eGroups Merger
Summary of questions and answers The Official Club. [http://www.wins.ch/valerie/yahooclubs]
Help Wanted: We're looking for a noble soul who will take the time and trouble to locate the beginning of threads of discussion on a continuing basis over a thirty day period and record them and then send the report our way--sort of a message board reporter. If you would like to do this job, if you're already doing it for yourself and are willing to share, please contact AngelPie_Mouse@Yahoo.Com. We'll give you the by-line to this regular feature of the newsletter.
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