15		CRAIG HACKER
16	after having been duly sworn to tell the truth, the whole
17	truth, and nothing but the truth testified as follows:
18		DIRECT EXAMATION
19	BY MR. CORGAN:
20	Q	State your name, please, sir.
21	A	My name is Craig Hacker.
22	Q	Mr. Hacker, where do you live?
23	A	I live at XXXX Lincoln Road.
24	Q	How long have you lived there?
25	A	Since April of '86.
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1	Q	Would you tell us, Mr. Hacker, what your family
2	consists of?
3	A	I have a wife and three small children, Chris,
4	Darren, and Lisa.
5	Q	Do you know the defendant in this case, Steven Allen?
6	A	Yes, I do.
7	Q	How are you acquainted with him?
8	A	I at one time had worked for Phillips Petroleum
9	Company, and Steve was an accountant as well as I.
10	And our paths had infrequently crossed at work,
11	even though we didn't work in the same department. And I
12 	so knew Steve as a neighbor in our neighborhood.
13	Q	Where does Mr. Allen live in relation to your home?
14	A	He lives across the street and two houses to the
15	north?
16	Q	Do you know what street his house would face?
17	A	His house faces Jefferson.
18	Q	Let me call your attention to the chart that's to
19	your left.
20	Would you look at that for a second and tell me
21	if that appears to be a representative drawing of the
22	houses in the neighborhood?
23	A	Yes, it is.
24	Q	And do you see your home there?
25	A	Yes, I do.
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1	Q	And where is that? Would you point to that?
2	A	It's right here.
3	A	And would that be an accurate representation of where
4	your home is?
5	A	Yes.
6	Q	Now, Mr. Hacker, the person you know as Steve Allen,
7	do you see that person iii the courtroom today?
8 	A	Yes, I do.
9	Q	Where is he?
10	A	Sitting right over here.
11	Q	How is he dressed?
12	A	Gray suit, tie, white shirt.
13	Q	Now, Mr. Hacker, let me call your attention to the
14	evening of June the 11th of 1990. Do you recall what you
15	were doing that evening?
16 	A	Yes. My wife and I both were out mowing our yard.
17	Q	And can you tell us where you were respectively and
18	who was doing what?
19	A	Okay. I was in the backyard trimming a large hedge
20	that we have that goes around our backyard.
21	And my wife was on the side of the house on the
22	riding mower doing the mowing, and I was trimming.
23	Q	Now, what time of day was this?
24	A	I would estimate it to be sometime around I would
25	guess 8:20 in the evening.
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1	Q	And how long did you remain outside that evening?
2	A	My wife had gone in to take care of the kids, and I
3	had continued to do a little trimming.
4		I probably came in, I would say, roughly quarter
5	till 9:00, something like that.
6	Q	And what did you do after that?
7	A	Well, I cleaned up and started to just take care of
8	the kids, as best I remember, and had started giving my
9	youngest daughter her bottle for the evening.
10	Q	Now, when you came in, was it light or dark?
11	A	It was probably right at dark. I'm sure with the --
12	trying to finish up on the lawn or whatever, I'm sure
13	because of darkness, I would have had to quit.
14		So I would have come in probably right then when
15	it actually got dark.
16	Q	And what time did it -- would you say it got dark
17	during June?
18	A	Oh, I would guess probably quarter till 9:00 maybe,
19	something like that.
20	Q	While you were out that evening, did you have
21	occasion to see the defendant?
22	A	Yes, I did.
23	Q	Tell us the facts and circumstances surrounding that.
24	A	Well, as I said, I was in the backyard doing some
25 	trimming around our hedge; and I saw my wife on the riding
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1	mower.
2	And I saw her hand raised as she was waving to
3	somebody that was driving on the street.
4		And I just peered around the hedge and could see
5	it was Steve that was driving the car heading north on
6	Jefferson.
7	Q	Did you see where he went from that?
8	A	No, I didn't.
9	Q	And what time would you say that you saw him there?
10	A	I would say this would have probably been shortly
11	after 8:00, 8:15, maybe 8:20.
12	Q	Now, how certain are you as to that time?
13	A	Not real certain.
14	Q	Did you have an occasion to talk with any law
15	 enforcement shortly after June 11th and relate your
16	 activities and observations of the evening at that time?
17	A	Yes, I did.
18	Q	And do you recall who you spoke with?
19	A	No, I really don't.
20	Q	Now, did at that time, were you questioned in regard
21	to times and your observations?
22	A	Yes.
23	Q	And did you give law enforcement information at that
24	time in regard to times?
25	 A	Yes, I did.
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1	Q	And would your recollection and memory as to times
2	have been better then than it is now?
3	A	Yes.
4	Q	And if you told law enforcement at that time that you
5	observed or saw the defendant somewhere in the
6	neighborhood of 9:00 to 9:15 that night, would that be
7	more accurate than what you're telling us today?
8	A	Yes.
9	Q	And why would that be?
10	A	Well, I think at the time, as I said, through the
11	course of being interviewed by the police officer,
12	whatever things were a lot fresher in my mind than they
13	are right now.
14 		And I would just say that time would probably be
15	a little bit more approximate.
16	Q	Did you see the defendant other than that one time?
17	A	No, I did not.
18	Q	What did you do after you went in?
19	A	Well, as I recall, I just had started to help the
20	kids get cleaned up for the evening.
21		 And the best I remember, as I was sitting down
22	giving my youngest daughter her bottle shortly after ten
23	o'clock, I was watching the news.
24		And that's when I noticed some of the activity
25	 going on over at the -- over on Lincoln Place.
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1	Q	How did you notice that?
2	A	Well, from the -- where our couch is situated in our
3	family room, I can look out our back patio and pretty much
4	see that street.
5		And I did see a -- what looked to be a patrol
6	car that had his lights on and had stopped there on
7	Lincoln Place right across from the Allen driveway.
8	Q	Do you have a dog?
9	A	Yes, I do -- or I did have at the time.
10	Q	And where did that dog stay?
11	A	He was right in our backyard. We have a pen in our
12	backyard which he had stayed in.
13	Q	During the time period that you were out that
14	evening, did you notice anything unusual about your dog or
15	its activities?
16	A	No.
17	Q	Did it bark or seem to be upset about anything?
18	A	No.
19	Q	What about after you went in?
20	A	No.
21	Q	What about when the various emergency vehicles and
22	those type things arrived?
23	A	I don't recall him barking at all.
24		MR. CORGAN: I believe that's all.
25	----------------------------------------------
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1		CROSS-EXAMINATION
2	BY MR. CARLSON:
3	Q	Mr. Hacker, your home is located right here on the
4	corner; is that correct?
5	A	Right. Right here.
6	Q	And that's the intersection of Lincoln and Jefferson?
7	A	That's correct.
8	Q	Sir, do you know where Sonic is on the west side of
9	town?
10	A	Pardon me?
11	Q	Do you know where the Sonic is on the west side of
12	Bartlesville?
13	A	Yes, I do.
14	Q	And do you know approximately how far it is from the
15	intersection of Lincoln Road and Jefferson over to the
16	Sonic?
17		MR. CORGAN: Your Honor, we're going to
18	object as being beyond the scope of direct examination.
19		MR. CARLSON: Your Honor, we're going into
20	the time.
21		THE COURT: You may answer.
22	Q (By Mr. Carlson) Do you know how far it is from
23	there over to the Sonic?
24	A	I would estimate it to be probably six to seven
25	Miles
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1	Q	All right. Now, if -- now, you said that you saw
2	Steve Allen when counsel asked you about the statement
3	that you gave that you thought your statement was 9:15.
4	Was that correct?
5	A	Yes, uh-huh, right around that time.
6	Q	Would you --
7	A	Excuse me. The time that I saw Steve?
8	Q	At the intersection, correct.
9	A	The time that I saw him at the intersection was
10	earlier than that. I think it was around, a little after
11	8:00 was when we actually -- I saw him because I was out
12	in the yard mowing at that time.
13	Q	A little after 8:00; is that correct?
14	A	Yes.
15	Q	And you said something about a 9:15 time? What was
16	the 9:15 time.
17	A	Well, it must have been around 8:15 because I was out
18	mowing at the time. I know at -- no, excuse me. That is
19	right. Nine-fifteen would have been -- it would have been
20	still dark. I would have been out mowing at that time.
21	That's correct.
22	Q	So 9:15 then would have been when you think you saw
23	Steve timewise.
24	A	Yes, yes, that's correct
25	Q	Would you agree with me, Mr. Hacker, that if there
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1	were a Sonic ticket that showed that Steve made a purchase
2	at 9:13 at the Sonic on the west side of town that in all
3	probability, you're mistaken about the time?
4 	A	That could very well be true.
5		MR. CARLSON: That's all we have, Your
6	Honor. Thank you, Mr. Hacker.
7		THE COURT:' Thank you, sir. You may step
8	down.
9 		MR. CORGAN: Just one second.
10	 --------------------------------------------------
11		REDIRECT EXAMINATION
12	BY MR. CORGAN:
13	Q	You're not telling us it was exactly 9:15, are you,
14	Mr. Hacker?
15	A	No, I'm not. I'm not exactly sure of the times.
16	Q	What's the earliest it could have been?
17	A	The earliest I could have been what?
18	Q	You could have seen the defendant.
19	A	Well, we were out in the yard, you know, most of the
20	evening mowing.
21		So I would say it could have been anytime
22	from -- anywhere from probably 8:15 to 9:15. I don't know
23	the exact times.
24	Q	Let me hand you, sir -- give you an opportunity to
25	look at this.
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1	I'm not going to ask you to read that out loud,
2	but would you look at that.
3		And after you've had an opportunity to look at
4	that, tell me what that appears to be.
5	A	It appears to be a recap of the evening.
6	Q	And would that be a copy of an interview that you
7	gave to the Oklahoma State Bureau of Investigation?
8	A	Yes.
9	Q	And would that appear to be an accurate rendition of
10	what you told them on that particular day?
11	A	Yes.
12	Q	And in that regard, would your memory as to times
13	have been fresher than as opposed to today?
14	A	Yes.
15	Q	And having looked at that, does that refresh your
16	memory as to times that you were able to give law
17	enforcement at that time?
18	A	Yes, it would.
19	Q	Does it reflect on the report there when you were
20	interviewed? Say somewhere there at the bottom?
21	A	No. I don't really see a time on here.
22	Q	Well, what did you tell the OSBI in regard to times?
23		MR. CARLSON: Your Honor, we would object.
24	It's improper redirect. Also, it's not this witness'
25	statement that he's looking at. It's a memo by someone
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1	from the OSBI.
2	But it's basically the same thing that we asked
3	to do with Theresa Miller was go over the statement, go
4	over the memo.
5		THE COURT: Rephrase your question.
6	Q (By Mr. Corgan) Having had an opportunity to look
7	at that, is your memory refreshed as to times?
8	A	Yes.
9	Q	And would you tell us then in regard to the times
10	your observations?
11		MR. CARLSON: Again, Your Honor, we're
12	going to object. It's improper foundation laid.
13		THE COURT: You may answer.
14	Q (By Mr. Corgan) You may answer the question.
15	A	I'm sorry. Would you repeat the question?
16	Q	Okay. What do you recall now having refreshed your
17	memory as to observations you made as to times?
18	A	Yes, it does.
19	Q	And what is that?
20	A	Okay. It's -- looking here, closer to 8:00 to 9:15
21	is roughly the times that I was out in the yard there.
22	Q	Does it refresh your memory as to when you went in?
23	A	Yes, it does.
24	Q	And what was that?
25	A	It looks like it's around 9:30.
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1		MR. CORGAN: I believe that's all.
2	----------------------------------
3		RECROSS-EXAMINATION
4	BY MR. CARLSON:
5	Q	Mr. Hacker, according to the memo, you were out in
6	your yard as late as 9:40, were you not, also?
7	A	Yes, that's correct.
8	Q	So it could have even been as late as 9:40 then.
9	A	That's correct.
10		MR. CARLSON: That's all we have, Your
11	Honor.
12		MR. CORGAN: That's all.
13		THE COURT: Thank you, sir. You may step
14	down. Next witness.
15		MR. CORGAN: We would call Barbara Larsen.
16	 ----------------------------------------------------

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