The Summer 2000 Feature Interview The first of an installment of features is an interview with Kel, one of the founders of the Tasty Joy Recording Company© and a member of the rock band sugarCity. It seems that the phrase "that's tasty!" has taken over in recent months. We wanted to get the lowdown on just what's happening at Tasty Joy and to get to know Kel a bit better. We sat down together for a talk in early June. Q: It seems like it wasn't that long ago that I had never heard of the Tasty Joy Recording Company© but in the past few months there have been new bands signing on, new offices across the country, and a new web site. While many people are aware of recent events, not many know about the early history of Tasty Joy. How did the recording company get its start? Kel: Tasty Joy started with a simple idea. If we, that is sugarCity, were to form a recording company, we should have more control over the creative process by eliminating the need for others to record us. Ven and I thought it sounded pretty simple at least. Then the thing just snowballed. In a very short time we had maybe ten bands on board. There was also a need for something to propel my band, sugarCity, forward at a faster rate. The thought Ven and I shared was that if we had a recording company then maybe we'd feel compelled to take the time to get something recorded. Q: Have you completed much recording since forming the company? Kel: Not really. Getting the company established and then moving the headquarters has recently been the top priority though there are plans to get back into the studio very soon. Q: What is involved in starting something like a recording company? Kel: Getting the company organized has been a lot of work. You need a name, a logo, a web site, recording equipment. Those things don't just precipitate out of thin air. Initially, we weren't concerned about signing other bands. Our goal has never been to be big -- only to be productive. Also, we never really thought about this as a money making venture, which is a good thing since we've never made any money. When other bands became interested in what we were working on, it just sort of all came together. We don't really think of this as a business and the other bands entered in more as collaborators than clients. From that perspective we're not really a traditional recording company. I don't know what is involved in starting a traditional recording company. Q: But selling music is a business, right? You have to think of this as a business on some level don't you? Kel: That's the thing. We are not really in the business of selling music. We don't sell anything. Our business is making music. We don't really care if people like our music or not. We hope people will like what we do but this venture, at least for me, was more selfish. I didn't think "I could make people happy by selling them my music." I thought "it would be easier to make music if there were more people around." I am not without limits. I've never been a great musician, honestly. If at some point we think we need to market our music, or if we believe there is a market we need to reach, we might have to reorganize. Right now though, if a Tasty Joy band has an opportunity to break into the mainstream and a big company offers big money to sign them, the band will have to weigh it out. More money often means less control. Tasty Joy would support their decision either way. That's not very businesslike, is it? Q: So what about the T-shirts you display as "tasty stuff"? Business, right? And the sampler? Kel: Aren't those shirts cute? Those are ideas for shirts but we haven't actually made any of them yet. I can't say I long to get into the fashion biz. The sampler has been delayed so many times now. We might have to change the year on it to 2001. So right now, it's not business. Just ideas. Q: Okay, so the Tasty Joy Recording Company© is really the Tasty Joy Recording Collective? Kel: Yea, I suppose. But it was designed to grow. When we act more like a company, well, we'll already be a company. At the moment the three offices are really just our centers of gravity. Q: I think I understand what The Bee Language Hypothesis is now. Could you talk about The Bee Language Hypothesis a bit? Just to make sure I am correct, is it the actualization of the collective performing as a collective? Kel: That's exactly what it is. A number of people have told me that this makes no sense but actually, it's been done before though maybe for different reasons. I can't speak about intent on the part of other bands. Think of bands in the 80s like USA for Africa, Band Aid, This Mortal Coil. They are bands made up of people from other bands. Maybe USA for Africa and Band Aid were issue oriented, one-time deals aimed at making money -- The Bee Language Hypothesis doesn't share those qualities. And it was never an "all-star" band. Q: How does The Bee Language Hypothesis function? Kel: First, I should tell you how it started. There was a point in time where sugarCity wasn't really doing anything and I hadn't put The Busy Rushes together yet. It was hard finding other people to commit to a band outside of their full time bands and I knew I wanted to return to sugarCity after a short time. What I suggested was a sort of revolving door band where people could come and go depending on what was going on elsewhere in their other bands. As The Bee Language Hypothesis we briefly performed a number of sugarCity songs. I had the idea to put on a show billed as "The Bee Language Hypothesis performing as sugarCity." And it made sense not to bill ourselves as sugarCity since not all the members of sugarCity were performing, you know, just some sugarCity people, some sugarCity material, and some other players. Since then The Bee Language Hypothesis has also performed as The Trumpet Pitchers. Any time Tasty Joy artists come together outside their own bands, we call it The Bee Language Hypothesis. At least so far we do. Q: Tell me a little about sugarCity and The Busy Rushes. Kel: SugarCity has been a project of mine for a long time. Ven and I started sugarCity way back when we shared an apartment in Chicago. Then Ven started up The Trumpet Pitchers which I've helped out with at times. But back to sugarCity. During the periods when it isn't functioning as a band, it remains a concept for a band and an idea for a sound. As a band it is my outlet for a harder pop sound. Really, I guess, there is nothing that hard about it. I guess I just use a lot of distortion on the guitar when I'm working with sugarCity and I have a cleaner, more jangly sound when I work with The Busy Rushes. The same material can really be performed by either band. I just arrange the material differently if it is picked up by the other band. Two different ways to say the same thing. It also gives me two distinct tonal palettes to work with when I compose. I find that by imposing this artificial limit on myself I am forced to develop solutions I might not otherwise explore. The flip side is, I can take the same idea to the other band and work out the alternate solution. Q: Are you working on new material with any of these bands right now? Kel: Yes but nothing is going quickly at the moment. SugarCity added some new members recently so we are still in the getting-used-to-each-other phase. Not being a business, we can do such things and take our time. I have to say that I am really excited about the possibilities created by the new players. I'm hesitant to say too much about the new members just yet though. I don't want them to read this and get the impression that I have specific plans for them. We really function as a band. This isn't my solo project with back ups. I want them to find their own voices and reinvent the band. But at the moment what I see is potential. I'm a little uncomfortable talking about it just for that reason. I'd rather talk about actuality than potentiality. Just give us some time. The Busy Rushes spent some time in the studio but we put that on hold while Ven upgrades the studio. His computer just blew up or something so the studio is temporarily out of order. Q: How do you approach the writing process in sugarCity and The Busy Rushes? Kel: I've only been responsible on the music side of things, not the lyrics. I come up with a progression or a riff. I take that to the band and they yea or nea the idea. If they like it we develop it as a band. With new members that dynamic could change. I'm eager to find out how. This process isn't necessary for me, it's only been the most productive course so far. Q: What do you like best about being in the music scene? Kel: I hardly feel like I'm a part of any scene. Getting together with the band is really just getting together with my friends. The only difference is that we don't just hang out together. We often have a lot of work to do. But I have little interest in the scene. It seems like when your main interest is being in a scene, then it's just about being seen. Having the right clothes or the right friends. I'm just not into that. And since I don't think I'm am a part of any scene, I can't say there's anything I like best about it. Q: I was going to ask... Kel: ...what I like worst about being in the scene? Aside from what I said before about not being in a scene, I guess I'm not into the people who will say "hey let's start a band" when what they really mean is "hey, let's do lunch." People really do this! Or, after a band plays, watching people try to convince a band member that they need, say, a keyboardist or something. It's one thing if you meet someone at a show who seems interested and talented. We are always open to new ideas and new voices. It's another thing to deal with people who think it would look cool to be in your band. Or the converse, people who badmouth your band because they think you are not cool enough or artistic enough and they haven't even listened to the music. What they've noticed is that you shop at Target rather than the Gap. What's the point of that? I don't let it stop me from talking to people though. You can't judge a person by what they wear. And some people just look good in clothes and are generally blessed by nature. I won't hold it against them. Q: Are you referring to a specific person, by chance? Kel: No, I mean, if that were one person that I described, he'd be more a cartoon than a person. The person I am referring to wasn't so blessed by nature. (laughs) Just kidding. When I was in my late teens and early twenties, being cool was important to me. Looking back, I was kind of dorky and really superficial. It's a phase a lot of kids go through and in a kid, you should expect it. In an adult, it's a bit harder to take. I want to say "get over yourself" when I see it in an adult. This isn't about someone not liking me. Some people just aren't meant to get along and that's fine. Q: I've heard you described as pompous and as the nicest guy anyone could meet. Which do you think is closer to the truth? Kel: It isn't something I think about. There are people that I know and meet that don't think of me as Kel from sugarCity and the whole rock-n-roll thing plays no part in our interaction. Most of the time I'm just an everyday guy who leads an everyday life that is really more mundane than anything else. It's kind of how I like things to be. But there is sort of a persona necessary to put a performance together. Think about it. It's totally unnatural. It's not a dialogue, it's a monologue. The audience is down there on the floor and we are up here on stage. There is a kind of distance that that creates. Now, we try to bring the audience in, make them feel involved but there is an inherent division between the band and the audience. The stage persona does sometimes extend beyond the stage like, for instance, right now. This is unnatural too. You are talking to me because I am Kel from sugarCity and you prepared notes or questions or something that you keep looking at on that paper and you are tape recording me. That's kind of weird. And you ask me things that include my opinions so I pronounce my opinions. I guess that could be seen as pompous. Under different circumstances I imagine I'd seem less pompous. I'd hesitate to say I'd seem more like the nicest guy in the world though. I'm definitely not that. But I'm generally pretty easy going. At least I think so. Q: Do you do a lot of drugs, you know, as part of the rock-n-roll life? Kel: No, none at all. Unless you count caffeine. I have a cup of coffee every morning, but just one. Drugs cost money. I'd rather get a new guitar than pour money into drugs. And besides, I figure I can be pretty silly without drugs. I can also be uptight enough at times that I just might be a good candidate for a really bad trip. I never even experimented. I don't have strong feelings about others doing drugs, as long as they don't put themselves in a position where they hurt others. You know, don't drink and drive. I suspect my life is not very rock-n-roll. I'm not sure you can really be productive and be on drugs. It's part of the mythology of rock-n-roll that drugs improve creativity but it's a myth I never bought into. Q: Who did you grow up listening to? Who were your influences? Kel: I grew up with AM pop radio in the 70s because that's what my parents listened to. They later went through a country music phase which I luckily missed out on. Not to disparage country music. Had they listened to Johnny Cash I might have been interested. I think they preferred the "achy breaky" kind of stuff though. Is that new country? Young country? Whatever. Anyway, it wasn't really until the mid 1980s that I started paying attention to what I listened to. I was introduced to Bowie, The Smiths, Prince, R.E.M., Bauhaus, and Gang of Four. Mostly alternative rock stuff. Now I'm pretty interested in the indie pop thing, of Montreal, Olivia Tremor Control, and some stuff I guess isn't indie anymore like The Flaming Lips and Stereolab. I'd say all of these are influences but I don't know that they have had a great effect on my mode of playing guitar. Maybe had I taken lessons or something I'd have been able to build on what I listened to. My style has been defined more by the limits of my ability than by other significantly talented artists. At least I think so. Q: Well, before we wrap this up, tell me what is your favorite thing? Kel: That would have to be sleeping in late. Q: Come on, you can do better than that. Kel: That's as good as you are going to get from me.
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